AR15 carbine vs rifle buffer?
- Thread starter BJJ223
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Well, rifle systems have a lot heavier buffers which reduces recoil (actually just spreads out the impulse) in one sense, but now you have more reciprocating mass slamming forward.
Dedicated 3 gunners may use an adjustable gas block and lightweight BCG and buffer for the lowest recoil, but this would be a game-gun only.
The best option for you is probably neither...go with an A5 system. Longer receiver extension than carbine and heavier buffer. I don't have an A5, but many people rave about them.
Dedicated 3 gunners may use an adjustable gas block and lightweight BCG and buffer for the lowest recoil, but this would be a game-gun only.
The best option for you is probably neither...go with an A5 system. Longer receiver extension than carbine and heavier buffer. I don't have an A5, but many people rave about them.
MachIVshooter
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What makes carbine systems violent on 16" guns isn't a light buffer; it's the long dwell time with higher port pressure. That's why Armalite developed mid length systems, which now dominate the 16" market, and for good reason.
You don't say what yours is, but if it is a carbine gas system, changing buffer weights isn't going to noticeable change your recoil impulse. Going to a shorter barrel or a longer gas system is the fix.
H2 buffers basically match rifle buffers (4.7 vs. 5.0 oz). H3 carbine buffers are even heavier at 5.6 oz.
You don't say what yours is, but if it is a carbine gas system, changing buffer weights isn't going to noticeable change your recoil impulse. Going to a shorter barrel or a longer gas system is the fix.
H2 buffers basically match rifle buffers (4.7 vs. 5.0 oz). H3 carbine buffers are even heavier at 5.6 oz.
Thanks for the responses. For now, I am locked into a 16" carbine upper. My gun is primarily a fighting rifle. I just want to make it better for 3 gun. So, I would like to stick with a standard rifle based buffer or a carbine buffer.
Between the two, which would recoil less - a rifle buffer or a H2 carbine buffer?
P.S. I have M1 Garands. I know the AR15 does not recoil much. Every little bit I can reduce from recoil makes me faster on my second shot in 3 gun.
Between the two, which would recoil less - a rifle buffer or a H2 carbine buffer?
P.S. I have M1 Garands. I know the AR15 does not recoil much. Every little bit I can reduce from recoil makes me faster on my second shot in 3 gun.
C-grunt
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Either go to a H2 or better yet a Vltor A5 system. The A5 really is a great upgrade. I ran one on a 6920 for several years.
C-grunt
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Either the Vltor A5 or the rifle system will have the least recoil.
Varminterror
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Load power and bullet weight dictate the recoil level. Heavier buffers will slow down the recoil impulse and will often feel like less recoil, but the overall net recoil is the same.
I run H2 buffers in all of my AR's for the last ~15yrs, and put them in all of the carbine stocks I've built unless otherwise requested (over 200 builds, twice as many rebuilds). Whether it's a pistol, carbine, mid-length, or rifle gas length, they all run.
I run H2 buffers in all of my AR's for the last ~15yrs, and put them in all of the carbine stocks I've built unless otherwise requested (over 200 builds, twice as many rebuilds). Whether it's a pistol, carbine, mid-length, or rifle gas length, they all run.
MachIVshooter
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There are two components to the recoil in an AR. The first is normal free recoil, and that is constant with a given load and rifle weight. But the second is the buffer slamming home at the rear of the receiver extension, and is why 16" carbine gas rifles are notably sharper than middy or rifle gas systems.
A heavier buffer may slow it down and make it seem softer, but it can also have the opposite effect by causing greater mass to impact. Just depends on how overgassed your rig is.
Different buffer weights are meant to address function issues, not felt recoil. Bigger deal in FA guns with bolt bounce, but a different buffer weight can certainly help if carrier speed is too high or low, causing feeding or ejection issues. The different weights are not needed with rifle gas systems because the lower port pressure with proper dwell time as the weapon was originally designed is more forgiving. Mid length systems address the dwell time issue, although port pressure is still higher than rifle length.
I took my 16" carbine buffer rifle and my sons 16" rifle with an A2 rifle buffer to the range today.
The recoil feels different. But, I could not see any real difference in recoil. The dot jumped the same amount on each rifle.
No real difference in split times.
The recoil feels different. But, I could not see any real difference in recoil. The dot jumped the same amount on each rifle.
No real difference in split times.
Ibmikey
Member
I was shooting my 16" rifle today and it has next to nothing in recoil. It is a Faxon mid length carbine barrel with a brake and 15" Aero rail with bi pod on the front and a standard A2 buttstock with a rifle buffer. A Nikon AR 1x4 tops it off.
Well, that is the real test then.
An 18" rifle gas barrel on a rifle buffer system or A5 system would probably make a big difference. I can see how 16" carbine gas would be similar either way. Same high gas port pressure acting on the BCG and just slightly different methods to manage it.
Don't mix your buffers. Carbine buffers for carbines, rifle buffers for rifles. You can damage your weapon and make it malfunction in crazy ways with the wrong one.
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Watch some videos on bolt/carrier bounce. That might be the difference you are feeling.
M
I certainly didn't know it until I made the mistake of doing it myself.
Mistakes can happen when you are trying out different stocks and buffers. Many ARs are customized with parts that come with zero instructions.
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Although it's "common knowledge" that rifle, A5 and carbine buffers are not interchangeable it bears repeating. Not too long ago a guy on another forum had the wrong buffer type in his rifle. He was new to the game and didn't know there was a difference
recoil being perceptive, maybe try to play around with whatever you can. Being in competition, there probably people who can help. I bring this up, because shooting a 20 rifle, the recoil is very light. but shooting a 16" 6LB midlegnth with a H buffer, vs a 16" 5lb carbine with a C buffer felt the same to me.
So if you have a 20" rifle with a collapsing stock, or a 16" barrel gun with a fixed stock, what buffers are you supposed to use?
The buffer goes with the STOCK and buffer tube length you choose rather than the barrel. I have a friend that runs a 20 inch rifle with a carbine stock and buffer, it runs just fine.
I have a 16 inch gun with an A2 stock, spring and rifle buffer I use in competition. It runs like a top.
But running a carbine spring and buffer in a rifle stock tube will cause bizarre malfunctions and batter the gun.
Varying buffer weights available for carbines (Like the 'new M4 standard' H buffer) have confused the issue, and again when you get into SBR and pistol-type ARs.
In general, you will NOT run a rifle buffer unless you have a fixed a1 or a2 stock.
I have a 16 inch gun with an A2 stock, spring and rifle buffer I use in competition. It runs like a top.
But running a carbine spring and buffer in a rifle stock tube will cause bizarre malfunctions and batter the gun.
Varying buffer weights available for carbines (Like the 'new M4 standard' H buffer) have confused the issue, and again when you get into SBR and pistol-type ARs.
In general, you will NOT run a rifle buffer unless you have a fixed a1 or a2 stock.
Shawn Dodson
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Install an adjustable gas block to reduce bcg velocity. This is a better solution than a heavier buffer. You increase reciprocating mass with a heavier buffer which produces greater muzzle jump. Its not recoil you're trying to minimize it's muzzle jump.
MislMan
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For your 3-gun questions, go to 3gunnation.com and do some reading. Some interesting info and thoughts on the game with sponsers dedicated to that endeavor.
... MislMan
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