Beautiful Winchester Model 12's

[JMCCARDLE]

Hello Members,
I am interested in acquiring more knowlege regarding a pair of fine model 12's inherited by my wife from her stepmother's stepfather. He was the original owner and I believe he purchaced them prior to 1957. One 12 ga., one 20 ga. Both are heavily engraved with hunting scenes depicting hunter, dog, male and female pheasants, outdoor scene, and marvelous scroll work along top of barrel, side plates trigger guard. The bolt and follower are covered with a round swirl pattern. The work was stated by my mother in law to have been done in Japan by famous engraver between 1957-1961, not verified.
They both have ivory inlay of diamonds in the forestock and under the pistol grip. Both have plain barrels. Hunter, dog, pheasant are silver bass relief.

My local gun dealer described them like this:
20 ga. full choke, like new, professionally heavily engraved, original wood not cut down, original butt plate, bore perfect. 13¾" LOP. Serial Number 1319696.

12 ga. 98%metal, 80%wood, professionally engraved. 13¾" LOP including rubber butt pad. Stock cut down to accomodate butt pad. Choke not described but believed to be full also. Serial Number: 1669436

He stated the 20 ga. to be slightly rarer, valuing it at $2000 plus. The 12 ga. valuing it at $1200 plus.
The wood is nice but nothing fancy. Their condition is excellent to perfect and way too nice to hunt with.

I have many pictures that may be seen if requested from me by email.
I am looking to sell them as a pair only, thank you. Jack
PS, I found out that the 20ga. was made in 1951, and the 12ga. was made in 1957.
I have posted some photos on the thread, "Dating Model 12's by serial number"

 

[RonE]

Was the stepmothers stepfather in the service. These guns sound like some of the guns that were sold in the PX or Navy Exchange in Japan after the war and engraved by the Japanize to order for American servicemen. Being a military dependant, I saw many such rifles and shotguns that were brought back from Japan. My father was a pilot and used to bring engraved guns back for people that ordered them and wern't there to pick them up when they were finished. Just a thought.

 

[JMCCARDLE]

Hi Ron,
Yes he was a master seargent in the Air Force. I found out from another member that the 20 ga. was made in 1951 and the 12 ga. in 1957. (per Fjestad's Blue Book). He was stationed in Japan from 1957-1961, so it appears that he owned the 20 ga. prior to going there.
My local dealer said that some Winchester shotguns were factory engraved. My mother in law doesn't know for sure if they were engraved there, but has some vague recollection of him telling her that they were. Not sure, and I cannot find anything about factory engraving patterns. I feel that the patterns themselves could tell the story, but no luck so far.
Thanks for the interesting comments about being able to buy them in the PX or BX at that time.
I am a veteran of the US Army, 1973 - 1978. I did my overseas tour in South Korea in 76, and our PX did not carry any firearms. I would not have had time to shoot them anyway, spending most of my time in the field training!
Have a great day. Jack

 

[mswestfall]

I looked up your serial numbers and find that the 20 gauge was made in 1952 and the 12 gauge in 1958.

The guns look like "Pigeon Grade" versions made by Winchester. I do not see a vented rib on either gun so I'm guessing that they are not "Trap" guns. They would say "Trap" on the the barrel; left hand side just forward of the receiver.

My Dad was stationed in Okinawa in the USAF from 1954-1957. PM me. There's an outside chance that I will have a picture or two for you.