17poundr
Member
I was checking out the Ruger rifles on the web, and ZAP! There it was again!
New and unkown (to me that is), rifle ammunition types. Ruger has rifles in their M77 hawkeye bolt action rifles, in 338 RCM & 300 RCM ammunition.
Well, I dont know either. I gather that the tip's (or bullets if that is a more correct word, sorry I know half of my firearm words in english and half in Finnish, a sorry result sometimes
), are the same as in the Lapua 338 or the Winchester 300, that have been with us for some time and I gather are the most popular 'pretty heavy' guns for sniper who are shy of using the ultimate .50caliber super heavies...
anyway both the Win 300 and Lapua 338, are kind of a 'half step' up from the previously normal sharpshooter caliber, and hunting all round most popular (in North Europe at least), 308, or 7.62x51mm.
But, there are so many now, I have noticed new half heavy pistol ammo, half rifle ammo, in usually a magnum style casing for the AR-15, the Beowulf, Socom and the .45...
Then there is such ammo as 358win, or 338fed (again I suspect the full jacket bullet in the 338fed, could be put into a 338lapua, does anybody know by the way, was lapua the first company to make 338 bulletted factory made rounds)?
I could go on and on, ofcourse the 'floaters', are easy to remember to the vaster ammount of 'sinkers' in these coming and going ammunition 'wars' that the great ammo houses launch, sometimes from popular feedback, sometimes from military demand/want. And sometimes, to try if a product will 'take off', and has really no great added value, the aim is money to the firm...
But, the .270cal new ammo (I belive that behind it there is a couple of firms, there is the .270Winchester, is the same as the 270WSM? Then the .270Weatherby, is this the WSM)?
As you see it's soo confusing, just look at this site's google 'ad text', and figure out how many different rifle calibers there are out there! Here: An extensive and informative on line catalog of over 2000 ammunition products, ... .270 WSM .280 Remington .284 Winchester .30 Carbine .30 Carbine Tracer ...
www.ammobank.com/
OK, ok, I admit, many have 'sunk' all but to the most devoted followers ages ago, I too wish that I would someday have a 10mm handgun, even if it is now mostly known as the father of the .40s&w, which pretty much all say, is much more a sencible by as there is so much variety for this top five pistol ammo round...
So, if anybody could give a kind of list of rounds that are established (I can give a go, these are really from my memory, so please dont take this as an arrogant challenge from somebody who doestn know much, I'm just starting off, and the real experts will hopefully follow on and share their wisdom).
So, as far as I know it goes pretty much like this in handguns
22lr,
25cal (mm unknown)
32cal (mm unknown, maybe 7.65)?
38ca. with many different after names, the 38special, 38super, and 38+, one of these goes into the 357mag revolvers... (The 38special I belive)...
Then the semi auto threesome...
9x19 Parabellum (somewhat sinking brethren are the 9x17mm or the 380cal, or 9mm'kurz'. And the 9x18mm Makarov).
.40s&w, according to Wikipedia, the most popular round in US law enforcement, that speaks for itself! Europe is ofcourse still sticking to their 9mm parabellum's, but in hobbyist circles the .40cal is coming in and accepted with wide arms!
.45a.c.p. (I know, there is some brouhaha, about the a.c.p., some say it shouldnt be used, but I read an article in a gun magazine where an old law enforcement vet, told that the correct way is with the dot after each letter, and that it was used wayy back, in the day, so why not keep on using it? I concur, be it ACP, or a.c.p., it tells us it isnt the 'cowboy 45', or the new AR-15, 45cal of 300 grains. And that was for the lighter slug)!!!
There are the
10mm, the tragicly oversighted FBI ammo, (I like it, even though I never got to fire it, but hey, I thought the .50 Desert Eagle was ok, if you didnt fight the recoil, and didnt fear it either).
And such specialities as the...
Wildey (sorry, I'm not shure about the caliber/mm numbers on the wildey, but I know it's a whopper).
The we go back to revolver greats, and I truly mean greats! The...
357 (mag)
magnum41
magnum44
Colt 45
.454 casull
And, the fifties (I'm shure I left something out but is there handgun ammo between the Casull, and the various .50cals, that should be mentioned, I cannot think of one, still I'm not an expert), the strongest nowadays being the
S&W 500!
Close friends are the .50gi, and the one that the Israeli Desert Eagle shoots (I belive it had a three letter ending, sorry bad memory).
About the S&W500, this is a good link about it from the Popular Mechanics magazine website, check it out! Here:
http://www.popularmechanics.com/outdoors/sports/1277336.html
As for rifle ammo, I know that the modern way to start is with the 17hmr, .17machII, and .22LR.
5.45mm (Russia AK74 and AK 03ect).
5.7x28mm Appart from it's shortness, it has the ability to penetrate level II body armour, and even level if things go well (for the shooter)! Level III... (so I have heard). The US Army has taken a fiew of the P-90 carbines, and civilians in the us can now get the pistol, which is of a regurlar 9mm semi auto size, but packs 20 rounds of this special ammo, and it weighs much less, so many extra clips can be held while having a consealed gun... Maybe in the future, this will develope into a new trend of guns and ammo...?
The AR-15 Round, that has catched onto at least ten different guns that are good, many of them army but also hunting, varmint, sport and self defence variants for the civilians...
Why are varmint hunting guns and bullets referred to separately, a 'varmint', gun is well known, but nobody would know what an 'elk' gun is!
5.56mm (Nato countries pack this, exept perhaps some new ones, like Estonia who shoot the Swedish assault gun, which fires a round that I do not know of).
6.8mm
The 'new' round that grew from US special forces, who wanted more hitting/stopping power, and a bit more longevity, as far as ballistic drop is conserned (I dont know the proper term for when the bullet's curve starts to droop, usually arround the 500 meter mark)...
Then it starts very rapidly to go into tens of variants, I can throw the
6.5mm, 7mm,
The 7.62, which had a beginning in the Russian bolt action Mosin Nagant in the 1891 7.62x54mm, a mark in firearms history shurely, for as far as I know, this was the first time that the 7.62mm bullet, got into mass production, to be followed by lot's and lot's of other variants, with varying length of cartridge, but the classic 'seven point six two', has been probably the most used rilfle bullet in the last 120 years (I could be wrong, but those wars got an awful lot of ammo shot, and they still are shooting them in the near east, and Africa in anger not to mention the hunting or all of the armies that arent in war but train (like the Finnish Army RK-62, which uses the 7.2x39)... Then I belive came the Springfield which fired one of the most longevity holding rounds ever, the 7.62x51 !!!
Like the .45apc, it's a true champion.
And let's not forget the (to us europeans, somewhat oddly named).30-06Springfield, a great ammo for a great gun or simply, 7x62x63
Variants included the ww2 carbine 7.62x33, known as .30 caliber
And there are the 'close calls', meaning different nations made the basically same bullets, but in slightly different diameter, so we got the British 7.7x56mm, know as the classic 303.
The Mauser 7.92x57 was and is a collectors classic, and it's offspring, the 7.92x33 Kurzpatrone PP43, became the first assault gun ammo! See how close it was to the US carbine ammo in specs!
Still, the apparatus that fired it, was the first bonafide assault gun (or so the books say)...
And the various french, and other nations favourites, that I belive the 7.5x55,5,(Swiss) and 7.5x54(French)
Hunting has it's own... I am no expert for that. All I know is that the now popular .270 cal (be it winchester or Weatherby), uses an exactly same thickness bullet as the 6.8mm AR-15 round).
Now, I could be completely wrong, but a very youthful, and popular hunting round, that has if not the same, then at least the same thickness bullet to the assault gun round that the US Special Forces put up as the best way to upgrade the hitting power of the M-16/M4, as only the upper halves have to be changed, and even in those sometimes you get away, with re-boring the barrel, and doing 'something' to the bolt... Sounds like a pretty winning combo to me, up and coming hot hunting round packs same bullet as the most easy way to increase the stopping power and accuracy of the AR-15 based gun systems.... We 'might' be onto a winning combo!
Anyway, please dont take my suggestions, (or the not so educated guesses) as anything else, and please share any wisdom that you might see fit to part with, I truly would like to get a better understanding into the confusing horde of (especially rifle), ammunition.
I threw in a fiew pics, now, exactly which US/Britain designation would you give this pistol that has European mm markings for it's ammo?
New and unkown (to me that is), rifle ammunition types. Ruger has rifles in their M77 hawkeye bolt action rifles, in 338 RCM & 300 RCM ammunition.
Well, I dont know either. I gather that the tip's (or bullets if that is a more correct word, sorry I know half of my firearm words in english and half in Finnish, a sorry result sometimes
), are the same as in the Lapua 338 or the Winchester 300, that have been with us for some time and I gather are the most popular 'pretty heavy' guns for sniper who are shy of using the ultimate .50caliber super heavies...anyway both the Win 300 and Lapua 338, are kind of a 'half step' up from the previously normal sharpshooter caliber, and hunting all round most popular (in North Europe at least), 308, or 7.62x51mm.
But, there are so many now, I have noticed new half heavy pistol ammo, half rifle ammo, in usually a magnum style casing for the AR-15, the Beowulf, Socom and the .45...
Then there is such ammo as 358win, or 338fed (again I suspect the full jacket bullet in the 338fed, could be put into a 338lapua, does anybody know by the way, was lapua the first company to make 338 bulletted factory made rounds)?
I could go on and on, ofcourse the 'floaters', are easy to remember to the vaster ammount of 'sinkers' in these coming and going ammunition 'wars' that the great ammo houses launch, sometimes from popular feedback, sometimes from military demand/want. And sometimes, to try if a product will 'take off', and has really no great added value, the aim is money to the firm...
But, the .270cal new ammo (I belive that behind it there is a couple of firms, there is the .270Winchester, is the same as the 270WSM? Then the .270Weatherby, is this the WSM)?
As you see it's soo confusing, just look at this site's google 'ad text', and figure out how many different rifle calibers there are out there! Here: An extensive and informative on line catalog of over 2000 ammunition products, ... .270 WSM .280 Remington .284 Winchester .30 Carbine .30 Carbine Tracer ...
www.ammobank.com/
OK, ok, I admit, many have 'sunk' all but to the most devoted followers ages ago, I too wish that I would someday have a 10mm handgun, even if it is now mostly known as the father of the .40s&w, which pretty much all say, is much more a sencible by as there is so much variety for this top five pistol ammo round...
So, if anybody could give a kind of list of rounds that are established (I can give a go, these are really from my memory, so please dont take this as an arrogant challenge from somebody who doestn know much, I'm just starting off, and the real experts will hopefully follow on and share their wisdom).
So, as far as I know it goes pretty much like this in handguns
22lr,
25cal (mm unknown)
32cal (mm unknown, maybe 7.65)?
38ca. with many different after names, the 38special, 38super, and 38+, one of these goes into the 357mag revolvers... (The 38special I belive)...
Then the semi auto threesome...
9x19 Parabellum (somewhat sinking brethren are the 9x17mm or the 380cal, or 9mm'kurz'. And the 9x18mm Makarov).
.40s&w, according to Wikipedia, the most popular round in US law enforcement, that speaks for itself! Europe is ofcourse still sticking to their 9mm parabellum's, but in hobbyist circles the .40cal is coming in and accepted with wide arms!
.45a.c.p. (I know, there is some brouhaha, about the a.c.p., some say it shouldnt be used, but I read an article in a gun magazine where an old law enforcement vet, told that the correct way is with the dot after each letter, and that it was used wayy back, in the day, so why not keep on using it? I concur, be it ACP, or a.c.p., it tells us it isnt the 'cowboy 45', or the new AR-15, 45cal of 300 grains. And that was for the lighter slug)!!!
There are the
10mm, the tragicly oversighted FBI ammo, (I like it, even though I never got to fire it, but hey, I thought the .50 Desert Eagle was ok, if you didnt fight the recoil, and didnt fear it either).
And such specialities as the...
Wildey (sorry, I'm not shure about the caliber/mm numbers on the wildey, but I know it's a whopper).
The we go back to revolver greats, and I truly mean greats! The...
357 (mag)
magnum41
magnum44
Colt 45
.454 casull
And, the fifties (I'm shure I left something out but is there handgun ammo between the Casull, and the various .50cals, that should be mentioned, I cannot think of one, still I'm not an expert), the strongest nowadays being the
S&W 500!
Close friends are the .50gi, and the one that the Israeli Desert Eagle shoots (I belive it had a three letter ending, sorry bad memory).
About the S&W500, this is a good link about it from the Popular Mechanics magazine website, check it out! Here:
http://www.popularmechanics.com/outdoors/sports/1277336.html
As for rifle ammo, I know that the modern way to start is with the 17hmr, .17machII, and .22LR.
5.45mm (Russia AK74 and AK 03ect).
5.7x28mm Appart from it's shortness, it has the ability to penetrate level II body armour, and even level if things go well (for the shooter)! Level III... (so I have heard). The US Army has taken a fiew of the P-90 carbines, and civilians in the us can now get the pistol, which is of a regurlar 9mm semi auto size, but packs 20 rounds of this special ammo, and it weighs much less, so many extra clips can be held while having a consealed gun... Maybe in the future, this will develope into a new trend of guns and ammo...?
The AR-15 Round, that has catched onto at least ten different guns that are good, many of them army but also hunting, varmint, sport and self defence variants for the civilians...
Why are varmint hunting guns and bullets referred to separately, a 'varmint', gun is well known, but nobody would know what an 'elk' gun is!
5.56mm (Nato countries pack this, exept perhaps some new ones, like Estonia who shoot the Swedish assault gun, which fires a round that I do not know of).
6.8mm
The 'new' round that grew from US special forces, who wanted more hitting/stopping power, and a bit more longevity, as far as ballistic drop is conserned (I dont know the proper term for when the bullet's curve starts to droop, usually arround the 500 meter mark)...
Then it starts very rapidly to go into tens of variants, I can throw the
6.5mm, 7mm,
The 7.62, which had a beginning in the Russian bolt action Mosin Nagant in the 1891 7.62x54mm, a mark in firearms history shurely, for as far as I know, this was the first time that the 7.62mm bullet, got into mass production, to be followed by lot's and lot's of other variants, with varying length of cartridge, but the classic 'seven point six two', has been probably the most used rilfle bullet in the last 120 years (I could be wrong, but those wars got an awful lot of ammo shot, and they still are shooting them in the near east, and Africa in anger not to mention the hunting or all of the armies that arent in war but train (like the Finnish Army RK-62, which uses the 7.2x39)... Then I belive came the Springfield which fired one of the most longevity holding rounds ever, the 7.62x51 !!!
Like the .45apc, it's a true champion.
And let's not forget the (to us europeans, somewhat oddly named).30-06Springfield, a great ammo for a great gun or simply, 7x62x63
Variants included the ww2 carbine 7.62x33, known as .30 caliber
And there are the 'close calls', meaning different nations made the basically same bullets, but in slightly different diameter, so we got the British 7.7x56mm, know as the classic 303.
The Mauser 7.92x57 was and is a collectors classic, and it's offspring, the 7.92x33 Kurzpatrone PP43, became the first assault gun ammo! See how close it was to the US carbine ammo in specs!
Still, the apparatus that fired it, was the first bonafide assault gun (or so the books say)...
And the various french, and other nations favourites, that I belive the 7.5x55,5,(Swiss) and 7.5x54(French)
Hunting has it's own... I am no expert for that. All I know is that the now popular .270 cal (be it winchester or Weatherby), uses an exactly same thickness bullet as the 6.8mm AR-15 round).
Now, I could be completely wrong, but a very youthful, and popular hunting round, that has if not the same, then at least the same thickness bullet to the assault gun round that the US Special Forces put up as the best way to upgrade the hitting power of the M-16/M4, as only the upper halves have to be changed, and even in those sometimes you get away, with re-boring the barrel, and doing 'something' to the bolt... Sounds like a pretty winning combo to me, up and coming hot hunting round packs same bullet as the most easy way to increase the stopping power and accuracy of the AR-15 based gun systems.... We 'might' be onto a winning combo!
Anyway, please dont take my suggestions, (or the not so educated guesses) as anything else, and please share any wisdom that you might see fit to part with, I truly would like to get a better understanding into the confusing horde of (especially rifle), ammunition.
I threw in a fiew pics, now, exactly which US/Britain designation would you give this pistol that has European mm markings for it's ammo?
, there's not much point in complaining about it. The current system of gun and ammo makers constantly producing new stuff to throw at the wall and seeing what sticks, works pretty well.
Yess s s ... (Sliver), it is spelled MUM)! 
