AR15 with Biathlon Bolt Action? (to thwart gun bans)

[CmdrSlander]

Almost all the draconian gun bans require that to be even considered for "assault weapon" classification, the rifle must be semiauto. Most stick with semiautos and build modified or featureless rifles. Why not do the opposite? Keep all the ergonomic features that make modern rifles great but lose the semi-auto. Ideally, one could have both, but in states with less than ideal laws, why not have an AR that is bolt action and uses a bolt handle like this:

The action is a "toggle bolt" system. The handle is pulled back then forward like a traditional straight pull but it is mechanically assisted by the lever, making it fast and easy to cycle. The receiver of a toggle bolt AR would be bespoke, the toggle bolt would be forward, at the front of the receiver, not where the current charging handle is, allowing the rifle to be cycled from the shoulder easily.

Better yet, combine this bolt tech with the Browning "Maral" style of bolt action, wherein springs are used to assist the bolt, making it almost semi-auto fast. The maral action entails only pulling back the bolt, then, upon release, the rifle strips a new cartridge and closes the action in a movement nearly identical to how semi-autos are chambered after reloading.

 

[Comrade Mike]

Someone is already ahead of you, straight pull bolt action AR's are already made

 

[CmdrSlander]

Someone is already ahead of you, straight pull bolt action AR's are already made

Yes, I know that, please note:

a) The biathlon action, which is usually eschewed in favor of charging handle style action.
b) The last part about using the "Maral" spring assisted firing system.

 

[Comrade Mike]

Yes, I know that, please note:

a) The biathlon action, which is usually eschewed in favor of charging handle style action.
b) The last part about using the "Maral" spring assisted firing system.

Probably not a big enough market for them right now to make all the engineering and development profitable. Most of the country can own semi auto AR in some bastardized form or another.

 

[CmdrSlander]

Probably not a big enough market for them right now to make all the engineering and development profitable. Most of the country can own semi auto AR in some bastardized form or another.

I know that, and I'm fairly sure a blanket ban on semi-autos would be struck down per the "common use" stipulation in Heller. The idea is that it is almost as fast as a semi auto but is not eligible for "assault weapon" classification as all AWB first require that a rifle be semi-automatic before checking off prohibited features. Therefore, one can have all the features, most of them ergonomic, like an adjustable stock. As to the size of that market, 67% of the population now lives under an AWB.

 

[Comrade Mike]

Give the patent office a call then! I'd like to see it made. A manual AR would certainly make me save on ammo

 

[CmdrSlander]

Its not the kind of thing one patents, as it would be easy to work around and achieve the same effect. Better to compete on quality and being first to market. Look at the AR industry - the AR15 has been out-of-patent for decades and yet many companies find success building a design they have no claim to.

 

[TurtlePhish]

A toggle action would probably be pretty tough to manipulate on an AR when compared to a .22lr, seeing as you need to deal with the rotary bolt and whatnot.

 

[silicosys4]

Is there a "biathlon action" available for cartridges larger than the .22lr? I know straight throw bolts exist for large centerfire cartridges, but an action as described by the OP might be hindered by overall cartridge length. When I look at the OP's posted picture, I think of the linkages and lever that would be required for a .223 length cartridge, and it seems like a lot more throw than that design is capable of in its current form.

Warning: the following is only my opinion.
I'm not in love with the ergonomics of the AR-15 enough to see the value of re-engineering an entire rifle based around keeping the same controls and ergonomics, around an ENTIRELY different action and action system. Might as well design the optimal biathlon-type modern sporting rifle with a detachable magazine at that point, rather than neutering an AR-15 and losing everything that makes it what it is. I fortunately do not live in an area or state that would require such a device to retain legal ownership.

http://www.lannertactical.com/AR15-Straight-Pull-Side-Charging-Rifle.html

 

[beatledog7]

Why not just design a true turnbolt-action rifle that uses AR-15 magazines? Oh yeah, Mossberg already did.

 

[chaser_2332]

Best to quit trying to get around future bans and try and fight them, trying to solve a problem that hasn't happened yet is like giving up.

 

[Comrade Mike]

The K31 manages to contain 45,000+ PSI in a fairly compact straight pull design. I'm sure you could do it with an AR

 

[ngnrd]

Best to quit trying to get around future bans and try and fight them, trying to solve a problem that hasn't happened yet is like giving up.

^^^This.

 

[Fishbed77]

Keep all the ergonomic features that make modern rifles great but lose the semi-auto.

Screw that.

I'd rather just fight the passage of unconstitutional and draconian laws rather than bastardize by ARs.

 

[Z-Michigan]

Best to quit trying to get around future bans and try and fight them, trying to solve a problem that hasn't happened yet is like giving up.

Yes. Don't give anything - the people who want to ban guns will not stop at anything, look at the UK where it's just barely possible to get a double barrel shotgun, or Australia where all semiautos and pump-actions are banned (for most people) and bolt actions are highly regulated. Whatever you give in, they will take and then immediately start taking more.

 

[HJ857]

This past winter a couple of us locally were wondering the practicality of an AR upper that is bolt action. Best of both worlds, AR ergonomics and magazine with bolt action rigidity. I vastly prefer the AR ergonomics over a typical bolt action. After shooting ARs exclusively for the past number of years, I can no longer get comfortable behind a standard bolt rifle stock. The head and hand positions do not feel right anymore.

PSE is making a crossbow upper for a standard AR lower, so why not?

There are tube guns like the Tubb, but those are stupid expensive and there's no reason for a bolt upper to cost tons more than a standard upper.

Personally, I like the idea a lot. But not to get around concerns of a weapons ban.

 

[Caliper_Mi]

Better yet, combine this bolt tech with the Browning "Maral" style of bolt action, wherein springs are used to assist the bolt, making it almost semi-auto fast. The maral action entails only pulling back the bolt, then, upon release, the rifle strips a new cartridge and closes the action in a movement nearly identical to how semi-autos are chambered after reloading.

Side-charging AR with no gas port on the barrel. You can currently buy all the parts to make this.

I have already thought about this kind of stuff. It won't work. They will just write the next law to ban your "too fast" action. Just like Feinstein added thumbhole stocks to the list of "bad" features in her latest bill to ban all the "evil" thumbhole stocks that were designed to "exploit" a "loophole" in the old AWB.
We've already given them an inch, they've already taken at least a mile. Compromise right now means moving the needle back the other way, towards removing restrictions on firearms rights.

That said, I would like a rifle like you describe, but would like to own it as a free man, so I could keep it right next to a REAL M4.

 

[backbencher]

The Brits are already ahead of you Commander.

http://www.southern-gun.co.uk/?page=items&cat_id=1&item_id=128

Southern Gun has been making straight pull bolt action ARs for years now, and the 9mm shown drops the bolt forward on pressing the lever in the former safety hole, I believe.

 

[hang fire]

A toggle action would probably be pretty tough to manipulate on an AR when compared to a .22lr, seeing as you need to deal with the rotary bolt and whatnot.

The Swiss overcame that little problem over a century ago.