Baldwin’s Charges Dropped

[.45Coltguy]

And they are continuing the production of the movie to "honor" the dead director.

I also heard something about a relative of the diseased being made an associate producer or something as part of the wrongful death settlement. Probably so Baldwin can write off the settlement as a production cost and cheat on taxes.

You gotta love those Hollywood Californians! We only killed a person, why should that inconvenience our lives?

Maybe the problems with all the publicized shootings these days have more to do with the cheapening of human lives in Hollywood than it has to do with law abiding gun owners? Nah... that couldn't be... they are liberals so I shouldn't suggest such things!

Hmm. What's Ca have to do with this? Didn't this happen in NM? Ca didn't "pull the trigger". An actor who probably should have known better, is at the center of this, along with the armaror.

 

[Archie]

From everything I could see or determine, Mr. Baldwin is guilty of stupid, not criminal liability. Nothing suggests he was hoping to kill the victim. So the manslaughter charge would be difficult to prove.

The civil court wrongful death action may be more difficult for him.

I will not comment on his reputation and career. I've lost track of that sort of thing.

 

[I6turbo]

It wasn’t. That was an allegation made by attorneys for Baldwin that were later refuted by prosecutors. (Not that defense attorneys ever lie, especially to the press to benefit their case in the jury of public opinion .)

There truly are two standards of justice; one for those with big money and the rest for those without.

This is nothing new, I saw this coming a mile away. This whole poo show is exactly what happens when a famous or really, deep pocketed person gets in trouble as it happens all the time. High dollar attorneys and PR firms go on the public opinion attack using an ever click-hungry press, underfunded (or in this case underfunded and incompetent) prosecutors are on the defensive from day one and start making errors, ultimately the big money person gets case reduced, dismissed or jury finds in their favor.

Oh well.

Stay safe.

^^^ Yep. The "justice" system has been gradually perverted until it's in a shameful mess. As have most other big institutions.

 

[lightman]

I don't agree with the way this played out. I think Baldwin should have been treated the same way that one of us would have been treated and I feel like this didn't happen. But no one ever promised that life is fair.

I'm sort of a bottom line guy. And the bottom line is "who pulled the trigger"?

 

[doubleh]

If it had been you or I we would now be sitting in a cell for, at the very least, some degree of manslaughter. Since Baldwin is a "famous'" Hollywood actor it has taken Santa Fe County this much time to find a big enough rug to sweep this mess under.

 

[Riomouse911]

If it had been you or I we would now be sitting in a cell for, at the very least, some degree of manslaughter. Since Baldwin is a "famous'" Hollywood actor it has taken Santa Fe County this much time to find a big enough rug to sweep this mess under.

This boondoggle will probably cost the DA her seat, which appears to be a good thing since it’s pretty clear she and her senior leadership aren’t performing very well at all.

Stay safe.

 

[DustyGmt]

Be careful what you ask for. I'm not fan of Baldwin. But prosecuting him would have just been a political move by anti-gun folks to punish someone for using a gun

But this would mlnever happen, he is a protected class and the media would never twist the story out of proportion, imagine if it were Chris Pratt or James Woods, then the story would be something else and the appetite for politicians calling on prosecutors for accountability would be ringing in everybody's ears....

 

[Kleanbore]

From everything I could see or determine, Mr. Baldwin is guilty of stupid, not criminal liability. Nothing suggests he was hoping to kill the victim. So the manslaughter charge would be difficult to prove.

Had he been "hoping to kill the victim", the crime would have been murder in the first degree.

Causing death by reckless action with a device known to be dangerous is a serious criminal act.

In New Mexico, the maximum penalty is imprisonment for a ridiculously short term of18 Mo. In many states, Baldwin would likely have died in jail.

 

[bdickens]

From everything I could see or determine, Mr. Baldwin is guilty of stupid, not criminal liability. Nothing suggests he was hoping to kill the victim. So the manslaughter charge would be difficult to prove.

Doing something stupid that you knew or should have known could injure or kill someone is the very definition of criminal liability.

 

[doubleh]

I doubt it. Performance does not account for much in that part of the state. The right party affiliation and the correct surname is what counts. Got one you might get elected, both and you are a shoo-in. The 8 year DA in Bernalillo County went on to be our current attorney general although crime went up a bunch during his county watch. He has both advantages and is just as worthless at his new position as he was at his old. He will probably run for senator or governor next and get elected.

 

[doubleh]

In New Mexico, the maximum penalty is imprisonment for a ridiculously short term of18 Mo. In many states, Baldwin would likely have died in jail.

In NM animal cruelty will get you a stiffer sentence than killing a human. Defend your self? Run away is the best option to stay shy of the law. It has become a very strange place over the years.

 

[JohnKSa]

I think Baldwin should have been treated the same way that one of us would have been treated and I feel like this didn't happen.

If you were an actor and killed another actor on set with a prop gun after being told it was cold, I think you would be treated just like Baldwin has been--with the exception that charges probably wouldn't have been filed in the first place.

Look at the Brandon Lee killing. The actor who pointed the gun and pulled the trigger, killing Lee was never charged. On the other hand, the filmmaker did get sued and lost.

 

[Appalachiannative]

Be careful what you ask for. I'm not fan of Baldwin. But prosecuting him would have just been a political move by anti-gun folks to punish someone for using a gun. A lot of folks just wanted to see him prosecuted because they don't agree with his political stances. That can work both ways.

Folks, actors have been using REAL guns and shooting them with blanks in them at other actors in movies and TV for well over 100 years. It's just how movies have always been made. But because of this I suspect that will change.

Whoever allowed a real bullet to get into that gun is the person responsible. If they later determine that Baldwin was somehow responsible for that then I'll change my mind.

I read an article back when the shooting happened where Bruce Willis said he has never pointed a real gun at someone while filming. He has been in many an action flick and to hear him tell it he always had his gun pointed off to the side of the person he was supposed to be shooting at then they use camera tricks to make it look like he's pointing right at them. Baldwin should be in jail. No he did not commit murder but a person is still dead because of his foolishness that's manslaughter

 

[Mosin77]

I read an article back when the shooting happened where Bruce Willis said he has never pointed a real gun at someone while filming. He has been in many an action flick and to hear him tell it he always had his gun pointed off to the side of the person he was supposed to be shooting at then they use camera tricks to make it look like he's pointing right at them. Baldwin should be in jail. No he did not commit murder but a person is still dead because of his foolishness that's manslaughter

I agree.

I’d say this has more to do with Bruce Willis’ professionalism or firearms acumen than it does the letter of the law though. I think most people who aren’t safety fanatics on gun forums would tend to exonerate the actor who was handed a prop and it killed someone. They’d either call it an accident or blame the propmaster/safety people. Whereas “we” tend to think “a gun is a gun no matter what” and would try to abide by the 4 rules, and blame the guy who pulled the trigger.

I think objectively, the prop person screwed up bad. Someone should have made sure there was no live ammo anywhere it could have made it into the gun. Someone should have kept the gun secured so nobody could put ammo in it. Or made sure it couldn’t chamber live ammo. Someone should have checked the gun before handing it to the actor for the filming of the scene. Someone should have coached the actor on gun safety/following the 4 rules a la Bruce Willis. That person should be charged with something.

And someone (the actor) should not have pointed the pistol at a coworker and pulled the trigger. I’d be more sympathetic to the actor if the accident actually occurred during a take, when it’s necessary and expected for a pistol shot to be filmed, but to my understanding it did not, it was messing around before. So, that, in my opinion, definitely puts some responsibility back on the actor. If my coworker hands me a pistol and tells me it’s clear, I point it another coworker and shoot them dead, the law would probably find me guilty of manslaughter, and I don’t think it’s reasonable to exempt a movie set in general from such.

Finally, it’s my understanding that the actor in this case was also the head producer and this movie is basically his project -so, who’s really responsible? He acted stupidly, but ultimately it was also his personal responsibility as the guy calling the shots, to make certain that his subordinates were following safety procedures. He even boasted about his “gunplay” skills in an interview in 2020.

In my opinion at least two people should be doing some time for this.

 

[Old Dog]

This boondoggle will probably cost the DA her seat, which appears to be a good thing since it’s pretty clear she and her senior leadership aren’t performing very well at all.

Agree, this clearly looks like a case of prosecutorial incompetence. When you can't make a case that the person who pulled the trigger is responsible for the result, frankly, you suck.

Hannah will be hung out to dry even though she had no clue that the prop firearms were being taken off the set by underlings and used for plinking with live ammo, that somehow found its way back to the set. Another assistant took a plea deal, yet the guy who should ultimately be held accountable gets off. This is right up there with the Rodney King beating cops getting off, or OJ skating in the face of overwhelming evidence.

 

[Ignition Override]

Yesterday I saw part of an interview with Baldwin by a media person. Maybe it was from months ago.

When the guy asked Baldwin whether he pulled the trigger, Never In My Life have I seen a person answer a question with such tension, abruptness and nervousness. Never.

Baldwin even referred to ".our training with handguns..." , or such. He quickly blurted that out and these must have been memorized words his lawyer taught him to say.

? I can't remember the summary of how the "safety staff ('armorer')" erred so much, but wouldn't mind finding a clear explanation, if it ever was explained.

 

[danmc]

There are published saftey guidelines for use of firearms in movie production. A link was provided to them on a High Road thread last year. The four rules of firearm safety are part of them. Those on set are supposed to be familiar with them and a safety meeting is supposed to be held prior to use. The standards of the profession were violated, most severely when a firearm was pointed at another person. A human death resulted, and one of the key violators is not being held answerable.

 

[Archie]

Doing something stupid that you knew or should have known could injure or kill someone is the very definition of criminal liability.

Correct. Now all the prosecutor (you) have to do is prove beyond a reasonable doubt he he new or should have known his action was directly and incontrovertibly lead to the death of someone else. Anyone being sure of the fact without any proof the court will accept is less than what is needed.

The fact he is a pompous twit does not prove culpability.

 

[Waveski]

Call me a Monday morning quarterback but -
From the day of the shooting I’ve told anyone who would listen that Baldwin would not be held accountable due to his class status.
Freedom from responsibility for one’s actions is a hallmark of his ilk.

 

[Kleanbore]

Correct. Now all the prosecutor (you) have to do is prove beyond a reasonable doubt he he new or should have known his action was directly and incontrovertibly lead to the death of someone else.

Slam dunk, from the legal standpoint. Everyone is aware that guns can kill.

 

[bdickens]

Correct. Now all the prosecutor (you) have to do is prove beyond a reasonable doubt he he new or should have known his action was directly and incontrovertibly lead to the death of someone else. Anyone being sure of the fact without any proof the court will accept is less than what is needed.

The fact he is a pompous twit does not prove culpability.

Are you being deliberately obtuse?

Anyone with three functioning brain cells to rub together knows that guns can kill.

Anyone using potentially dangerous tools (this would include guns) in any capacity is responsible for knowing and following proper safety precautions.

Baldwin deliberately violated published industry standards which include measures that go above and beyond the Four Rules.

As producer, Baldwin is directly responsible for the safety of cast and crew.

The labor dispute that caused union crewmembers to walk off was over -- wait for it -- unsafe working conditions.

And that does prove culpability.

 

[hso]

Seems more smoke than light being generated now.