Assault Weapon Identification Guide As listed or described in Illinois Compiled Statutes 720 ILCS 5/24-1.9

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Then you might want to look up the videos by Todd Vandermyde - "Freedom's Steel" - and double check.
Mr. Vandemyde's arguments seem to be stretching the law beyond what is written. Although each state court has to decide how their laws are applied, there are other jurisdictions with essentially mirrored language for their large capacity magazine restrictions. None of them have interpreted similar laws to exclude either of these firearms. They have however banned the over-10 round magazines and tube extensions, which is likely how it would be applied here as well. As yet I haven't seen any definitive rules regarding mini shells. I would expect.capacity to be measured based on chambering standard ammunition as marked on barrel and receiver. I cannot think of any shotguns marked specifically for firing mini shells.
 
Former Illinois-ian here.

I note the Henry Homesteader, Ruger PC 9 Carbine, and Ruger Mini-14 Ranch rifle are not on the list.

I visited a friend in Illinois Friday, he mentioned that the only gun owners that have registered their mag fed semi-autos are Police Officers that need them for their job.
There are 2.4 million Foid card / gun owners in Illinois. So far only 1,618 Foid card holders have registered their firearms.

The ban doesn't go into effect till January of 2024.

 
Mr. Vandemyde's arguments seem to be stretching the law beyond what is written.
This is why Legal has the requirement to cite the actual law (as noted above) rather than to discuss opinions on law.

The text of the law is what will be used if a case goes to court and not opinions of people and their interpretations of the law.
Typically, in the "lower" Courts, we cannot interrogate the desires nor intentions of the lawmakers, but their written words can be.

At the Appellate level, if introduced, the "why" of selecting the words used, and whether the desires so written, can pass muster can be argued. As can whether the legislators themselves exceeded their authority in crafting the law.

Keeping the discussions narrow and focused helps keep them on topic, and from wandering far afield into "should be" and similar things that are beyond the ability to legislate.
 
Can't cite it yet but ISRA has been alerted by a "leaker" that Pritzger and Raul have legislation ready to go, if and when their AWB is upheld by the Supremes, which declares an emergency confiscation of the registered weapons and enhances the penalties for those that didn't register.
 
OK. I just read the whole thing again. There is even a flow chart. “Is the shotgun semi automatic. No. Then not AW. Simple enough.
 
Former Illinois-ian here.

I note the Henry Homesteader, Ruger PC 9 Carbine, and Ruger Mini-14 Ranch rifle are not on the list.

I visited a friend in Illinois Friday, he mentioned that the only gun owners that have registered their mag fed semi-autos are Police Officers that need them for their job.
There are 2.4 million Foid card / gun owners in Illinois. So far only 1,618 Foid card holders have registered their firearms.

The ban doesn't go into effect till January of 2024.

Most LE are specifically exempted from having to register their weapons. Doesn't mean that they can't do so, but do not have to; and no distinction is made between work & personal weapons owned by the individual officer. Retired LE are also exempt. Both can continue to acquire the newly prohibited weapons. The whole thing stinks of a "some are more equal than others" Orwellian situation created to squelch potential LE objections to the law.
 
The less we enumerate the non banned stuff the better. This atrocious law allows the ISP to add to the list as necessary. They don't need new ideas or attention brought to "maybe" items.
Maybe I'm paranoid but I fully believe they have people monitoring social media.
 
Former Illinois-ian here.

I note the Henry Homesteader, Ruger PC 9 Carbine, and Ruger Mini-14 Ranch rifle are not on the list.

I visited a friend in Illinois Friday, he mentioned that the only gun owners that have registered their mag fed semi-autos are Police Officers that need them for their job.
There are 2.4 million Foid card / gun owners in Illinois. So far only 1,618 Foid card holders have registered their firearms.

The ban doesn't go into effect till January of 2024.

It doesn't look like people are in a hurry to register their guns.

 
The 2A guarantees us the RIGHT to own a military style arm. Any arm issued to the military from Brown Bess to an M4 should be legal.
The Illinois progressive quintet, Governor, House, Senate, Supreme Court and the media don't give a rats hind end about the Constitution or the uphill of Rights.
 
Enumerates God given rights. All ten. None of which are doing very well while under attack by progressives. If we allow another bulldozed “selection” by the progressives, there will be none.
 
I have never seen any credible evidence that the gun community popularized the term “assault weapon” prior to Josh Sugarmann’s 1988 screed “Assault Weapons and Accessories in America” that the Violence Policy Center ran with, and pushed it insanely hard after the Stockton, CA schoolyard shooting in 1989, or that it was ever mainstream in the gun press as a marketing term for Title 1 semiautos. I have seen some unsupported handwaving that it was once used obscurely in Shotgun News prior to Sugarmann et al, and possibly one gun magazine cover that may or may not have been talking about Title 2 military weapons and that might have been after Sugarmann et al, but nothing more than that.

But as someone who was closely following the gun issue on Fidonet and Usenet at that time, and who subscribed to both G&A and the American Rifleman magazines starting in 1988 or 1989 and still has many of those magazines (plus a couple of ban-era issues of Shotgun News), I can tell you categorically that both the RKBA crowd and the gun press considered “assault weapon” to be a prohibitionist buzzword intended to conflate restricted Title 2 assault rifles with civilian rifles, shotguns, and handguns, and that the view was that “Assault Weapon” was used because Sugarmann et al wanted to use the issue to restrict handguns, not just rifles. The gun control lobby at the time openly acknowledged that long guns were not a crime problem, but Sugarmann’s white paper explained how the “new topic” of scary-looking rifles could be used to resurrect the push for a ban on handguns.

Of course, Sugarmann and the VPC’s efforts ultimately had the opposite effect, launching carry licensure reform/shall-issue while making the AR-15 the most popular rifle in U.S. homes, but their goal at the time was a handgun ban, and the misleading elastic term “assault weapon” was a means to that end.


I strongly disagree. Using the terminology popularized by the prohibitionists just grants them control over the language and terms of the debate. An AR-15 is a small-caliber civilian rifle, not an “assault weapon”. Period.

Having said that, I agree that going all “AKSHUALLY…” against the term “assault weapon” vs. “assault rifle” vs. “civilian Title 1 non-automatic rifle” in a debate about guns with modern styling is often going to be a distraction from addressing the argument itself. Usuallly there are far more effective approaches. But I categorically reject the idea that gun owners should accept/adopt it, because it’s ostensibly no big deal to call civilian guns/ammo “assault weapons” or “Saturday Night Specials” or “bunker busters” or “cop-killer bullets” or “antiaircraft weapons” or “automatic weapons” or what have you. The slogan “assault weapon”, as-used, is a propaganda tool of the gun control lobby, and should be viewed as such, IMNSHO.
I have a 1980 Guns and Ammo publication titled "Guide to Assault Weapons".

Prior to the late 70s early 80s, if you wanted a semiautomatic rifle that fired 5.56 you had your choice between an AR or a Mini 14.

About 1980 there became a huge choice of semiautomatic rifles styled after military rifles.

Having lived through that era "assault rifle" was a term popularized by manufacturers and gun scribes. It was picked up by the antigunners.
 
I have a 1980 Guns and Ammo publication titled "Guide to Assault Weapons".

Prior to the late 70s early 80s, if you wanted a semiautomatic rifle that fired 5.56 you had your choice between an AR or a Mini 14.

About 1980 there became a huge choice of semiautomatic rifles styled after military rifles.

Having lived through that era "assault rifle" was a term popularized by manufacturers and gun scribes. It was picked up by the antigunners.
I would still question the “popularized” part. I lived through that era also, subscribed to multiple gun mags (American Rifleman and G&A), and never heard the term prior to the 1989 USA editorial citing Sugarmann 1988, and never heard it used by anyone but gun-control proponents (although I commonly heard “assault rifle” used in its legitimate context).

In this thread, we now have two verified sources using the term “assault weapon” prior to Sugarmann et al’s 1998 screed, one of which was mostly about Title 2 NFA select-fire rifles, and I can add a third after some reflection (Duncan Long’s book on the history of the mini-14, which also covered the Title 2 models), but I am still not convinced that it was a common/popular usage prior to 1988 and the prohibitionist lurch toward rifle bans.
 
I would still question the “popularized” part. I lived through that era also, subscribed to multiple gun mags (American Rifleman and G&A), and never heard the term prior to the 1989 USA editorial citing Sugarmann 1988, and never heard it used by anyone but gun-control proponents (although I commonly heard “assault rifle” used in its legitimate context).

In this thread, we now have two verified sources using the term “assault weapon” prior to Sugarmann et al’s 1998 screed, one of which was mostly about Title 2 NFA select-fire rifles, and I can add a third after some reflection (Duncan Long’s book on the history of the mini-14, which also covered the Title 2 models), but I am still not convinced that it was a common/popular usage prior to 1988 and the prohibitionist lurch toward rifle bans.
Maybe not in common usage but it was being used by gun scribes in 1980.
 
Here's one from 1986. All the guns shown on the front and back covers (a couple of Galils on the back) are identified inside as semi-auto. The sections (groups of articles) are full-auto (9 articles), semi-autos (8 articles), rimfires (6 articles, including one or two select-fire weapons), and shotguns (5 articles, including one on the Atchisson "Assault 12"). I've also got a 2nd edition of this book, from 1989, which has more focus on full-auto weapons, but still covers several semi-auto and a few manually-operated firearms.

Gun Digest Assault Weapons 1986.JPG
 
Sure. That's the original, technical definition.

But language moves on. "Assault weapon" has taken on a much broader definition, in common usage. And the gun community itself was responsible for spreading this usage. It was a marketing ploy to sell semiautomatic look-alikes.

Insisting on the original definition is pedantic and ineffective. That ship has sailed.
OMG! The voice of reason!!!
 
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OMG! The voice of reason!!!
Reason? It all depends if reason is coming from knowledge of the topic.

This definition of an assault rifle, if you'll allow me to make an analogy. It's like a lay person saying a bat is just like a bird. From now on we'll call bats birds.

A biologist or ornithologist will say we already have birds and bats defined. A bat is a mammal. A bat has all the traits of a mammal but not the traits of a bird. Flight is not even necessary to be a bird.

Then if every lay person on TicTok starts calling bats birds they are still not birds.

Likewise we already have a definition of an assault rifle regardless of how many lay people try to redefine it.
 
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Reason? It all depends if reason is coming from knowledge of the topic.
Everyone who posts on THR has "knowledge of the topic." Everyone one of us, myself included, knows the strict legal definition of the term assault weapon.

The problem is that such legal definition (i.e. select fire) is totally irrelevant. The term assault weapon has been broadly accepted as semi automatic rifle, usually with a detachable clip, oops, I meant magazine. (See what I did there?) Anytime anyone says assault weapon, this is what is broadly understood as to meaning. You know what people mean when they say assault weapon, just like you know what they mean when they say clip.

But never mind all that. The Army issued me an "assault weapon" with select fire. Then they told me to never ever EVER use the full auto (actually, mine was a three round burst) except for final protective fire. So, if even the US Army is using their "assault weapons" like it's an AR15, then an AR15 is an assault weapon. Get over it.

Of all the things to disagree on and divide over. Who cares?
 
Everyone who posts on THR has "knowledge of the topic." Everyone one of us, myself included, knows
Understood. I did not mean you or others on THR don't know the topic. To continue my analogy, I think it's like biologists saying it's so common for lay people to call bats birds that we experts will start using this new definition that anything that flies is a bird.
It's the people that should know better that should resist most the redefining of these terms.
A bird can't be a mammal and an assault rifle must be select fire (fully automatic).
 
Bans are being written by smarter people. They will cover semi-auto weapons of ALL types soon. Arguing about the definition is pissing in the wind and just makes the antis pay attention to the semi vs. manual divide. Yes, raving politicians say ASSAULT RIFLES as it sells for their position. If you listen to media lots of them have figured it out and say military style semi auto long arms or AR styled long arms. Canada and Norway figured out that Mini-14s are dangerous also!!

The PR tactic of emphasizing the lethality of the guns has come back to bite companies in the butt as we see in the lawsuits that such prime lethal nuts.

NYS originally had an Assault Weapon Registration that included the standard ARs, AKs, etc. Now they have Semi-Automatic Rifle License Forms.

Thus, this argument has no influence on current or upcoming bans. Fun for the Internet though.
 
It's the people that should know better that should resist most the redefining of these terms.
And that is our fundamental disagreement. I feel no need to correct others' use of the terminology, even though I know it doesn't square with the legal definition. When someone says "assault weapon," I know what they mean, and their message is effectively communicated. (Same with clip vs magazine.)

Furthermore, I find it disingenuous to make that correction or insist on using the strict legal definition of the term when the military is using their assault weapons in the same manner (predominantly semi auto only) that civilians use an AR15. It comes off as though you are trying to separate the AR15 from the M16 when there is little difference in terms of practical use in so far as which function is used.
 
Continued nattering over terminology after the original question has been answered serves no useful purpose. The definition stated in the law controls operation of the law unless the law is determined by a court to be unenforceable.

From the rules for the legal section: ...Comments and opinions should be based on legal principles and supported where appropriate with reference to legal authority, including court decisions, statutes and scholarly articles.
 
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