BG pats down CPL holder; good approach to police after SD event

[aaaaa]

This seems like a really smart way to approach police after having to shoot a BG:
". . . approached officers with his hands over his head and told them he owns a concealed pistol license. He said he had fired a shot in self-defense while being robbed outside the store."
Article link.
The other thing is that when you are carrying and are robbed, you might lose your gun to the BG, which is not good. This one came out good but I can imagine a lot of times it would not work out so good:

While holding a black, semi-automatic handgun in one hand, Fordham [the BG] patted down the CPL holder with the other, according to police. As he was being patted down, the CPL holder pulled out his gun and fired a shot, authorities said.

Thankfully, it appears the BG's gun jammed.

That seems a very precarious situation and one that any advice would vary case-by-case, but thoughts on that situation, even like you give the BG a wallet and he says "what is in the other pocket" (perhaps one disadvantage to pocket carry). Then what do you do/say?

 

[CDW4ME]

The other thing is that when you are carrying and are robbed, you might lose your gun to the BG
That seems a very precarious situation and one that any advice would vary case-by-case, but thoughts on that situation,
even like you give the BG a wallet and he says "what is in the other pocket"
Then what do you do/say?

I might lose it if they shoot me and then take it; me voluntarily giving a robber my gun is very unlikely.
I do not think compliance ensures my safety and will act accordingly.
I'm not having a conversation, I'm taking action.

 

[aaaaa]

I might lose it if they shoot me and then take it; me voluntarily giving a robber my gun is very unlikely.
I do not think compliance ensures my safety and will act accordingly.
I'm not having a conversation, I'm taking action.

So basically a gunfight vs a potential execution by the BG. Ok, makes sense.

 

[fastbolt]

This is a tactics-related question, and like all such questions, the answer is situationally dependent. In other words ... it depends.

On the other hand, hopefully the state will put this violent criminal behind bars for a lot longer this time.

FWIW, the Ruger might've experienced a stoppage due to various factors, including both ammunition and shooter related. If the suspect tried to fire the weapon after being wounded by the victim (CPL holder), it's understandable he might've lost his ability to exert a sufficiently firm grip due to his reaction to being wounded.

 

[wayneinFL]

That's a tough one. Glad it worked out for him.

In my mind you have three options- comply, get distance and pull your gun, or go for the robber's gun. If he gets your gun, he can shoot you. But he already has a gun, so he could have done that anyway. As long as you're not being abducted, you might just want to comply.

He gets to tell all his friends how he got the drop on somebody, and you have an excuse to buy a new gun. Everybody wins. Unless you get shot, which you will probably get shot anyway if you resist.

I had a friend who was robbed in Valdosta. I guess they're used to robbing people who are armed, because one of them help a pistol on him, another held a shotgun on him, and a third went through his pockets. He shouldn't have let them sneak up on him. He was on the phone and wasn't paying attention.

 

[Old Dog]

Appears some of the bad guys have figured out that some citizens might have money or other valuable on the person not in the traditional wallet (a new smartphone probably being this micreant's target).

Pat searches by street muggers? Well, we do provide them with their initial pat search training upon their first arrest, and then they get their in-service training almost daily when in the jail or prison population. Would like to see the video and scrutinize this guy's technique...in might speak to the quality of "training" he received from the deputies at Wayne County Jail or in the MDOC system.

Detroit police officers said they reviewed surveillance footage from the store on Feb. 9. It showed Fordham wearing a Detroit Lions jacket and black ski mask and following the two men from the store, according to authorities. Sheesh. Even the thugs are jumping on the Lions bandwagon. And I'll bet the dude doesn't even ski, which begs the question of why anyone would just walk into a business after seeing someone loitering outside with his face fully covered. In my old business, that there was what we called "a clue."

It would seem the intended victim did recover his situational awareness by drawing his gun after hopefully noting the suspect was pointing his weapon at his friend, rather than him.

 

[GBExpat]

WHEW! Sounds to me like that CPL Holder had his Chill dialed up. If I were him I would not waste any money on lottery tickets for awhile, figuring that I had used up my allotment of Luck for a long time.

I am a bit surprised that he only discharged one round.

 

[old lady new shooter]

He shouldn't have let them sneak up on him. He was on the phone and wasn't paying attention.

NEVER TALK ON YOUR PHONE WHILE OUT ON THE STREET OR IN A PARKING LOT!!!

 

[wayneinFL]

Pat searches by street muggers? Well, we do provide them with their initial pat search training upon their first arrest, and then they get their in-service training almost daily when in the jail or prison population. Would like to see the video and scrutinize this guy's technique...in might speak to the quality of "training" he received from the deputies at Wayne County Jail or in the MDOC system.

A little off topic, but do police officers pat people down at gunpoint? By themselves? Distance is your friend and it seems to me that being that close somebody with a gun out of your holster carries a risk of a gun grab.

 

[Jeff White]

A little off topic, but do police officers pat people down at gunpoint? By themselves? Distance is your friend and it seems to me that being that close somebody with a gun out of your holster carries a risk of a gun grab.

No! That’s a TV thing. You’re in a very bad position when you get close enough to pat someone down. You need to be ready to go HTH when you touch the person.

 

[dweis]

I think it is very complicated because the BG had a gun on the CPL Holder’s friend. If I were in that situation I would give up the wallet, watch, and whatever other valuable the BG wants. I’d be very concerned about getting my friend shot. I don’t have any physical possessions worth the death of a friend.

But then there is the pat-down by the BG. I wouldn’t be inclined to submit to that. Yep, I would have shot him then. But I might have shot him earlier. I did say I’d give him the wallet, and while he was feeling successful and not patting me down I would have shot him. That moment of success would break the BG’s concentration. I hope.

 

[Old Dog]

A little off topic, but do police officers pat people down at gunpoint? By themselves? Distance is your friend and it seems to me that being that close somebody with a gun out of your holster carries a risk of a gun grab.

Uh yeah; I was being facetious. As Jeff says, that's a TV thing. The answer is never. And you're correct about the risk.

 

[wayneinFL]

Uh yeah; I was being facetious.

Yeah, I sensed the sarcasm.

It seemed inept for the robber to do that.

I was trying to think of where I had ever seen it done before, and, yeah, I think it was 70s cop shows.