Armchair Generals: Iraq and North Korea.

[Lord Grey Boots]

Lets see:

Iraq
- Will be hit by massive cruise-missile and stealth bomber attacks at say 4:13 AM. Every Command and Control center, Republican Guard depot, "secret" missile site, Presidential palace, communications center, electrical plant, and military fuel depot is destroyed by, say 4:15 AM.

Hopefully Saddam is at one of those spots.

If not, Saddam sends out regular Iraqi army troops, first. A B52 makes one pass, and they surrender. US/Brit/etc troops take 500,000 prisoners.

Republican guard troops retreat to Bagdad and Tikrit. However, they are unable to form a hard defensive line, and all hard defensive positions are destroyed. Aircraft and cruise missiles scrape the top off Bagdad, and Saddam is found propped up in a jeep at the front line with a couple of bullet holes in the back of his head. Similar results are seen for his psychopathic sons, and other henchmen.

 

[redneck2]

Unfortunately.....

What does Saddam really want??? He wants to be in total control and be seen as the newest savior of the Arabs. How do you do that??? Kill the Jews. If he could destroy Israel, he'd be the "big hero"

The upside......Yeah, we'll win in Iraq in less than a week

The downside.....Israel will get hit HARD. Chemical certainly and maybe bio

Hit Israel with a few dozen SCUDS with chemicals and the message is sent.

Move your bio weapons to Syria, Iran, and over thru Afghanistan and into Pakistan. Eventually filter them into Western countries.

Before this is all over, I suspect thousands and perhaps millions of Jews will die.

Read Revelation.

The battle begins in the Garden of Eden (Euprates River in Iraq) Million man army marches from the East (China siding with North Korea).

The war effort goes bad. Plagues will cover the earth (biological infestation into Europe) In a panicked response to counter the US, the Common Market Nations unite and elect a leader (the Anti-Christ)

Beginning of the end??? Jewish history says there were 2,000 years from Garden of Eden to Arbaham...2,000 from Abraham to Jesus....and 2,000 from Jesus to the end. Historians now say that our calendar is off by 3 years, and Jesus was actually born in our year 3.

Something to think about. Have a nice day.

 

[Ol' Badger]

1). Iraq
2). North Korea
3). France
4). Canada (For saying their morally better than us. )

 

[Atticus]

What I think Saddam will do if given a chance: He will order the Republican Guard and the rest of the Army to throw away their uniforms in order to blend in with the rest of the population. He will distribute ammo, RPG's, anti tank weapons, and the chem/ bio agents (he doesn't have) to them. He'll tell them to fight like the Viet Cong. He will target the massing US troops in Turkey/S.A., and Israel, with scuds loaded with chem/ bio agents. He will shield himself and his inner circle with civilians and hope for a high body count. He may even create it himself.

Actually though...I think someone will kill Saddam within a day or two after the US attack begins.

 

[J Miller]

I am not a military expert but I believe we should wory about Iraq more than North Korea. If we back off from NK they will probably just sit and blow off steam. At least for the forseeable future.
However the Iraqi's and the terrorists they support, have already attacked in their own insidious ways.
They may not have a viable military, but their willingness to use chemical, biological, and nuclear weapons, (if they have them, and there's no guarantee they don't), is already proven.

I believe we could really be stepping in a quagmire when we invad Iraq. I know we will, I'm just worried.

Oh, I'm no fan of the West coast bliss ninnys either, but my brother lives near LA. So give me time to extract him from that area before we let it get wasted. OK.

 

[labgrade]

Iraq can't win this. "Islam," can though.

As with VietNam, there's that underlying thing of "occupation."

So, we defeat 'em toot sweet & invoke a "democratic system" - one that we're oh so familiar with, right? (wrong, we're an alleged constitutional republic - we just aren't all that aware of that fact ourselves - & a fatal flaw .... let's not be too delusional on what we want, rather than what we ask.)

Anyway, we institute a democracy & Iraq votes in the most hard-lined anti-American theocracy ..... & then? Occupational cold be so much worse than our worst VN errors. Gotta first win the hearts ' minds. Che Guverra's stuff comes to mind regardless.

N Korea's even more dicey, methinks.

Betcha our best bet is to leverage China to tell 'em to just quit it.

But we won't. China's got too much at stake for our economy - yup. Cheap toys 'n junk stuff, but still, big bucks in our own economy.

& BTW, N Korea can't win this either, but they can make us lose.

I see a bad moon a'risin' ...

USA can pull this out, but I see this as nothing more than the prelude to a much more squirrely world. Good luck to those who have to sort it out (they won't ask me ), God bless us everyone!

May you live in interesting times ....

 

[rbrowning]

I think we will see a rerun in Iraq, unfortunatly it will only alienate the rest of the world against us that much more. In the end they will bring the war to us and there isn't a whole lot we can do to stop it w/o becoming a police state, destroying our beloved country ourselves.

NK is a puppet of China. China built up their nucular program and I think we need to let/make China shut them down if they want to do business with the rest of the world. If they decline, it wouldn't surprise me to see a major accident at the refining center, just about the time that the General Accounting Office notices that our nuke inventory is off by one.

 

[capt_happypants]

If I'm Saddam Hussein, I'll try to deny the primary advantages of the U.S. forces: speed, precision fire strikes, mobility, and superior night-fighting capabilities. My goal isn't to defeat U.S. forces; it's to force a long, bloody stalemate that gets major media play at home and in Europe

I move all of my mechanized and armored forces into the cities, and cede the oil fields and all of the desert to U.S. forces. There's no point in trying to engage 3rd Infantry and the various Marine elements in the open; I'll get my forces killed for no good reason. I might have some elements outside of urban areas as bait, but their job would be to initiate contact with U.S. forces and draw them into a city fight.

Whoever said that they'd dress up Iraqi forces up as civilians was a genius. Position equipment next to non-combatants so that a strike from a JDAM will still cause collateral casualities.

I'd lob a few rockets filled with GB/VX towards American lines, in order to get the U.S. forces into full MOPP-4 gear, then shell the city with as much nerve gas as possible to cause massive civilian casualties. Provide footage of dead Iraqi families to the usual suspects. Ideally, the outrage would be so overwhelming from the cheese-eating surrender monkeys and the peaceniks that GWB would be forced to go back to the U.N. to get yet another resolution.

To make this work, Saddam would have to delegate a lot of authority down to the company and battalion level, and Arab militaries do NOT encourage a lot of independent thought among junior officers. Odds are that most of Saddam's C3 infrastructure is going to hell right off the bat, and some units might fight, others will emulate the fine French military tradition, and the rest will probably stay at home.

 

[SodaPop]

Saddam is setting up for a major suicide strategy and I bet he'll just Anthrax his own people if we move on them. We'll either keep the pressure on Iraq (like we have been) or we'll nuke them. They ain't going down in a kindly fashion. Even if 90% of the Iraqi army surrenders. Iraq isn't Afghanistan. I don't see a Northern Allegiance making sweeping assaults on the Republican Guard.

North Korea is sweating it out because we have so much stuff floating around between the Pacific ocean and the Persian Gulf. They don't like the idea we have so much stuff in the region. I seriously wonder if North Korea already sold nukes to some of the middle east countries. I think there is something much deeper going on with North Korea. I think they know we are on to them. I read several times that Bin Laden has up to 20 nuclear weapons and they are already deployed in Europe and America. I expect them to attack Rome next. If they have a dirty bomb ROME is the target.

 

[xjer]

If I am Iraq
First think is strike Isreal with scuds hard enough Isreal
has to strike back. Goal is to make it Arabs against the
USA and Isreal. Who knows I might have bought a
nuc or 3 of my own.

If I am N.K. I see how the USA versus Irag is going. The
longer it last the harder I push. If USA is in Bagdad in
3 days I shut the hell up and try to negotiate for the
best deal I can. If we are going on 3 weeks and its getting
messy in Iraq. I am going to move on S.K. If USA counters
we go nuclear. Use them before we lose them.

Armchair general

 

[WilderBill]

Irq really dosen't stand a chance.
NK could, conceivably smuggle a nuke into the US for a first strike. I would expect that to be met with a hail of submarine launched nukes inside of a very few minutes, making the first strike also the last they will ever launch.

 

[M1911]

I expect them to attack Rome next. If they have a dirty bomb ROME is the target.

Why Rome?

NK could, conceivably smuggle a nuke into the US for a first strike. I would expect that to be met with a hail of submarine launched nukes inside of a very few minutes, making the first strike also the last they will ever launch.

the problem is, such a smuggled device would not have a return address. How would we know it came from NK and not Osama or Saddam?

 

[KMKeller]

I think Saddam is going to nuke his own people and blame us to try to get the whole war decided in the court of public opinion.

 

[Poodleshooter]

Regarding air superiority...the best place to destroy US planes is on the ground. 5th column activities would be the best for this, or even limited gas/biological attacks to deny or slow down ground crews. Deny our airmen the airfields. However, I doubt Saddam has that extensive of a terror network due to pissing off the rest of the Islamic world, and I doubt he has enough Scuds left to use gas and biologics that far away from his own territory. Not to mention the aircraft based out of Diego Garcia and carriers.

 

[SodaPop]

Why Rome?

Have you ever listened to Bin Laden talk about fighting off the Crusaders? Bin Laden has declared war on Christians and Jews and often referred to Christians as the Crusaders. Rome is right next to Washington and New York as cities that are symbols of the Western world. You might not think that, but the majority of the Islamic world views it that way.

Like George Hill said......Utah is probable safe. I don't know if Bin Laden is going to attack the Mormons in SLC.

 

[George Hill]

"Regarding air superiority...the best place to destroy US planes is on the ground."

Hard to do when the ground is the deck of a carrier.

 

[bogie]

Personally, if I was running the show, and Baghdad proved to be a hard nut to crack:

Day 1) Ensure air superiority

Day 2) Bomb it into the stone age with convention HE weaponry

Day 3 morning) Dump as much gasoline/diesel/whatever on the resulting ruins as possible, using any aircraft available. With ensured air superiority, a C130 and jugs would work fine...

Day 3 afternoon) Light it.

 

[Delmar]

A Bogie barbeque???

 

[RON in PA]

The only way Saddam Hussein is going to reach his next birthday is to go into exile in France (he's their kind of guy).

 

[Scott Evans]

Looking at this again…

If I were Sadam I would realize that there is nothing that my military (on its own) could do to stop the on sloughs of a determined US military. Dig in … and it won’t matter as the air superiority of the US will be able to place ordinance on any target indefinitely.

“Putting on my evil, insane, dictator hat … I pear into the mind of a mad man… and … for a moment become … HIMâ€

I can’t stop US air by force so I must cause the US to voluntary stop.

I will create a fortress out of Baghdad and herd every citizen (man woman and especially children) into it. I will ring my scuds and artillery with kids … two or three million of them. I will inter disperse civilians in areas where my soldiers are. The US will not bomb or use artillery and will be forced into a siege. As the children begin to starve over the following 2-6 months the US will leave. I will stay in power ….[evil laughter]

“taking hat off … slapping face … SNAP OUT OFIT; I scream …â€

 

[bogie]

Actually, what I'd guess that Hussein would do would be to send human virus carriers into the opposing countries...

 

[redneck2]

Unfortunately

Bogie may well be correct.

To repeat....read Revelation

"There shall be wars and rumors of wars"..pestilence, disease, fire raining from the sky...it's all there

....then watch the news

the reason the Germans and French are opposing us is not because they think were wrong. On the contrary, they know we're right about the chemical/bio stuff. Gotta remember, they're part of the "Old" Europe. They have a way different history and perspective than we do. We're the single superpower, and therefore the danger. Any single superpower in the past has always tried to and has dominated the known world (Rome, Alexander the Great, Ghingis Kahn, etc).

We strike Iraq (Garden of Eden), Saddam hits Israel (the predicted strike against Jerusalem), Israel retaliates (maybe nukes) against Syria and Iraq, Arabs unite against the Jews, we hit more Arabs in response. We try to invade Baghdad and Saddam unleashes a massive chemical/bio suicide "last stand"

Now N Korea gets nervous. Their only chance is to damage the already crippled US military by whacking us before we get mobilized. They decide to use one of their nukes to hit the 37,000 american troops in S Korea (see above post) before we can invade them. Seoul is wiped out.

Common Market nations unite (Roman Empire) against the armies of the east (predicted). Oh...think about this...where's your family tree from? Germany, England, Italy, Eastern Europe?? Ooops...part of the Roman Empire.

 

[Nightcrawler]

Iraq will fall quickly, I think. I'm still hoping against hope that Saddam's generals will decide they don't want to die for him and put a round in the back of his head.

Hell, Saddam's TOP BODYGUARD recently defected to Israel....

If I were Prez, I don't know if I'd be doing the same thing. Instead of buildup, I'd have been trying to have Saddam assassinated from my first day in office, instead of engaging in a war that could cost thousands of American lives.

In any case, after Saddam was gone and Iraq was disarmed, I'd pull the US OUT ALTOGETHER. See, one of the reasons the rest of the world hates us is because they think we're imperialist. Socialists in socialists countries are unable to differentiate between American private corporations and the US government; when they see Coke machines they think of it as US Imperialism, though the only think Coke, Pepsi, and other big corporations are loyal to is the bottome line. So, you wouldn't have US occupation. Screw that; our GIs deserve better than to have to sit in that crappy sandbox. Bring 'em home.

Let the Europe and Canada send their blue-helmeted peacekeepers. Then no one can accuse the US of imperialism, I mean hey, everbody loves the Canadians, right? The Canadians love peacekeeping. They have a blue-beret weaing peacekeeper on their $10.00 bill, for crying out loud.

LET THEM do that. As soon as the war is done, BRING OUR GIs HOME.

 

[SodaPop]

Can anyone tell me how many troops we really have called up? I still don't think we have the 200,000 troops in the middle-east. I keep hearing about this 200,000 troops that are going to invade Iraq. Last I heard there were less than 90,000 in the "region".

 

[Sean Smith]

Here is how Iraq can fight and make us lose this war.

1. De-centralize command and biological/chemical/radiological weapon use authority. This is contrary to his natural inclination to centralize control in his hands, but is absolutely necessary because the U.S. will blow out all his communications in the first hours of the war.

2. Move all armed forces into the urban areas. There is no clean, easy way to fight in urban terrain. By doing so, he can deny us a quick victory. Airpower is less relevant when you have to kill lots of civilians to use it. Even the limited airpower used by Task Force Ranger in the Battle of Mogadishu caused immense civilian casualties (bearing in mind that many of the civilians were, in fact, attacking us in the first place). Thus, our "victory" in such a situation is almost certain to cause a public relations disaster.

Remember, Baghdad has a population of over 4,000,000 people... any fighting that takes place there will be a total mess.

3. Make massive use of land mines and demolitions. Use persistent chemical agents and radioactive materials (pre-emplaced bombs would be the best bet) to contaminate large areas. This will almost certainly cause casualties and generally hamper U.S. operations.

4. Arm the population with AKs and RPGs. Again, this will run against Saddam's natural inclination to keep the population helpless. Iraq probably has millions of the stupid things stockpiled. Even if he can get only a small fraction of the general population involved in shooting Americans, it can make for nasty going in congested urban areas.

5. Attack Israel with some chemical/biological/radiological-warhead Scuds. This will by default make him the hero of the vast majority of the Muslims out there. Sad but true. Israel would nuke them, but of course U.S. forces will already be on the ground, which would complicate things.

Iraq would be wasting its time to try to confront our air forces at all, either from the air or the ground; no offense meant to anybody, but it would be hugely moronic to even consider it. Likewise, if they try to fight us in a conventional engagement force-on-force, they are just committing suicide. Urban terrain is a great equalizer.

This course of action will only happen if Saddam has decided to go down in flames and become a hero of the Muslim world for the next 1,000 years. He can't really win, but it is not impossible for him to make us lose... just unlikely he'd take the necessary actions to do so.