BE-86

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There is not much data on BE-86 in 40S&W, so I decided to work up a few loads in 40.

I have been impressed with the performance of the BE-86 loads, with basically all of them grouping good. Some obviously better, and others with just one flyer.

Following is the chrono data from my test today, and two of the better groupings.

Testing was done with a SIG P229 at 10yards from a rest with standard combat sights and a 3.9" barrel. The chrono was about 9ft in front of the barrel.

SIG, P229, 40S&W, 2.9" barrel
COL: 1.125"
Xtreme, 165gr, RNFPHPCB, BE86, 5.8gr, CCI500
Average: 887
ES: 8
SD: 3.8
Force: 288
PF: 146
Velocities: 883, 890, 890, 884, 891
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SIG, P229, 40S&W, 2.9" barrel
COL: 1.125"
Xtreme, 165gr, RNFPHPCB, BE86, 5.9gr, CCI500
Average: 920
ES: 41
SD: 15.7
Force: 310
PF: 151
Velocities: 896, 937, 928, 925, 914

SIG, P229, 40S&W, 2.9" barrel
COL: 1.125"
Xtreme, 165gr, RNFPHPCB, BE86, 6gr, CCI500
Average: 932
ES: 31
SD: 11.7
Force: 318
PF: 153
Velocities: 914, 945, 939, 933, 931

SIG, P229, 40S&W, 2.9" barrel
COL: 1.125"
Xtreme, 165gr, RNFPHPCB, BE86, 6.1gr, CCI500
Average: 949
ES: 21
SD: 8.3
Force: 330
PF: 156
Velocities: 943, 941, 962, 951, 951

SIG, P229, 40S&W, 2.9" barrel
COL: 1.125"
Xtreme, 165gr, RNFPHPCB, BE86, 6.2gr, CCI500
Average: 965
ES: 36
SD: 14.4
Force: 341
PF: 159
Velocities: 948, 957, 964, 984, 976

SIG, P229, 40S&W, 2.9" barrel
COL: 1.125"
Xtreme, 165gr, RNFPHPCB, BE86, 6.3gr, CCI500
Average: 988
ES: 24
SD: 10.3
Force: 358
PF: 163
Velocities: 985, 998, 1001, 983, 977
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Tried my first loads with BE-86 this week. Although I bought it primarily for the .40, I was working on some new .357 loads, so that is what I tried first. This is not really a magnum powder, but what the heck...

Using Zero 125g JHP-c bullets, I tried 8.0 and 8.5 grains. The ES for both was pretty bad out of my 7 1/2" Blackhawk - 72 and 68 respectively for 10 rounds. Average speed was 1210 +/- 20, and 1253 +/- 15. both loads shot about 3-4" groups at 25 yards.
 
Mauser69 said:
Tried my first loads with BE-86 this week. Although I bought it primarily for the .40, I was working on some new .357 loads, so that is what I tried first. This is not really a magnum powder, but what the heck...

Using Zero 125g JHP-c bullets, I tried 8.0 and 8.5 grains. The ES for both was pretty bad out of my 7 1/2" Blackhawk - 72 and 68 respectively for 10 rounds. Average speed was 1210 +/- 20, and 1253 +/- 15. both loads shot about 3-4" groups at 25 yards.
Click to expand...

It seems to me that BE-86 also needs a bit more pressure to perform well, which is also the way I look at CFE Pistol. This is the reason why I lowered the COL on my 40S&W loads. This gave me better chrono performance and the accuracy was better than what I have had before.

For 38/357 it seems you will just have to up your charge and see what you get. I see the Alliant data shows a max of 9.1gr for a 125gr JHP. Not all bullets are the same, but since you have a chrono, you should be able to slowly and safely up the charge to see if you see any improvement.
 
Reading this and other threads about BE-86, a few months ago I decided to look for a pound to try it out for my 9mm, .45acp, and now my .38/.357Well, I have not found a pound of it anywhere. But I did locate an 8lb keg at Sportsman's Warehouse! I hemmed and hawed, wandered around the store thinking "should I fork out $150 for a powder I've never tried before?" I've never bought an 8lb keg of anything!

Finally, I decided to bite. It seems to be so flexible and so well liked, that it seems I just could not go wrong with this powder in my handgun loads. With the possible exception of .357 magnum, which I am just beginning to explore, I believe this should be a wise decision. I can use my Unique, Universal, and Red Dot playing with my shotgun loads. ------

Now, to peruse the Alliant data and review this BE-86 megathread!
 
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One of my favorite loads for 357mag is 7.6gn of BE86 behind 158gn plated bullets. Gives me about 1050fps out of a 5" GP100.
 
Thanks Top. I like plated bullets in my 9mm, so I'll definitely look at your recommendation.
 
Toprudder you must have been looking in my basement window. I get almost the same numbers, a few fps more out of my 6" and slightly more than that out of my Smith 19
 
Toprudder said:
One of my favorite loads for 357mag is 7.6gn of BE86 behind 158gn plated bullets. Gives me about 1050fps out of a 5" GP100.
Click to expand...

Toprudder, thanks for sharing your load.

I have received some RMR 158gr bullets in a PIF from Dudedog, and is planning on doing a load workup using BE-86. Your listed load is part of my load range, and I will definitely report my results in this BE-86 thread.

Testing will be done with a 3" Ruger SP101 and based on your data it looks like I can expect around 980fps out of the 3" barrel.
 
I have been doing quite a bit of load development these days so figured I would post it in case it helps somebody out. These are just for reference so please don’t use them untested. This is all for 9mm and they were all fired from a smith and wesson 986 5” revolver with the data gathered from a magnetospeed sporter chrono.

These are factory loads so I had a reference. Federal HST 124gr and American Eagle 124gr FMJ.

Charge AVG ES SD
HST 1153 22 9
AE124 1034 26 10

This is with federal once fired brass, cci primers, and hornady hap 125gr bullets
The goal here was to get a minor power factor load plus get something close to the above two factory loads.

Charge AVG ES SD
5.6 1164 64 23
5.4 1104 30 11
5.2 1079 57 20
5.0 1053 35 12
4.9 1032 40 13
4.8 1026 61 25

This is with new lapua brass, federal primers, and berry 147gr plated bullets
The goal here was to closely match the federal GMM 38 special 148gr wadcutter load but with 9mm. This grouped very very well.

Charge AVG ES SD
3.6 763 30 10
3.4 719 76 24
3.3 686 22 9
3.2 659 40 13
 
OK based on the previous I thought hey I've got some X-Treme 147gr plated lets load up a few and get the chrony data for that and post it.

What I got for readings today has me floored. I do not understand what has happened here. But a little background so others can opine on the issue. First, My barrel is 4.52" so I'm less than mjtrippers and expected to not be developing quite as much pressure as his load. My plunk test is 2.110 with this exact bullet. That won't feed in the magazine but that's what the barrel gives me. Alliant publishes a load with a 147 JHP max charge 5.1gr BE-86 that they say will develop 1020 fps. I have tested a Hornady XTP with 4.5gr and got an average of 982 fps OAL 1.13

So today I load up 5 rounds of X-Treme 147gr plated with 3.6gr of BE-86 at an OAL of 1.17. CCI 500 primer, mixed headstamp brass. I got an avg of 1671 FPS in the first group. :what:
5 rounds 1669-1678-1676-206-1662. The 206 has got to be a bad read so I threw it out.

I then loaded 2 rounds at 3.4gr expecting to tame the load some and got 1726 and 1746 fps from those two.

Things to note:
Clean holes in the paper. No keyholing.
Never in my short span of testing loads with the chrony have I seen such a close group of FPS as that first 5 round group. I'm betting if I did 5 rounds in the second it would be similarly close but while my gun is rated for +P I have no desire to be pushing things like that and stopped right there.
The brass is fine. No signs of pressure or blown out primers. The first group of 5 I thought looked a little sooty.

I'm at a loss as to what is going on here. I expected to see readings under 1000 fps.
 
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I'm pretty sure that is a chrono error, you might have been too close to it, or the lighting threw the sensors off.

4.2 grains CFE-P, a max load under a 147 gr Berry RN, gives me around 950-960 fps.
 
2:30-3:00 PM with mostly sunny skies. Weather report said 10-15 mph wind. It didn't even rock the chrony on the tripod. It has the IR light kit and they were turned on. Chrony was in the same place I have been putting it, nearly 10 feet away.

Plus:
Data from 3/27/16
5 rounds of X-Treme 147 gr plated RN
BE-86 4.5 gr OAL 1.13 FPS 1033/987/959/978/953

The two things different between today and then besides powder weight are:
I cleaned the bejeezus out of the gun several days ago and this is the first time I have shot it since.
The OAL today 1.17 and in March it was 1.13
 
Still pretty much has to be a chrono error, even if you can't see how. You started out with a load that should compare with others recently tested, and you got more than DOUBLE the speed?? Then you reduced that load and got even faster? That is just not gonna happen.

Only way to be sure is probably to take some known good loads and a couple of those wonky X-Treme loads out at the same time. Shoot the known good ones first, and record the speeds - if all looks good, then shoot the new ones that gave the unrealistic numbers before and see if the numbers look more real.
 
Agree Mauser, that's the plan for today. Later as I thought about what happened I wondered if I had flipped the switch to meters instead of feet but that would have resulted in crazy low numbers not what I saw.

I'll start with a known factory round and then throw a few other loads across the chrony and see what gives.
 
Oh hallelujah. :confused:

Winchester white box 115gr 1037 fps
Hornady XTP 147gr 4.5gr BE-86 948 fps

X-Treme 147gr RN 3.6gr BE-86 820 fps

I wish I knew what jacked the earlier readings so much. And so consistently.
 
I have browsed all pages of this thread and since it started more and more are testing this powder. While I prefer 2400 in 357, this powder does very well but I am left with a couple pounds I picked up and am curious. Is there a cartridge this powder is superior to than other tried and true powders that I should explore more.
 
Anselhazen I too have had some erronious readings using extreme plated bullets, like 4500 fps from a .45 acp. Problem is they are to darn shiny. Paint em with a majic marker and you will see the kind of results you expect.
Also I've had problems if the chrono is too close, with power pistol it will measure muzzel blast instead of the bullet.
Hope this helps
 
brutus51 said:
Anselhazen I too have had some erronious readings using extreme plated bullets, like 4500 fps from a .45 acp. Problem is they are to darn shiny. Paint em with a majic marker and you will see the kind of results you expect.
Also I've had problems if the chrono is too close, with power pistol it will measure muzzel blast instead of the bullet.
Hope this helps
Click to expand...

Hah, yes they really are blistering shiny aren't they.

The good thing about this incident is I learned stuff. The next time I get readings that are totally wacked I will take a harder look at what is it about the environment that I'm shooting in that might be affecting what is going on. Make changes like the ones suggested in the thread Goldie linked to.
 
Glad you got that worked out, those are were some fast velocities. I try to always test some factory loads with my chrono just to get a baseline going.
 
They were, and I am new enough at all this that I couldn't just shrug it off as a bad read. One or two of the crazy numbers and I'd have been sufficiently perplexed to say hey what's going on here. A whole string and I had to consider it might have been real. Especially since that's the first time the chrony has ever given me bum data.

Looking back on it the evidence didn't add up. No pressure signs on the cases, and the first shot of the second group where I lowered the charge to 3.4 caused the second round to fail to feed. That's what my gun will do if the round isn't stout enough. I'll try some at 3.5gr and see if those will cycle the slide.

Should have some 147gr RN coated from Eggleston Munitions hitting the mailbox soon. I'll post data on those too. :)
 
ericuda said:
I have browsed all pages of this thread and since it started more and more are testing this powder. While I prefer 2400 in 357, this powder does very well but I am left with a couple pounds I picked up and am curious. Is there a cartridge this powder is superior to than other tried and true powders that I should explore more.
Click to expand...

While I have not exactly found an "superior" cartridge for this powder, what I have found is that it makes an excellent substitute for mid range loads where unique was previously my powder of choice. especially when used through a progressive press.

I will add the caveat, that I would suspect side by side, cartridge by cartridge loading, one may still find unique would have the edge in depth of flexibility and sheer usable range- but for my particulars, i ended up completely replacing it with be86.
 
ericuda said:
I have browsed all pages of this thread and since it started more and more are testing this powder. While I prefer 2400 in 357, this powder does very well but I am left with a couple pounds I picked up and am curious. Is there a cartridge this powder is superior to than other tried and true powders that I should explore more.
Click to expand...
As far as accuracy goes, I've not found a more accurate 9mm powder (thus far) than BE-86.
 
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