Apache Engaging Al Qaeda Members

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I think "Al Qaeda members" is a touch of hyperbole. "Some guys standing near a truck" would be more precise ;) Besides, I didn't know Al Qaeda was a private members' club :eek:
 
Ugh, I'm not at all PC, sorry. "Some guys standing near a truck" is a bit of a hyperbole in itself. More accurate is: "Apache rains down on three cockroaches, a towed howitzer, and a truck". ;)
 
I believe that was one that turned out to be some innocent farmers in Iraq....at least that is the info I found on that video last year.
 
Innocent farmers who just happen to be hanging around military equipment? Hmm. I suppose someone here should notify the knobcreek website of the error.
 
there was another version of this kicking around, with about twenty seconds in front of where this one starts--and it shows the 'farmers' hauling RPGs, or whatever, into the tractor to bury them.

IOW, a good job, not a mistake.
 
I've seen the full version of that video which runs for several minutes. When I first saw the vid some months ago I spent time researching it to verify it's authenticity. It's clearly three men operating a tractor and a farm truck. How the Apache crew thought they were bad guys is a mystery to me.

After the shoot, the Army tried to cover it up but ABC News got hold of the video several months later. The Army held an inquiry and decided not to court-martial the Apache crew since they had been told there bad guys in the area and had not been told there were civilians farming in the area. They wrote the incident off to the fog of war.
 
I had heard that they had watched someone else make a drop off of weapons at that field and then these guys came to pick up. (or what jfp said)
I heard ABC news tried to make a deal of shooting a guy who was obviously wounded, but I never "researched" it. :)
 
Innocent farmers who just happen to be hanging around military equipment? Hmm. I suppose someone here should notify the knobcreek website of the error.
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Where do you get this information from that they were around military equipment? Is Knob Creek your only source?

You don't have feel like you are sympathizing with terrorists to understand that mistakes can be made. I dont' fault the Apache crew for it. **** happens in war.

Not to mention you can clearly tell that is OLD tractor on the far left with a plow.
 
There was no military equipment. Here are a couple of still images taken from the vid. It cleary shows three men operating a tractor, farm truck, and a pickup truck. I grew up on a farm and I know 3 dudes farming when I see them. It was a tragic mistake and nothing more.
 

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Where do you get this information from that they were around military equipment?
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You tell me then what that piece of equipment is to the far left with a pointy thing on top (resembling a barrel). Oh I get it ... it's the chute to a forage harvester. :rolleyes: I'd like to know how some here could say those people are farmers and stand by it just as much as people on the other side can say it's Al Qaeda.
 
That "pointy thing" is the exhaust pipe on an old diesel engine tractor. It's showing up as bright white because it's being filmed using a thermal camera.
 
It was probably a rifle, they were in a war zone after all and had the right to protect themselves. My guess is that they heard the sound of vehicles and aircraft in the area and decided to hid their rifle in case a US Army team decided to search their truck and confiscate their rifle. I'd a done the same thing if I thought someone might take my gun away from me. Toss it in the weeds and pick it up the next day when the coast is clear.
 
You tell me then what that piece of equipment is to the far left with a pointy thing on top (resembling a barrel). Oh I get it ... it's the chute to a forage harvester. I'd like to know how some here could say those people are farmers and stand by it just as much as people on the other side can say it's Al Qaeda.
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First off, since you want to have an attitude, explain why this "chute" is accented as much as it is in nightvision? OMG maybe its a EXAUST PIPE! :banghead: :banghead: :banghead: :banghead: :banghead:

I won't pretend to know which tractor it is, since I only know general models of old Farmalls, IH, Chalmers, and I don't much care for Deer....but for a 3/4 perspective looking down, its obvious to anyone who likes cars and trucks that pipes get hot.
http://www.comcorner.com/images/ad_support/image268.jpg
http://image40.webshots.com/41/1/14/23/368711423wYJHOV_ph.jpg
http://michael.trauttmansdorff.ca/a..._24_165029_Old_Tractor_at_Oneida_NH.sized.jpg
http://www.newholland.com/na/news/nhn/JanFeb02/pic1c.jpg

Oh, and if that isn't the pipe...then where is the pipe?
 
Okay is it normal for farmers to just run out and dump things in their field? I could see how someone could mistake that as a weapon. Especially considering that after the first guy is shot, the guy behind the tractor starts unvieling it. I'm sorry, but if you get the urge to run out and throw a rake in your field, I doubt very seriously if you are going to worry about taking it out of its case when you're being shot at. The rake on the ground is going to be the last of your concerns when 30mm cannon rounds are blowing up around you--unless, of course, the rake is an RPG or something you percieve an eliminate the threat. That is about 2:30 into the video, BTW. Check the youtube link. The guy is crouched behind the tractor, or whatever it is, taking a blanket or cloth or something off of a long tubular object when they smoke him. In fact, if you look closely to the object when he is running it out into the field, it looks like it has a carry handle. How much farming equipment has carry handles? I know the PKM usually does...

At any rate, it is enough that you couldn't blame the Apache guys for mistaking it as a weapon.
 
Definately you can't blame the Apache pilots. But if it was an rpg, it probably would have exploded when hit with the HE rounds.

If you look close, its like he was taking something out of a bag.
 
Okay is it normal for farmers to just run out and dump things in their field?
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Yes. When you are in mudd as farm fields are a lot of times, you tend to huff it once in a while so you don't sink. So if your tractor is having problems and they are waiting for it to get there (as you see it isn't there right off the bat) you could go out there to get things ready for when it arrives.)
 
First off, since you want to have an attitude, explain why this "chute" is accented as much as it is in nightvision? OMG maybe its a EXAUST PIPE!
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What exactly is my "attitude"? Me in disagreement with you? Because you are having trouble conforming me to your beliefs?

Accented? In what way? - The white glow, like the same heat signature that could be given off by a warm barrel? Anything warm or hot is going to show up bright. You can believe what you want and we can agree to disagree. Infact, there's probably earlier signs of suspicion in this than the video shows that ultimately led up to this engagement.
 
It is obviously a tractor. Note how the field behind it is plowed but the field in front of it isn't? My guess is that some farmers were doing really legitimate work when some of the terrorists/insurgents, or whatever you want to call them, came out (small truck) and told them "hide this PKM/RPK/RPD/RPG." Farmers don't argue with that type so they run this weapon out into the field, unaware that they are being watched. They all get wacked because of it. Unfortunate, yes.

"War is hell."
 
I've been reading too many SouthWest border threads I think.

When I read the title to this thread, I was trying to figure out why native americans instead of the Border Patrol were engaging Al Qaeda operatives slipping in from Mexico... :confused:

-Teuf
 
I'm all for killing these scumbags who are gunning down our soldiers, but this video turned my stomach. Just didn't feel right to me.
 
Accented? In what way? - The white glow, like the same heat signature that could be given off by a warm barrel? Anything warm or hot is going to show up bright. You can believe what you want and we can agree to disagree. Infact, there's probably earlier signs of suspicion in this than the video shows that ultimately led up to this engagement.
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lmao

A warm barrel? If they had been shooting a machine gun at the Apache I doubt the apache pilots would be radioing-in requesting permission to fire on them for 'looks like a weapon in his hand.' It would have been...."taking fire, permission to return fire?"
 
It looks like an RPG tube w/o the rocket in it in the long version of the clip. IMO (I'm talkin about the tube the guy throws into the field)

also, is it weird to notice one of the guys legs fly off to the left? I guess 30mm rounds do that...


edit: ive seen a version that is much closer up, must have been edited or sumthing
 
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