best semi auto rifle ever built?

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King thanks for the info and I stand corrected. I have a marlin 1894CB and love it. Still I wouldn't jeer at anyone suggesting a 22 is the best semi automatic ever just based on the production numbers and popularity. The 10/22 has a vast aftermarket to turn it into just about anything you want from faux machine pistols to very accurate target rifles.

Just another note concerning McArthur. I wish Truman would of let him put the FULL smack down on North Korean and China. We wouldn't be reading what we are reading in the paper today with a unified Korea.
 
Best semi-auto rifle ever?

Browning take-down .22LR.

Don't know what the Browning model is but they are still making them. Got mine in '74, Granddad got his Remington made version during the Great Depression.
 
QUOTE:
Patton believed it was the M1 Garand, and considering what was accomplished with that rifle, I can't argue with his ghost.

Patton was correct when he said that in the mid-1940s, when the Garand was competing with (mostly bolt action) rifles. I don't think he would say that today. A battle rifle than isn't magazine-fed has serious drawbacks in the
21st Century.
__________________
 
browning BAR

its been around forever and its FN 20 round brother is great too!
 
It was China that pushed the button for WWIII to start.

Not really. The U.S. backed the Chinese Nationalist Party under Chiang Chou-t'ai. The Chinese Communists were right to be concerned about U.S. efforts to retake China, and had therefore warned the U.S. (and de facto proxies) not to cross the 38th Parallel. MacArthur initially obeyed his orders to only let Korean troops in the areas nearest the Chinese border, but then rescinded them. This was disobeying a direct order, but of course not the first time he had done so.

It was only after this that the Chinese troops crossed the Yalu in October 1950.

But enough history. Feel free to email me, if you want.

J
 
browning BAR

I carried one for a bit as an enlisted man, and actually used one in Viet Nam. A great gun, but too heavy and with too little ammo capacity. A lighter belt-fed version with a quick change barrel would be ideal.

You guys are talking about two different BARs, the one's a 30-06 machine gun from WWII (and I want one) and the other's a modern semi in 338 and more.

But I think it's clear that whatever is the best semi, it's NOT the mini 14 :)
 
I am late to the party but I will say that obviously, different rifles excel in different situations.
Personally, I think the M1A and the Mini-14 are outstanding rifles and preferable in many ways to other choices.
Second choice: An HK 91 is probably the best, all around, SHTF type rifle.
 
The scope mounting rail is intentionally longer than the optic to allow Night Vision Devices, such as the PVS-14, to be mounted to the rifle in front of the objective bell of the optic.
By the time you get all that stuff mounted, the rifle will be so top-heavy and unbalanced that it will sure need that huge bipod! :D

I am sure matching your taste in aesthetic preference wasn't as high on their list as getting a functional optic mounted to the rifle and in the hands of the troops.
Shiny stuff is never functional for military weapons. :scrutiny:

It's probably easily to direct you to Smith Enterprise's website for details on the stock and other internal modifications they make to the rifle.
Thank you for the reference.

But the Picitanny rail on the right allows the user to mount infrared lasers and illuminaters like the PEQ-2 or a visible white light like a Surefire. These are combat multipliers that increase the soldier's ability to identify threats and engage targets quickly and accurately. For a long time, the primarily complaint with the M14 was its inability to accept these accessories.
All these silly rail things and desire to bolt gizmos onto weapons! It just makes them heavier, bulkier, and fragile.

KISS is always a good principle. For a good example of a real sniper rifle, let's consider the No4 MkI(T) or its 7.62 successor, the L42A1. Fool-proof Lee-Enfield action. Simple, light, fixed power scope. A rugged, accurate, low-tech package that (amazingly enough!) helped to win several wars despite the complete absence of bipod, laser range-finder, night vision illuminator or similar "accessories". :cool:
 
By the time you get all that stuff mounted, the rifle will be so top-heavy and unbalanced that it will sure need that huge bipod!

Amazing how it works out almost like it was planned that way?

Shiny stuff is never functional for military weapons.

Which is why the scope isn't shiny. It's matte and colored a distinct light brown that looks [GASP!] strangely similar to the color of the ground visible behind it. Again, it's almost as if they planned it that way...

All these silly rail things and desire to bolt gizmos onto weapons! It just makes them heavier, bulkier, and fragile.

It does make them heavier and bulkier, and a to degree, more fragile. But it doesn't "just" make them such things. These things are combat multipliers. By necessity, they are going to be put on any rifle taken into combat today. If the government decided to adopt your precious Enfield, it would still have these things on it.

When you're cursing the lack of field of view, the lack of depth perception, the monochromic green, the weight on your head, and yet another thing to carry batteries for, it's easy to hate the PVS-14. When you then realize that it is pitch black outside, but you can still see well enough to identify facial expressions on an enemy over a hundred yards away, long before he can see you or even knows you're there, you suddenly realize you hate the thing, but it works. And for as long as it works, it's worth the weight, the two dimensional, limited field of view, the batteries, and the risk it will break. Same thing with the PEQ-2. It's a little bulky and kind of a PITA to sight in, but having the option of an infrared laser that is going to put a dot directly where the bullet is going to go regardless of cheek weld, shoulder weld, or shooting position, you think--this is pretty cool. And when you kick down the door of a dark house and emerge on the other side in a dark room, the inhabitants tend to like it, eventually if not at the time, if you take the time to splash 125 lumens of white light in their faces and identify them as unarmed civilians rather than dusting the room with automatic rifle fire, even if they are temporarily blinded and confused by it when it occurs.

These things are combat multipliers. It means they multiply the effect a unit has in combat. Any rifle the US goes into battle with is going to have them. This is a good thing. For as long as the disgruntled goat farmers we are fighting only have your Enfields, they will continue to give us an advantage that will keep us alive by allowing us to kill them when we get on target faster and more precise than them and are often able to see them better than they see us.

Of all the issue pieces of gear available to the modern Marine infantryman, the RCO was distinguished as the greatest increase in firepower available to the Marine since the inception of the M1 Garand. That would be Rifleman Combat Optic, a 4x version of the Trijicon ACOG equipped with a dual illumination system and a built in BDC/rangefinder. It comes equipped as standard issue on all M16A4 rifles issued in the fleet. It is so rugged, it is the only piece of gear I never saw a Marine break. So rugged, in fact, that the Marines don't even issue rear sights on their rifles any more. They aren't needed. So while this gear can fail, most of it is far from fragile. And even if it fails, it can be quickly removed, which means at worst, the soldier is only as poorly equipped as the person he's fighting.

Weight is still an infantryman's nemesis. Most are quick to shed every ounce of weight they feel they can part with and still remain effective. So even against orders, none of these things would make it outside the wire if the soldiers carrying it didn't feel like it was worth the weight.
 
The FAL, from what I can remember it was given away by European countries to as many 3rd world countries as possible to make way for newer better rifles, lighter, more reliable, more accurate rifles. Anyone I knew who had experience with the FAL in combat complained about them being too long, too heavy, and not being very reliable.
You're kidding right :) I never knew any guy who didn't like them. As for lack of reliability ... (repeat the above) you're kidding right :) The FAL was ready for anything anywhere anytime and in any conditions ... and the 90 or so countries that adopted them did so only because they were "given" them? I don't think so. Sure the FAL wasn't and isn't the most accurate battle rifle that ever was but it sure was accurate enough to get the job done well. Is it /was it the best battle rifle ever ... I don't think so even though I have a good one. Still got to love the (non magazine fed) Garand though. Times and technology have changed, that's for sure. But then again ... hasn't everything.
 
Another vote for MT, but I do have to say that the possibility to add different gadgets to a weapon does not mean they actually are all the time, KISS applies here too, soldier keeps on the weapons only those things that are actually needed, while others may be in the rucksack or whatever. Thermal sight is a wonderful thing, I even saw the place where "enemy combatant" had been a while ago and site was still warmer than surrounding ground. But I wouldn't keep it on all the time, only when it's actually needed.

Best is subjective, depending on many things, but for me it would be this baby (open sights are good, but optical sight is better - view of the world through optical sight is much more realistic):

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And I like it's clean lines, it looks much more graceful/slim than HK G3 (shorter and more bulkier) for comparison. And it could be tuned to suit whatever the need is, within the weapon's capabilities of course, it's not the best choice for CQB or shooting someone in the face a mile away. But the best additions are optical sight, suppressor, and a quick-mount bipod (to keep it off if not needed).
 
I vote for the M1A and the 10/22, I have both plus a pair of AR15's.

What most people do not talk about is what would our future enemies have in weapons and armor, where will our battles be and at what point will the average gun owning American have to use his/her choice as a defensive weapon?

Will we be facing invasions of a foreign nation? Not hardly unless there was a massive killoff of most of America, a gun behind every blade of grass is truly a profound deterrent to our enemies. Lets suppose a civil war was repeated and all of America armed as it is now had to shoot at possibly its neighbors or brothers? The killing field then so to speak would most likely be raids and skirmishes, sniping and probably the use of lots of body armor and police raids.

To me I would choose an ammunition with superior 200 yard or less penetration that would deliver enough energy to at the least incapacitate the wearer of the latest body armor, shots any further would fall into a different category such as snipers, in that respect at the bottom end I would chose the .308, the .338 Lapua and the the 50BMG.

Any platform with the 5.56 I think should be kept as light as possible and compact, I would keep this caliber for in close suburban problems such as in buildings or where the enemy may be in numbers, myself I have little faith in the 5.56/.223 unless its superior bullets like frangibles or steel cored AP bullets, best advantage I see is of course you can haul more ammo but for the average American there would be little chance of surviving an encounter with a more equipped enemy, best to give out something strong enough to suppress fire and light armor and then egress to attack again. I will probably upgrade my ARs to the 6.5 or 6.8 caliber.

The modern day hunting version BAR in .338 would be my choice for heavy firepower from a semi-auto. The M1A with some replacement parts can handle 180gr bullets but its suggested in stock form to use up to 168gr. A .338 can fire much heavier bullets such as Barnes all copper solids. I would say its not a matter of THE best but the best for what you are facing.

For getting food on the table the 10/22 is my first choice with the Mini 14 close.

For urban social work anything in 7.62x39, an excellent cartridge for 100 yard shots. Here is where the simple SKS works well.

For under 400 yards the .308 in the M1A is my choice, I have never owned or fired a Garand but the 30-06 is the best cartridge around for variety in bullet weights from light to heavy, if anything I would like to see a modernized version of a Garand produced, lighter, magazine fed, able to be solidly scoped.

I love the M1A but its not for the average person, it is heavy and would tire an average person if they had to wear it 24/7 such as most Israelis do. To me it is basically a prone firing gun best used with a bipod and quality optical gear both long range and night vision. I would say thats probably its best use and more than likely what an average person would have a use for. Myself I would build my M1A with a rail system that would be able to use any current long range optic with night vision/thermal imaging, whatever I can afford to give me an edge. Fire as few shots of limited ammunition, make them count, no sense in spraying lead in a flood of bullets hoping to get lucky, not unless you have a massive supply of bullets for many years.
 
The guy is smoking crack, if you ask me.

I'm not a Mini-hater. In fact, I happen to own one myself. I think it's a fine little carbine for its intended purpose and lots of fun, too. But anyone who calls it the best semi-auto rifle ever built is probably on some sort of mind-altering substance.
 
M14 transformed into the modernized and enhanced Crazy Horse M21A5 EBR SASS

H2O-M14-2.jpg


The VFG is not essential kit.
 
the disgruntled goat farmers we are fighting
This sort of disparaging remark reminds me of all the racist slurs that were commonly applied to the VC/NVA. And we all know how that one ended. :scrutiny:
 
And when you kick down the door of a dark house and emerge on the other side in a dark room, the inhabitants tend to like it, eventually if not at the time, if you take the time to splash 125 lumens of white light in their faces and identify them as unarmed civilians rather than dusting the room with automatic rifle fire, even if they are temporarily blinded and confused by it when it occurs.

Okay...so you're saying it's logical to tart up an M14 to make it a SDM-type rifle- adding significantly more weight than it already had to begin with, and then go kick doors in with it?!

As far as "disgruntled goat farmers"- that seems to indicate a popular uprising. Most of the folk we're fighting aren't even native to the countries we're engaging them in, so "goat farming" has nothing to do with their occupation, which is in fact imported insurgent/terrorist. :rolleyes:

John
 
Is it logical to tart up an AR? An AK or FAL?

The discussion at this point was really about suitability for mission. The type of accessories that would make a firearm more practical for hitting targets at 450 meters may not be the ones that would be most useful for clearing rooms, and vise versa. Unless you disagree, in which case, I must be wrong. :rolleyes:

I mean, seriously? You really think a bipod and high-power optic are going to be what you need at 4 meters?

John
 
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