Big Bore 444 Marlin hunting

[Arizonagunrunner]

Any thoughts on this are appreciated.

Going after Moose and Griz with my 1974 Marlin 444. I will be hunting the interior of British Columbia. I am using Hornady 265 grain soft points. I will be taking shots no further then 175 yards.

Any thoughts?

 

[dprice3844444]

just make sure the gun is nice and clean before you go,and if in cold weather use synthetic lube on all parts.bring extra ammo and don't put all ammo in 1 bag in case 1 bag gets lost

 

[Bio-Chem]

should work just fine. put the bullet where it needs to go and dine on moose steaks that evening

 

[Reloadron]

You don't mention a Zero but I would think about setting up for a Short-Range Trajectory where you zero your sights or scope for a 100 yard zero. That should give you a about a +.2" at 50 yards and about a -3.2" at 150 yards. That should give you a good clean kill zone on either of the game you mention out to the 175 yards you mention. I generally have used the old generic 240 grain flat soft points but the bullet you have chosen should do just as well if not better.

Enjoy your hunt....
Ron

 

[osteodoc08]

Good luck on your hunt

 

[CraigC]

I wouldn't use that bullet for moose and absolutely not for grizzly. Handload or factory?

 

[dprice3844444]

and if worried about grizzly,no hollowpoints.they expend all their energy in the fat and might not reach vitals. flat points

 

[Salmoneye]

If by 'Soft Points', you mean the Hornady 265gr Interlock Flat-Point, then have at it...

If you mean the FTX gummi-tips, change your ammo to the Flat-Point...

 

[336A]

If you place your shot correctly I don't see why it wouldn't work, the .444 Marlin is a great cartridge.

I wouldn't use that bullet for moose and absolutely not for grizzly. Handload or factory?

The 265gr JFP was designed by Hornady for the .444 Marlin cartridge and the slower twist rifles of the day. It is a pretty stout bullet though not as stout as some of the more recent super bullets out there now such as the Swift A Frame. However that bullet did the business for the man in the link below against an estimated 600 pound grizzly at a mere 10 yards. Whats more even at that short a range the bullets passed through, don't sell the cartridge or the bullet short.

http://www.marlinowners.com/forum/444-marlin/74640-grizzly.html

 

[c.latrans]

I would personally use a different bullet, but if you hold up your end things will work fine. I have shot a couple of cows with the .444 with no issues. Been a bunch of bulls and bears killed with .444's, its all about bullet placement just like every other animal on earth.

 

[CraigC]

I've heard of them failing at .44Mag handgun velocities. The 265gr is a decent deer bullet but that's about it. I simply would not trust them and there's no reason to saddle yourself with an outdated bullet design with so many other, better designs available. I'd take the 270gr or 300gr Speer bonded core JSP's over anything from Hornady. I personally wouldn't go with anything less than 300gr and with the added velocity, there shouldn't be a problem stabilizing up to 330gr.

 

[Salmoneye]

I've heard of them failing at .44Mag handgun velocities. The 265gr is a decent deer bullet but that's about it.

The only 'failure' of that bullet at .44 mag velocities is to open up...It pretty much acts as a solid and blows through whatever it hits...

As pointed out, it was specifically designed to open up and hold together at .444 Marlin velocities...

I personally wouldn't go with anything less than 300gr and with the added velocity, there shouldn't be a problem stabilizing up to 330gr.

The OP specifically said that his gun is a 1974 vintage, and with the 1 in 38" twist rate, it may or may not stabilize the heavier bullets well...

 

[CraigC]

The only 'failure' of that bullet at .44 mag velocities is to open up...It pretty much acts as a solid and blows through whatever it hits...

As pointed out, it was specifically designed to open up and hold together at .444 Marlin velocities...

Really don't care what it was "designed for". I'm sure their 300gr .405 bullet was not "designed for" varmints but that's how it acts. Whether the 265gr holds together or not, it ain't heavy enough. It's a deer bullet and I would not use it on moose and especially not grizzly.

The OP specifically said that his gun is a 1974 vintage, and with the 1 in 38" twist rate, it may or may not stabilize the heavier bullets well...

Yes, I know this.

 

[DM~]

I don't see that 265 H bullet being a problem for moose out of a 444 Marlin, i never one used on a big bear though, but i'm betting it would work for a rib shot.

Personally, i don't like rib shots on big bears, so for me, i'd want a bit tougher bullet for MY shooting on big bears.

DM

 

[Arizonagunrunner]

I am going to be using the 265 soft point. I am sure at 100 yards the bullet will deliver the goods. Moose steak for months
As for the griz. I believe I will blow a hole clean through the beast. I appreciate all the input. Past hunting history tells me that shot placement is everything. At least first and foremost. I shot my 1st moose in Maine using a 30-30. Took two shots and several minutes for the critter to know it was dead. But the 170 grain pills did the job. I was at 75 yards on that hunt. Took an elk in Flag last year. Shot it with my 06. Used 180 grain Nosler and it dropped where it stood. 180 yards from the 6X6. So I am sure this 265 grain big chunk of lead will be enough.

 

[hardluk1]

If grizzly is on the hunt list for get the sp and under 300 gr loads at home. The moose is not that big a deal. Most any rifle cartridge with a barnes or bonded bullet will do. For grizzly you want something different. Use a load like these .
http://www.midwayusa.com/product/49...mance-lead-wide-long-nose-gas-check-box-of-20
http://www.midwayusa.com/product/61...-335-grain-lead-flat-nose-gas-check-box-of-20

This would be a good moose rounds and if you have a back up hunter along it would do for bear as it is a abonded bullet. But have a couple hard caste a round or two in.
http://www.midwayusa.com/product/41...awk-bonded-core-jacketed-flat-point-box-of-20

 

[CraigC]

Any thoughts?

I am going to be using the 265 soft point.

Why did you ask the question if your mind was already made up?

Since you're in Flagstaff, stop by Gary Reeder's shop and ask him what he thinks of the 265gr on grizzly.

I shot my 1st moose in Maine using a 30-30. Took two shots and several minutes for the critter to know it was dead. But the 170 grain pills did the job. I was at 75 yards on that hunt. Took an elk in Flag last year. Shot it with my 06. Used 180 grain Nosler and it dropped where it stood. 180 yards from the 6X6. So I am sure this 265 grain big chunk of lead will be enough.

None of the experience you just conveyed applies to your .444. A 265gr is not a heavy bullet for the .444 but a standard weight for it and the .44Mag. For a properly constructed bullet, it's a good weight range for deer and elk, though I'd still prefer the Speer offerings because Hornady's are just too prone to jacket/core separation.

I'd go with the Buffalo Bore 335gr for grizzly. That bullet will work every time.

 

[336A]

None of the experience you just conveyed applies to your .444. A 265gr is not a heavy bullet for the .444 but a standard weight for it and the .44Mag. For a properly constructed bullet, it's a good weight range for deer and elk, though I'd still prefer the Speer offerings because Hornady's are just too prone to jacket/core separation.

I have never heard of hornady's 265gr FP being prone to seperation. Again the Hornady bullet is designed for the .444 cartridge, the Speer bullets that you keep refering to never were. The Speer bullets were and are designed to operate at .44 mag velocities, Speer even states this in their reloading manual. when driven to .444 Marlin velocities it will nearly turn itself inside out. Here is a link to an old but still relevent article on the .444 Marlin. In it is a test of of the the Hornady 265gr FP and the 300gr Speer Uni-cor bullet.

The Speer though heavier didn't perform appreciably any better that the hornady. Furthermore the Hornady bullet didn't shed it's core which you continue to claim that it's famous for. http://www.hwsportsman.net/444Marlin.html

 

[Arizonagunrunner]

I know Gary, he has done custom work on S Actions. I will ask him this weekend. My mind was made up. I just want to see what fellow hunters thoughts are. I have no doubt that the 265 will take the griz.
At 100 yards, I have 2000 lbs of energy. This will make a clean kill on anything short of Polar/Kodiak bear in North America. Folks today get to wrapped up in the latest and greatest. I have used the 444 for 20 plus years. I have never found it lacking. And all I have ever shot out of it are 240 grainers. The weapon has accounted for 1 elk, 5 mulies, two w-tails, numerous hogs, a few coyotes and rabid dog.

I know this gun

 

[Bio-Chem]

Have a great trip and post pics to show all the naysayers wrong! I love my .444 and at the appropriate ranges it'll certainly deliver a lethal dose of heavy lead on target. Best of luck

 

[CraigC]

I have never heard of hornady's 265gr FP being prone to separation. Again the Hornady bullet is designed for the .444 cartridge, the Speer bullets that you keep refering to never were. The Speer bullets were and are designed to operate at .44 mag velocities, Speer even states this in their reloading manual. when driven to .444 Marlin velocities it will nearly turn itself inside out. Here is a link to an old but still relevent article on the .444 Marlin. In it is a test of of the the Hornady 265gr FP and the 300gr Speer Uni-cor bullet.

I don't care what they were "designed for". What matters is how they perform. The 265gr is a deer bullet, as plainly evidenced by the article you posted. The Speer 300gr was designed for handgun velocities and yet they performed about the same. The difference being that the Speer won't separate but the Hornady has a very good chance of it. So I guess that kinda throws out the "designed for" argument. I wouldn't use either but would prefer a cast bullet. The .44 does not need to expand to be effective and a bullet that expands from .430 to well over three quarters of an inch and only penetrates 13" in wet phone books is a terrible bullet for grizzlies. Period. Regardless of what magic somebody thinks energy is going to perform.

The rhetoric about twist rate is bogus. The 1-38" twist works fine with bullets up to 300gr in the .44Mag. The .444 with its added velocity makes it a non-issue. As I said, they work up to 330gr.

The test also clearly shows the OP how the 265gr compares to the .30-06 with a good bullet.

Folks today get to wrapped up in the latest and greatest.

No but thinking 2000ft-lbs is gonna do the job with zero thought to bullet construction can get you in serious trouble. Yeah, you might have a real easy time with a one-shot drop on the grizzly. Or it may be like the one I watched soak up five 400gr .416's (A LOT higher sectional density than your 265gr and a tough bullet to boot) without even a reaction except to quicken its pace. Hopefully it won't do like the 100lb doe I shot with the 300gr Hornady that was "designed for" the .405. That is, it blew up on the shoulder and only a piece of it penetrated deep enough to slow her down while I put another in her skull.

You asked for opinions and wasted our time because your mind was already made up.

 

[Arizonagunrunner]

No need to be a hater there Craig C. You shoot what you think is best. I will shoot what I think is best. I don't believe that the 265 pill will fall apart. I have shot a 500 pound Feral hog at 90 yards broadside with this round. Blew a hole clean through him. Hog ran 30 yards and dropped. When slicing him up, huge wound channel.

 

[CraigC]

Not hating, you asked for opinions, you have mine. It is yours to heed or ignore.

 

[jmr40]

I think ya'll are making this way more complicated than it needs to be. A 444 would be way down on my list of guns to take, but if I had one, and wanted to use it, it would do the job just as it has since introduced in the 1960's. And with 240 gr bullets designed for the 44 mag. Moose aren't that hard to kill, and inland grizzlies aren't that big. Often no larger than black bear.

 

[xXxplosive]

Dug a slug out of a black bear I shot a few years back in Maine....that slug actually doubled it's size in expansion and the bear had no idea what hit'em.......DRT.....great gun at 100yrds.