Are we less free now?

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Oleg,


This is GOOD!

What are your copyright wishes on these....

IE: Would you be oppoed to someone with a decent printer making iron on transfers for at least 1 or 2 members of his family to wear to a 4th of July parade in the heart of occupied California?

Charles
 
Since you asked.....

"Even Under Colonial Rule..... "

And maybe make the last line a statement not a question.

Charles

PS: Thanks for the permission on the iron on... I know "Dad" will wear one.. kids and mom will decide or themselves.
 
The intolerable oppression that caused our forefathers to revolt would seem like wild-eyed libertarianism to most folks today.

The Constitution, which struck many veterans of the War of Independance as an oppressively statist document, has been run roughshod over by both parties for at least the last 140 years.

Boil the frogs slowly enough, and you can get your frog legs without ever having to pick up a gig.
 
Name me any government, anywhere, which has NOT worked diligently and unceasingly to increase its control over its citizenry?

That's what governments DO! All of'em. Everywhere.

The scary part is that Bush is just as serious as a heart attack when he talks about preserving freedom. IMO, he really does believe what he says. Go figure.

IOW, "Life is a holding pattern. A fighting retreat, if you will, against the forces of oppression."--Me.

Art
 
...intolerable oppression that caused our forefathers to revolt would seem like wild-eyed libertarianism to most folks today
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Gee. I can't remember the last time I had to put up a soljer over the winter, feed him, and let him entertain himself with my liquor, wife, and or daughters.
 
BigG,

Not to mention an almost complete absence of government regulations and taxes.

Want to immigrate to Colonial America? Hop off the boat. Want to start a business? Hang out a shingle. Sales tax? Income tax? What're those?

So a couple of folks in Massachussetts had to board soldiers that were part of the garrison protecting them from the injuns; compared to the nonsense we put up with today, that's almost laughably trivial.
 
Quartering of troops: The forefathers thought it sucked badly enough to note it.

Also, you are correct about little federal regulation at that time but you had to produce everything sans electricity, motorized transportation, and communication was via the King's post.

Also, you failed to mention the little matter of trying to keep your hair. I believe they called the adversary the murderous redskin savages. :eek:
 
That colonial conditions were freer than the present seems a no-brainer on the face of it. However, you were still a subject of King and country with no real rights. We all know the inalienable right is the power behind the freedom.

I seriously doubt the quartering of troops was a laughing matter to those so affected. Sorry Tamara, not only do you have to feed and house this dude, but you have no real option if he decides to share your bed as well. Comparatively trivial? Perhaps, but I don’t think so.

Remove King and country from the equation, substitute a new (fairly pure) constitution unfettered by all the changes yet to come, and … BAM – the heady scent of true freedom in the air!

Were the Colonialists more free than we are? From regulations and asinine restrictions sure - but not in the true sense of freedom.

Nice stuff Oleg - always a pleasure. :)
 
While I like pretty much everything Oleg does, not sure if the liberals will get it. They're of the school that ... 'but it was different back then!!' The Constitution doesn't matter unless they shoot their mouth off on TV then get attacked in response. "But this is America! What about the 1A?" :rolleyes:

(i.e. Natalie Maines, Danny Glover etc. etc. etc.)
 
but you had to produce everything sans electricity, motorized transportation,
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What does that have to do with the level of onerous government intervention or the lack thereof?


and communication was via the King's post.
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It's against the law to set up a rival to the King's post today, too. ;)



Look, BigG, I'm not pining for some idealized life in a dirt-floored 18th Century cabin, but anybody who spends five minutes reading about the causes of the Revolution will find that our forefathers revolted against the crown for "taxes" and "oppression" that are trifling by today's standards. This doesn't speak ill of them, it speaks poorly of their descendants for letting a free republic trickle away.

Run down the checklist of complaints against the crown in the DoI and see how many apply today.

Between gun control, federal income tax, the alphabet soup of unconstitutional federal regulatory agencies, and the legal excesses of the War on (Drugs/Crime/Terrorism/Whatever) we should be able to wrap the bodies of Tom Jefferson and Tom Paine in copper wire and electrify the entire eastern seaboard.
 
Between gun control, federal income tax, the alphabet soup of unconstitutional federal regulatory agencies, and the legal excesses of the War on (Drugs/Crime/Terrorism/Whatever) we should be able to wrap the bodies of Tom Jefferson and Tom Paine in copper wire and electify the entire eastern seaboard.
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:D

Likely they (and many others) would be spinning in the grave so hard we could export power to Canada as well!
 
History teacher prospective:

We are less free because of the punitive taxation. Money = power

As far as guns, yes and no. There is a wider gap between civilian and military arms for certain.

But we don't have a draft and, most important, laws like the Sedition act which severely curtailed free speech are a thing of the past.

We are still some of the most free people on Earth and I'm glad we have good people who fight to keep us that way.
 
Against the law to set up a rival to the King's post today??????
UPS, E-Mail, Courier Services, etc.

The sad fact that people fail to acknowledge is that the same FF's that gave us this marvelous instrument called the Constitution immediately began whittling it away once theory
began rubbing elbows with reality and the actual governance of this nation began to take place. The erosion of
rights didn't start with the modern era.

We do not physically quarter troops within the confines of our personal residences, however we do pay an onerous tax burden to ensure that they are clothed, fed, trained, supplied and transported along with giving up huge acerages of public lands to ensure their proper quartering, training, etc. There is also the symbiotic (some would say parasitic)
relationship between military and civilian communities where the influence of the military in the community is so pervasive that the community becomes a "company" town.
 
I am not suggesting that we are worse off in every way now than we were before. What I do point out is that this one aspect of life certainly got worse for most people.
 
I understand your point(s), Tamara. My comment was about being able to go into bidness - hang out a shingle... your raw materials, tooling, motive power, delivery, and marketing would all be eighteenth century, too.

Also, I might add that coinage and lack therof was a real problem in the eighteenth century. There was not enough hard money to get past a barter system. So you get a bushel of corn for your pack of cigarettes (pound of tabacky), etc.

Onerous gomt intervention has also brought us standardized weights and measures, an interstate highway system, and a postal service while maybe not second to none, at least works halfasst decent. Try to mail a letter in any other country for $0.37 and you will get either a blank stare or ROTF laughter. :neener:

Your points (gripes, concerns) are well taken! :)
 
Great work on the poster, Oleg!!

I believe that we have lost sight of the freedoms that the Founders fought to obtain and these same liberties are being abrogated every day in the name of national security. True, there is no sedition law, but that certainly does not stop the state apparatus from using the "clear and present danger" argument to detain dissenters without immediate charges or prosecution. The USA Patriot acts are frightening enough as it is.

In an advanced placement history class in high school, I did research that indicated that the taxation catalyst for the American Revolution was an excise of about 3%. Here in Chattanooga, TN in 2003, I pay $.10 on every dollar spent AFTER the Feds take from my income. We've come a long way...:fire:
 
. What I do point out is that this one aspect of life certainly got worse for most people.
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Oleg, not to belabor the point but apparently this is about guns. Do you realize that even with the "onerous govt intervention" we have today more and better guns available to us than we had during the salad days of my youth, pre-'68. I can get better, usable guns, like AR-15s and AK-47s and cheap ammo to shoot in them. None of this was commonly available in '68. You could buy an old deer rifle or a WWI era Mauser that had seen MUCH better days, although true, you could buy it at KMart or the local hardware and take it home, no messy forms or background checks.

The handguns commonly available today would make you feel like a kid in a candy store if available in '68. Many guns are $300 or $400 NEW, which would equate to probably $20 or $30 back then. I assure you the guns did not cost $20 or $30. More like $120 or $150. The ammo was similarly priced, no cheap imports that I was aware of. Either buy Remington, Winchester, or that new-fangled upstart Federal. So yes, you are oppressed, but don't think we weren't back pre-68 either. JMTC
 
A light edit of the caption to reduce word count.

250 years ago the British recognized the American right to self defense.

Are today's Americans less free than Colonials?
 
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