Anti gun consequences of Paris attack

[old lady new shooter]

In the Czech Republic, only firearms are regulated (shall issue concealed carry). Basically anything else is legal to carry (outside of political demonstrations where it is no-weapons allowed).

So you could carry any kind of knife you wanted to? For example a switchblade?

 

[old lady new shooter]

That is called "the monkey fist". Quite popular in the Czech Republic in past couple of years.

Google images shows this as totschlager as first search:


And then there are a couple of pics of collapsible batons. Which makes me confused as to what is defined as a Totschlager under the law. All the while I start to believe it is another shakedown opportunity either way.

"Monkey fist", that was the name I couldn't remember, thank you.

The thing in the photo is identified as a telescoping beating stick. (I guess baton.) So what would you call it in English and how does it work? In contrast to the monkey fist, this is not intuitive to me.

 

[RoscoeBryant]

Snejdarek, I can help you out here

The Cops are right two times and wrong to times:
Knives of any kind are legal to own and to carry how and wherever you wish. If you want, you can carry a Katana around. Any kind of "rambo knife" is also legal.
The only exceptions are "hidden" blades (looking like another object) such as sword-canes which are forbidden, and you also can not carry during a political demonstration etc.

A "Totschläger" is a baton/stick(?) with an extra weight on the "hitting end" like the one you posted. As long as a collapsible baton does not have that weight, it is considered a "Schlagstock" and therefore legal.

Dashcams are forbidden by strict interpretation of the law (you may not "systematically tape" in public), but there is no fine the police can give you on scence, they very very rarely forward it to the courts and anything you tape on your dashcam can be used in court if necessary. So all in all the typical silly solution.

As for the Vignette - you are right, you should have bought it at the last gas station in Czech Republic (I belive, there are supposed to be signs on the highways reminding you), however it is idiotic of the Police to fine you right after the border for that. Our police sadly is notorious for things like that, they really like to cash out tourists especially from Germany and the Netherlands (as there are so many of them passing through on their way to Italy) with that tactic.

 

[Snejdarek]

So you could carry any kind of knife you wanted to? For example a switchblade?

Yes, any type. Or a sword. Or a tactical Tomahawk. There is a part of the country where older men traditionally use these axes as walking sticks (not so common nowadays, but also not really rare):



Sometime I see people who do HEMA (Historical European Martial Arts) open carrying their swords in Prague subway. Which is kind of weird considering that the guys that are into airsoft must have their toy guns concealed, so they usually have them wrapped in Palestine scarf. So you may see on the same train a guy with a large sharp sword OCing and a guy with airsoft rifle having it wrapped in cloth.

 

[Snejdarek]

Snejdarek, I can help you out here

The Cops are right two times and wrong to times:
Knives of any kind are legal to own and to carry how and wherever you wish. If you want, you can carry a Katana around. Any kind of "rambo knife" is also legal.
The only exceptions are "hidden" blades (looking like another object) such as sword-canes which are forbidden, and you also can not carry during a political demonstration etc.

A "Totschläger" is a baton/stick(?) with an extra weight on the "hitting end" like the one you posted. As long as a collapsible baton does not have that weight, it is considered a "Schlagstock" and therefore legal.

Dashcams are forbidden by strict interpretation of the law (you may not "systematically tape" in public), but there is no fine the police can give you on scence, they very very rarely forward it to the courts and anything you tape on your dashcam can be used in court if necessary. So all in all the typical silly solution.

As for the Vignette - you are right, you should have bought it at the last gas station in Czech Republic (I belive, there are supposed to be signs on the highways reminding you), however it is idiotic of the Police to fine you right after the border for that. Our police sadly is notorious for things like that, they really like to cash out tourists especially from Germany and the Netherlands (as there are so many of them passing through on their way to Italy) with that tactic.

Thanks a lot Roscoebryant. I plan to stay here for a couple of days, then Italy, Switzerland and back to CR through Germany. Any recommendation for a shooting range around Innsbruck?

 

[Snejdarek]

German police changes tactics in order to appease politician who was displeased with the officers shooting an ISIS attacker that used ax against people commuting with a local train:

https://youtu.be/tl0Jq8sUEMU

 

[old lady new shooter]

German police changes tactics in order to appease politician who was displeased with the officers shooting an ISIS attacker that used ax against people commuting with a local train:

https://youtu.be/tl0Jq8sUEMU

Haha, that is classic!

 

[RoscoeBryant]

Thanks a lot Roscoebryant. I plan to stay here for a couple of days, then Italy, Switzerland and back to CR through Germany. Any recommendation for a shooting range around Innsbruck?

There is one shooting range people living in Innsbruck drive to - but as I have heard, there my be some sillyness going on (i.e. mostly used by old-school hunters, so no "rapid" fire, no unscoped rifles etc.). I have never visited the range mayself - just things I have heard. I also do not know if you can rent guns there, you might want to give them a call first. It is called "Landeshauptschiesstand Innsbruck", adress and opening hours can be found here: http://ihg-innsbruck.at/pages/home/oeffnungszeiten-sommer.php . All the good ranges in Austria sadly are at least a two to three hour drive away from Innsbruck.

Regarding the video - wonderful response by the police to the green party delegate who apparently thinks, the police should play Old Shatterhand and only try to shoot an axe-wielding carzy person in the legs (if shoot at all).

 

[Bohemus]

On a lighter note:
We got into polandball

 

[Snejdarek]

Idiots stage "ISIS theater" in Prague center, tourists run for their lives, several light injuries.

http://video.idnes.cz/?c=A160821_160228_krimi_bse&idVideo=V160821_174727_zpravodaj_nav

https://www.facebook.com/parlamentnilisty.cz/videos/1207821212596102/

 

[Vern Humphrey]

Too bad the audience didn't respond by shooting them.

 

[Snejdarek]

New York Times had interesting article on this http://www.nytimes.com/2016/08/23/world/europe/prague-fake-isis-attack.html?_r=0 :

Aaron Gunsberger, who owns a kosher restaurant in the Jewish quarter, grabbed his gun and ran to the square, fearful that an attack was taking place.

“When I figured out what was happening, I told some puzzled American tourists that this was just our local clown, but that I didn’t think it was funny,” he said. “If they had shown up like this in front of my restaurant, I’d be in jail now because I would have shot them.”

Gun laws in the Czech Republic are generally less restrictive than in most other parts of Europe, and Josefov — whose synagogues and cemetery survived World War II because the Nazi occupiers intended for the quarter to become a museum of the extinct Jewish race — is, like many Jewish neighborhoods in Europe, carefully guarded.

Instead of writing out right that the Czech Republic is shall issue country that has had higher concealed carry rate than US up to about 2008, they somehow put together an armed civilian with observation that "many Jewish neighborhoods in Europe are carefully guarded."

Is it so hard for them to admit that a Czech citizen has more freedom as regards firearms and possible effective self defense than a New Yorker?

 

[barnbwt]

The old "Guns for Jews, but not for thee (or really even other Jews going forward including this one)" line? Yeah, that was kind of weird, just the reporter reaching for an explanation to why a civilian could possibly, ever in their wildest dreams, take measures toward their own preservation by carrying a firearm, let alone rush toward potential conflict seeking to resolve it themselves.

Sort of like "So and so was an ex-marine (janitor)" whenever someone defends themselves and happens to have some sort of service history. Usually it doesn't have much to do with the facts of the story at all (as opposed to say, that British article a while back about a long-retired octogenarian professional boxer beating --to death, with his bare hands-- a young, fit hoodlum who broke into the "wrong rec-room")

TCB

 

[Snejdarek]

The old "Guns for Jews, but not for thee (or really even other Jews going forward including this one)" line? Yeah, that was kind of weird, just the reporter reaching for an explanation to why a civilian could possibly, ever in their wildest dreams, take measures toward their own preservation by carrying a firearm, let alone rush toward potential conflict seeking to resolve it themselves.

Sort of like "So and so was an ex-marine (janitor)" whenever someone defends themselves and happens to have some sort of service history. Usually it doesn't have much to do with the facts of the story at all (as opposed to say, that British article a while back about a long-retired octogenarian professional boxer beating --to death, with his bare hands-- a young, fit hoodlum who broke into the "wrong rec-room")

TCB

The really interesting thing is that actually several CCers who were at and around the square at the time came forward telling the papers that the situation may have ended with the idiots being really shot. I always wondered how many CCers would actually be there in situation like this in the Czech Republic. Not may few years ago I guess (not many actually carried, despite large number of licenses), quite a few nowadays.

Thankfully from pistol shooting distance it was obvious that it is just a bunch of idiots (with several cops around). Things seemed very real from further away, both for Mr Gunsberger as well as some other CCers.

Also the article says that they were firing "BB guns". Well there would be no commotion if they fired BB guns. Although true that some had BB guns, some were actually firing blanks - which was the main reason for the widespread panic.

(those closeby were cheering and taking pictures/being aggressive in case of Arabic tourists, those further ran for their lives, which led the cops to stop the "theatre")

 

[barnbwt]

So that's why we never hear about the terrorists who get wasted by CCers --it's like a feeding frenzy, and there's nothing left to report to the papers but red mist

 

[Bohemus]

Also the article says that they were firing "BB guns". Well there would be no commotion if they fired BB guns. Although true that some had BB guns, some were actually firing blanks - which was the main reason for the widespread panic.

(those closeby were cheering and taking pictures/being aggressive in case of Arabic tourists, those further ran for their lives, which led the cops to stop the "theatre")

Chaces of Konvička being hit by CCWer were ZERO because noone within range of handgun was panicking - it was rather obvious that its all staged especially with all those organizators and cops around.
The panic was limited to just a few people - real Idiots.

 

[Snejdarek]

Chaces of Konvička being hit by CCWer were ZERO because noone within range of handgun was panicking - it was rather obvious that its all staged especially with all those organizators and cops around.
The panic was limited to just a few people - real Idiots.

What is idiotic about running away from automatic gunfire in a major European city in 2016?

Few? At least 50 in this one single restaurant. There are at least two dozen other restaurants in the vicinity, and all reports suggest that the situation was no different in other places.

https://www.facebook.com/tomas.sagl.1/videos/vb.100012745591351/164490713985781/?type=2&theater

https://youtu.be/j1XVC1PyLgE

 

[vaupet]

All these people running away were not panicking, it is obvious they used the occasion to leave the cafe without having to pay their bill

on the other hand: Alternative fur Deutschland (a right wing german party) have stated that they would like german citizens to re-arm themselves, to be able to defend themselves, because police won't be able to garantie everyones safety.

German government launched an appeal to start making food and water reserves for 2 weeks in every home

Chech government made a public appeal (seny?) to CCW holders to assist the government when necessary

the times they are achainging

 

[Snejdarek]

Czech government made a public appeal (seny?) to CCW holders to assist the government when necessary

It wasn't the government, but rather the Czech president appealing to CCW license holders to actually do carry (most are not doing so, as the country is too safe for them to bother) and to change the mindset to be ready to use the firearm when necessary.

This has been the sentiment shared by many members of parliament before (about 20%-25% of MPs had CCW 2 years ago - many more now - and some are known to carry within parliament) but for the first time being said out loud by someone holding an office rather than just a seat.

The funny thing is that most English language media report it as President saying that people should have the right to be armed ... well what do you want from Englishmen reporting from Prague. Live here but yet still it is hard to imagine for them that people do have that right so they need to wrap the appeal to start carrying into something else.

 

[Snejdarek]

So the NY Times wrote that "Aaron Gunsberger, who owns a kosher restaurant in the Jewish quarter, grabbed his gun and ran to the square, fearful that an attack was taking place."

Interview with Gunsberger http://www.expres.cz/aaron-gunsberger-rozhovor-d0o-/celebrity.aspx?c=A160826_203726_dx-celebrity_ren

In reality he just went there with his CC Colt to see what is going on.

The interesting part: Gunsberger repeatedly protested against the NY Times article depicting him as "grabbing gun and running towards square", but they refuse to change the article.

Other interesting information:
- majority of Czech jews are armed
- in the area of the jewish quarter (a few streets in the center, you can walk across in 5 minutes) there are at least 30 civilian guns at the street level at any given moment
- they have some own version of whatsupp that they use as a "panic button" to share information with others

 

[Snejdarek]

And the train chugs on...

http://www.europarl.europa.eu/sides...EP//TEXT+CRE+20071128+ITEM-021+DOC+XML+V0//EN

 

[old lady new shooter]

Thanks very much for posting about this, very interesting.

 

[vaupet]

Snej,

the report you posted is from 2008?!?

The current presidency of the EU, Slovakia, have listed their priorities, and gun control is not among them.

 

[Carl N. Brown]

post #208 Old Shatterhand (??) that threw me for a loop. "... a fictional character in Western novels by German writer Karl May (1842–1912) ..." He was as popular a fictional character in Germany as American author Howard Pyle's "Robin Hood" was in the U.S. (I'll bet European impressions of the Old West are about as accurate as my impression of Medieval England.)

This thread is doing a service by giving European perspectives on European gun laws and gun rights.

 

[Snejdarek]

You are right, my bad, sorry for that.