I've been reloading Berdan primed Swiss GP-11 brass for many years now and probably have a couple thousand cases prepped and ready to load. I still have about 8k Berdan primers and today I picked up a bunch of a Berdan primed 308 Winchester brass. Started to toss them in the scrap bucket but decided to try reloading a few to see how do in case I ever run low on 308 brass. The same tool I use to remove the primers from th Swiss brass worked on this brass too. I haven't tried inserting a primer yet but will check to make sure they fit tomorrow. My question is should standard 308 Winchester loads work with the Berdan primers? Thanks!
Anyone Reload Berdan Primed .308 Winchester?
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Grumulkin
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I have no Berdan primer reloading experience but I have a question. Is removing the crimp on Berdan primed military brass problematic? I've been tempted to try to reload some since I have a 7.5 Swiss barrel.
As far as your standard load question, I would use standard load data working up from low as usual. Berdan primers aren't going to be significantly hotter than Boxer primers and internal case dimensions should be about the same in both. If you really want to know if case volumes are similar, you could fill them with water and then weigh or otherwise measure the water.
As far as your standard load question, I would use standard load data working up from low as usual. Berdan primers aren't going to be significantly hotter than Boxer primers and internal case dimensions should be about the same in both. If you really want to know if case volumes are similar, you could fill them with water and then weigh or otherwise measure the water.
parker51, I was pondering that same question the last couple of days. I was working out some Berdan primed 8mm with jacketed bullets. Going to use some lead next, will load some with boxer along with them. Would like to chrony them for comparison. But that may be a week or so out.
BTW, the powders and data I have are pretty anemic to what the Mauser can be.
BTW, the powders and data I have are pretty anemic to what the Mauser can be.
FROGO207
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I have loaded the 308/7.62X51 and the 7.62X39 Berdan primed brass and successfully shot it. Re the primer concern, with Wolf/Tula Berdan primers is about the same as swapping between different brands of Boxer primers according to those I shot. I used the same propellant charges and worked up just like always. I was unsure which ones to get so I ordered 1K of both types available from Powder Valley to try. By the time I got around to trying them the primers had dried up and have not seen any more in stock of either type since.
I used an old jackknife to cut/scrape the crimp out of the pockets. The RCBS tool works to deprime them---with some occasional ruined primer anvils---so I built a basic hydraulic punch type deprimer that works better and use it with water because I wet tumble my brass after, anyway.
I used an old jackknife to cut/scrape the crimp out of the pockets. The RCBS tool works to deprime them---with some occasional ruined primer anvils---so I built a basic hydraulic punch type deprimer that works better and use it with water because I wet tumble my brass after, anyway.
Thanks to All! I checked the capacity and found these hold exactly 1 gr. of water more than PMC .308 brass so my standard Varget .308 load (which is not hot) should be fine.
Frogo207: I also use the hydraulic punch with water and you're right about the RCBS messing up some anvils. I have 3K of the PMC and 5K of the Wolf/Tula left so I needed to find something besides Swiss to use them in. I use a dental scraper to remove those tabs if the primer doesn't go in easily. Have found with the Swiss that once I remove the primers most times those tabs get pushed back and the primers go in without any problems.
Grumulkin: Frogo207 answered the question you had about the crimps.
Thanks again, I'll let you know how they do.
Frogo207: I also use the hydraulic punch with water and you're right about the RCBS messing up some anvils. I have 3K of the PMC and 5K of the Wolf/Tula left so I needed to find something besides Swiss to use them in. I use a dental scraper to remove those tabs if the primer doesn't go in easily. Have found with the Swiss that once I remove the primers most times those tabs get pushed back and the primers go in without any problems.
Grumulkin: Frogo207 answered the question you had about the crimps.
Thanks again, I'll let you know how they do.
parker51, thanks again for the info! I made a quick one up at work today! I had 1 primed case, with live primer, that wouldn't seat flush. Pocket wasn't totally clear of old primer. One whack and the primer came out. Now I need to go shoot some more surplus to test on them. 
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Have reloading thousands of 308 berdan. While labor extensive, 308 brass was hard to find for awhile and we have long winters. Decapped with RCBS tool, removed crimp with powered RCBS crimp remover (hole in center), cleaned primer pocket with modified pocket cleaner brush, poked out holes with plastic headed pin. An RCBS hand primer tool was used to seat primers (picked a slightly longer large primer pin)
Used the Tula primers and same load of 748 as used in other heavier cases, good for about 4 full load rounds.
Used the Tula primers and same load of 748 as used in other heavier cases, good for about 4 full load rounds.
That's great, glad I could help. I only wish I had ordered decapping rods in different diameters. The two I have fit the Swiss GP-11 brass just fine but I'm finding I have to use the 308 neck sizer on this brass so I'll get enough pressure to remove the primers. Out of 60 pieces of brass there were 5 that the primers refused to budge. The other 55 came out with a single whack. You may find you want to get smooth stainless rod as it will make for easier removal from the brass.parker51, thanks again for the info! I made a quick one up at work today! I had 1 primed case, with live primer, that wouldn't seat flush. Pocket wasn't totally clear of old primer. One whack and the primer came out. Now I need to go shoot some more surplus to test on them.
Zeke, thanks for the info. I have one of the Dillon crimp removers so it won't work on these. Which RCBS crimp remover do you have? The one I had of theirs fit on the press but don't recall it having a hole in the center. Did you make the longer priming rod for the RCBS primer or did you order it from RCBS? I primed a dozen pieces of this brass last night and found pockets extremely tight. I had no problem starting them but the primers required what I felt was excessive pressure to seat them to the bottom of the primer pockets. The next batch I will try the Tula primers and see if they do any better. Thanks sgain.
The RCBS crimp remover is the one used in the Trim Mate case prep center. After busting one RCBS hand primer (grip type), ordered 2 more. Found there is a measurable difference in the rod lengths, and picked the longest to use with SA 81/80 cases, since was having trouble seating primers all the way. Each kind of surplus case is likely to be different, as the Port cases deprime easier, and seem much more consistent.
Real pia to deprime the SA 80 and 81 cases. After doing it and breaking multiples of the decapping pins, felt obligated to use the cases to full potential.
What case are you working with?
Real pia to deprime the SA 80 and 81 cases. After doing it and breaking multiples of the decapping pins, felt obligated to use the cases to full potential.
What case are you working with?
The headstamp on this brass is HP 75 IV.
Loaded 15 of these using 168 gr. Prvi Partizan bullets with BL-c (2) powder. I loaded 5 each starting at 44.5 grs, 45 Grs and 45.5 grs. I tried to shoot them in both a Remington 700 and a Savage model 12 and was unable to finish the first 5 due to brass sticking in chamber. Will pull the bullets and try again with Varget.
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I've reloaded a couple thousand berdan cases in 308 using the same powder load as for boxer and the only problem I ran into was some of the FNM brass letting go on the first reload. I run extremely low pressure loads so that was a bit of a surprise. You will find that on some cases the old primer simply will not come out. I've used the RCBS tool and a homemade hydraulic tool but after two attempts the brass goes into the recycle bucket. Also for removing the crimp I got a CH4D swaging tool and on the large primer rod we touched the top with a ball mill to cut clearance for the anvil. Been using that with no problems
FROGO207
Member
cbnoble I may have to try that with my CH4D large primer rod.Thanks for the idea.
When reloading Tula Berdan primed 7.62x51, am treating the Tula Berdan primers as mag primers, and the surplus cases (the ones I have) as reduced volume cases.
Doing this gives approximately the same velocities as using Fed cases and CCI 34 primers.
Got curious and checked Powder Valley last week and they were not showing a supply of Tula primers. Glad I bought them when available.
Doing this gives approximately the same velocities as using Fed cases and CCI 34 primers.
Got curious and checked Powder Valley last week and they were not showing a supply of Tula primers. Glad I bought them when available.
I think this is because of the embargo with Russia over Crimea.
I tried Varget today using the Remington 700. Started off with 42 grs. and was going to work my way up to 44 grs. using Prvi Partizan 168 gr. bullets. The 1st 3 rounds fired okay and were grouping within an 1" at 100 yds. I did feel a fair amount of recoil but didn't feel excessive like the ones I loaded with BL-C 2. The 4th round stuck in the receiver and wouldn't budge. I had to use a cleaning rod from the muzzle end to knock it loose. I stopped there and will pull the remain 21 loads and lower the starting load down to 40 grs and see if this helps. I now have over a 100 pieces of this brass primed and ready to load so I've got to figure this out :banghead:
All brass was trimmed and full length resized.
The round fit nto the chamber and the bolt closed easily. I didn't check them with a case gauge but will check some of the remaining cases to see if they fit. I was shooting the same bullets with 44.9 grains of Varget from 2 different bolt action guns using FC, Win, Prvi Partizan and R.P. brass with no problems. I filled a FC case and one of these cases with Varget and the FC case held almost 2 grains more powder so this is why I backed off as much as I did on the starting loads. Guess that wasn't low enough.
Yes, it is the Berdan brass that is sticking in the chamber of my Remington 700. After I removed the stuck Berdan case I shot another 10 rounds I had loaded with 44.9 grains of Varget with the same bullets in RP brass and they ejected with no problems. I thought the reduction of powder due to less capacity in this brass would have been sufficient but apparently it wasn't.
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