CraigC
Sixgun Nut
Personally, I feel that marginal cartridges are best relegated to experienced hunters but if you're gonna use the .223, use a better bullet. Unless I'm mistaken, match hollowpoints are not designed for expansion.
AR-15 for Deer Hunting???
- Thread starter Mr. T
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#52 on my FAQ list...
Hunting with the 223, or 30 carbine, etc.
52. The vast majority of experienced hunters would agree that the 223 Remington and the 30 Carbine calibers are too light for hunting big game. Certainly both have been used to kill deer, but that doesn’t make them a good choice. There is a rumor that a poacher once killed an elephant with a 22. Does that make the 22 an elephant gun? Just because a particular caliber WILL kill a particular animal doesn’t mean it should be accepted as a good choice for hunting that animal. The same can be said for any instance of using too small a gun for the job, like a 44 Magnum for rhinos. A big gun, but not big enough.
Hunting with the 223, or 30 carbine, etc.
52. The vast majority of experienced hunters would agree that the 223 Remington and the 30 Carbine calibers are too light for hunting big game. Certainly both have been used to kill deer, but that doesn’t make them a good choice. There is a rumor that a poacher once killed an elephant with a 22. Does that make the 22 an elephant gun? Just because a particular caliber WILL kill a particular animal doesn’t mean it should be accepted as a good choice for hunting that animal. The same can be said for any instance of using too small a gun for the job, like a 44 Magnum for rhinos. A big gun, but not big enough.
Kachok
Member
If another rifle is in the budget I would recomend a 243win or a 6.5x55, both are absolutly DEADLY on deer at longer ranges then any 22 cal and the recoil is almost non-existant. If not use TSX or Nosler Partitons within 100 yards and you should not have any complaints.
txhoghunter
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I agree with this to a certain point (and you are correct Craig, match bullets are not designed to expand). I would like to have someone use a larger caliber for deer hunting, but in this case using a larger caliber could cause a flinch and a poorly placed shot would be the result.
My first time deer hunting at age 9 I was handed a .30-30 without a recoil pad. I got to shoot it once before hitting the blind and it honestly scared me. When it came time to pull the trigger on a deer I flinched, yanked the shot, and upon finding the deer I had to shoot it again. I was comfortable shooting a .223, but my uncle did not want me to use it which is why he gave me the .30-30
She is already comfortable with the AR, and with good bullets it will kill a deer so I say stick with it.
Frozen North
Member
A heavy caliber may smack them dead better, but it will also smack the crap out of her. 243 is hard to beat for a first deer rifle, but a .223 will do well also. If you are confident in her shooting ability and are confident she will pick her shots carefully, I say do it.
Bullet selection is EVERYTHING, so choose carefully!
Maybe it's an excuse to buy her a .243!!! lol
Kachok
Member
I am a small framed shooter as well (5'5") and I found my Tikka T3 6.5x55 is my perfect fit both for LOP and comfortable level of recoil (max pressure handloads) Smoothest action in the universe, 6lbs featherweight, crisp adjustable trigger, and remarkably accurate, if another rifle is in the budget check them out. I got my T3 a few years ago for $408 Stainless steel/synthetic. Much higher quality then either of my Remington 700s or my old Winchester Model 70. Shoots as well as my Savages and looks/feels a heck of alot better.
Thanks for all of the input everyone. I will definitely do some more research on the best ammunition to use. I think that she is so comfortable with the AR that I am very hesitant to go to anything else...she is very accurate out to 100 yards that I think that she is plenty capable of taking any deer that gets within range. I will also be in the blind with her so only ethical shots will be taken. I know that there are better calibers to take deer with, but her accuracy, comfort and confidence with this AR really is important as well and I don't think should be overlooked. The key is finding the correct round to use and then get her to the range to test it out. I'll keep you all posted. Again thanks for the input.
If you can reload, I would recommend the 60gr nosler partion bullet, I don't like any factory softpoints. If you encounter a rut crazed buck you may loose the animal before it expires. Keep shots under 100 yards and the 223 is ok for smaller deer but marginal for big deer. My nephew has taken 3 deer with a 223 bolt gun but he has lost 2 also that were good lung hits.
An AR pattern rifle does not have to be .223. It seems that you are confident in her use of the rifle, but have reservations on the cartridge. If so, consider exploring one of the many variant cartidges available. You have the option of getting a complete upper receiver and swapping back and forth at will, or get just the required parts needed and convert your existing upper. There are many options that increase the energy on target but have negligible increase in recoil to the shooter. Food for thought.
CraigC
Sixgun Nut
Or you could always take her squirrel and rabbit hunting until she's big enough to handle an appropriate rifle???
After thinking about this a little more I think a 243 will suit you daughter better for the fact that she will outgrow the 223 rather quickly. The AR15 will then become a just for fun gun and not a hunting rifle.
Maybe you could get a DPMS lr 308 in 243 or get a 243 upper for her to hunt with. Actually thinking about it I think getting her a DPMS in 308 with both 308 and 243 uppers would be the best option for her.
Of course it doesn't have to be an AR style rifle does it? There are some fine 243s for under 500 dollars.
Maybe you could get a DPMS lr 308 in 243 or get a 243 upper for her to hunt with. Actually thinking about it I think getting her a DPMS in 308 with both 308 and 243 uppers would be the best option for her.
Of course it doesn't have to be an AR style rifle does it? There are some fine 243s for under 500 dollars.
How do you outgrow a .223?
txhoghunter
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BADUNAME37
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With the proper bullets (I use Barnes 62g Triple Shock in my AR), she should have no problem dropping a good size deer!
With a good shot, any bullets would do!
With a good shot, any bullets would do!
jad0110
Member
While not the most popular in my parts, it is nonetheless common. A friend of mine hunts whitetail with a single shot bolt action .223 exclusively (20 or 22" barrel, I don't recall exactly). Over the past 10 + years, he harvested over 30 deer with the lowly .223, and only one of the 30 sprinted more than 10 yards or so (and he admits that was his error, not the rifle or cartridge).
The thing that floors me are the guys who hunt 150 lb white tail with 300 Win Mag. Hey, whatever floats your boat, but me thinks such a cartridge probably wrecks a lot of good meat.
has she shot the 20 guage with all the padded warm clothes she will need in the wisconsin woods?? all that padding and thermal underwear and heavy coat will also make quite a difference... and from my own experience in wi, that first shot will be so damn thrilling, that she will never even mention the recoil... her heart will be going too fast!!! good luck to your little lady!!!
take a kid hunting and fishing!!
take a kid hunting and fishing!!
RockyMtnTactical
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It'll do just fine with the right bullet and placement. Wouldn't do anything past 200 yards though. Shot placement is king.
Karl Hungus
Member
If she can shoot, .223 will be fine.
Actually, you can hunt with 30rd mags here. Suppressors too. Give us a few months on the concealed carry.
Actually, you can hunt with 30rd mags here. Suppressors too. Give us a few months on the concealed carry.
dprice3844444
member
change the upper to 6.8 or 762x39
Interesting VIDEO I found on youtube, pretty well documented. 16" barrel using Remington 55grain soft points.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=webs9YRcqog
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=webs9YRcqog
mc223
Member
What the heck do they make them deer out of these days?
I think the point was made early in this thread that excessive distance and lightweight improper bullets should be avoided. And if it wasn't, it is now.
From the video log referenced in the above post:
So NELSONs02 what is your point? What is pretty well documented?
Yes using the wrong bullet, shooting low and just plain missing, will cause the deer to just run away.
I'm not so sure that using a shotgun scope on a carry handle mount didnt cause the first one to just be missed from shootin 5 inches low.
o
I think the point was made early in this thread that excessive distance and lightweight improper bullets should be avoided. And if it wasn't, it is now.
From the video log referenced in the above post:
So NELSONs02 what is your point? What is pretty well documented?
Yes using the wrong bullet, shooting low and just plain missing, will cause the deer to just run away.
I'm not so sure that using a shotgun scope on a carry handle mount didnt cause the first one to just be missed from shootin 5 inches low.
o
Kachok
Member
Watched the video. Not impressed at all. I am used to bang flops or VERY short runs with my 6.5mm, 270s, and 7mms (on much larger deer), watching those very small deer run off on close range shots is not exactly making a case for the 223. I want to find a scope cam so I can show you what happens when a 6.5x55 140gr bullet hits them at around 2700fps. Absolutly devestating impact for a compact, super light kicking rifle. Great expansion and full penatration 100% of the time no tracking needed to date.
Like I said many times before the 223 is a marginal deer round at best compared to other sissy kickers, the 6.8SPC would be a much better choice for AR-15 hunting.
Like I said many times before the 223 is a marginal deer round at best compared to other sissy kickers, the 6.8SPC would be a much better choice for AR-15 hunting.
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