building a suppressor

[kingcheese]

when you build a suppressor, how much of it can you modify after the fact, i am assuming its like a firearms kinda deal where one specific part can not change(like a frame or reciever)

i want to build a supressor with a tube i can change, because id like to use a redbull can for the tube, but i want it replaceable,

with that goal, how do i go about building one so i dont have to pay 200 bucks every time i have to repair my red bull "can"

 

[dmlehto]

WOW, really? aside from the soda can idea i think you'll be safe. let us know how well it works.

 

[Rail Driver]

I don't see a red bull can holding up to much more than .22LR pressures at best. It would also not be nearly rigid enough to be effective. You'd be better off buying one of those adapter deals that let you use an oil filter as a replaceable suppressor. (legally of course)

 

[Telekinesis]

I think you'd have a hard time making the exterior tube a replaceable item unless you could figure out a way to put the serial number somewhere else. Even then you get into the whole aspect that replaceable wipes for suppressors still need a tax and stamp for each one...

 

[kingcheese]

i guess i should ask it this way, what parts can be repaired/replaced with out paying for another stamp?

 

[Zak Smith]

Even an SOT cannot replace the tube if it is the serialized part.

On a non-SOT with a Form 1 suppressor, you cannot possess any extra parts for the suppressor, period.

 

[Bubbles]

For all intents and purposes the ATF equates the silencer tube to a firearm frame/receiver. Replacing it constitutes manufacturing another suppressor.
http://www.atf.gov/firearms/faq/national-firearms-act-silencers.html

 

[OldmanFCSA]

Make the can capable of sliding over an existing silencer body - change it as your tastes change, use o-rings to hold in place.

 

[kingcheese]

Make the can capable of sliding over an existing silencer body - change it as your tastes change, use o-rings to hold in place.

wouldnt that cover up the serial numbers and get me in trouble other ways?

 

[kingcheese]

Even then you get into the whole aspect that replaceable wipes for suppressors still need a tax and stamp for each one...

what exactly is a replaceable wipe?
and what does SOT mean?

 

[dprice3844444]

on some mac silencers,they have a nomex cover,some use a rub berized cover.as long as it is not permanent.just cut a hole where the numbers are

 

[kingcheese]

i guess changing the baffles also counts as building a new suppressor?

i really want to try it, but i want something i can slowly modify, without going broke

 

[Zak Smith]

There's no need to guess when the published law and ATF rulings will tell you exactly what you need to know.

 

[RhinoDefense]

Even an SOT cannot replace the tube if it is the serialized part.

Correction: An SOT may replace the tube. When the suppressor is transfered to anyone other than another SOT or LE agency, a transfer tax applies.

 

[Bubbles]

Even then you get into the whole aspect that replaceable wipes for suppressors still need a tax and stamp for each one...

Wipes? That technology is so..... 1970's...
We use baffles or monocore designs now.

and what does SOT mean?

SOT = Special Occupational Taxpayer. In the firearm world it's a dealer or manufacturer who pays a tax to FedGov each year for the privilege of being able to make or transfer NFA firearms without paying an individual tax on each one.

So you, as a non-manufacturer/non-SOT individual, would file a Form 1, pay $200, and wait for the approved form to be returned prior to making your suppressor. As a manufacturer who has paid the annual SOT I file a Form 2, I have 24 hours after making the firearm to submit my form, and pay nothing.

 

[RhinoDefense]

Certain government agencies specify reduction numbers in their MENS that cannot be obtained with today's baffle technology alone, as good as it is. Wipes are necessary in those instances.

 

[Zak Smith]

Correction: An SOT may replace the tube. When the suppressor is transfered to anyone other than another SOT or LE agency, a transfer tax applies.

It's no longer the same suppressor. They have essentially destroyed the original one and replaced it with a new tube with a new serial number. That was the point of the ATF letter from a couple years ago.

 

[Telekinesis]

Wipes? That technology is so..... 1970's...
We use baffles or monocore designs now.

I'm pretty sure I've seen some suppressors with wipes recently... I know the design itself is old, but I don't know if you can do enough with baffles to get a really short suppressor as quiet as you can if you use wipes instead.

I'm not sure how old this can is, but cans with wipes are still out there.

Regardless, I was using it as a point that suppressor parts can't be swapped out without paying the tax again.

I may also have a pic of an even shorter can with wipes but I can't find it right now.





Edit:
Ahh, here we go. A nice short suppressor with a few wipes.



As an aside, I just think I found my next gun related gift! That's a pretty nice suppressor for $350!

 

[RhinoDefense]

It's no longer the same suppressor. They have essentially destroyed the original one and replaced it with a new tube with a new serial number. That was the point of the ATF letter from a couple years ago.

Read what I posted.

 

[jmorris]

Wipes? That technology is so..... 1970's...

We use baffles or monocore designs now.

The checkmate is a monocore that can also use wipes.

 

[Zak Smith]

I did. It's true another tax has to be paid, because it's no longer the same suppressor in the eyes of the ATF. I was just commenting on this phrasing

When the suppressor is ..

Legally, it's a new suppressor that the SOT happened to use some old parts for.

 

[zstephens13]

Why not try making a normal (or buying a normal) suppressor and either get it the right width that you could cut the top and bottom of a red bull can off then just slide it over the suppressor like a sleeve? OR get/make a suppressor and have a decal made to look like a red bull can? No repair necessary.

 

[RhinoDefense]

Legally, it's a new suppressor that the SOT happened to use some old parts for.

And legally each suppressor part is a suppressor in and of itself.

 

[Zak Smith]

And legally each suppressor part is a suppressor in and of itself. Your point?

Nope, that's not how it works for Class 2 SOT's. A Class 2 SOT can possess as many parts as he wants and each part is not a silencer, in that he does not have to register them (Form 2). He only has to register them on a Form 2 when they "completed" into silencers (sidestepping the definition of that here, it's irrelevant).

If we're talking about "repairs" to a certain registered silencer to mean that the registered silencer is not destroyed and a new one created and registered, then an 02 SOT cannot repair the tube if it's the serialized part. If he does "replace the tube", he has created a new silencer that requires a new Form 2, and the old silencer has to be documented with ATF to be destroyed.

The "Silencer parts are silencers" does not apply to Class 2 SOTs.

Anyway, my point is that thinking about a serialized tube "replacement" as if it were any other part does not compute with ATF regs. If an SOT replaces a tube, they are destroying the old silencer, taking it off the registry, and then registering a new one.

 

[RhinoDefense]

The definition of a silencer applies to everyone, even class 2 SOTs. The privilege of being a class 2 SOT means you can manufacture as many silencers and silencer parts as you want. The law does not change the definition of a silencer for class 2 SOTs, it's the same for everyone. The law states parts are considered silencers themselves, without explicit exception applying to class 2 SOTs.

Firearm muffler or firearm silencer. Any device for silencing, muffling, or diminishing the report of a portable firearm, including any combination of parts, designed or redesigned, and intended for use in assembling or fabricating a firearm silencer or firearm muffler, and any part intended only for use in such assembly or fabrication

So where in the law does it state the exemption for class 2 SOTs? It states parts of silencers are silencers and it applies to everyone, SOT or not.