Buyer Beware ammo purchase

[NIGHTLORD40K]

Has there been a "Buick" only engine since 1981?

The Buick-developed 3800-series engines remained in use until the late 2000s, although they were used by other GM brands as well.

Kind of cost inefficient that every GM division used their own proprietary engines, where Ford and Chrysler used “corporate” engines across the line.

But I did like the individuality of the GM plan, where you knew some divisions had better engines than others and their engineers could hot rod them.

OP, good luck with your ammo!

Don't forget the silly Ford 351 Windor/Cleveland enigma. Same displacement, used in some of the same models and years but totally different designs with no parts commonality.

Oddly it also says made in the USA

I've worked for two major automakers and at both we'd get parts all the time where the box is marked with one country of origin and whats inside is marked something different. It's funny because the window sticker on new cars has to show the % of domestic and foreign parts content, as well as the origin of the primary foriegn source. I've often wondered which label they use to determine this....
No one holds them to account, so they get away with it.
Same with ammo makers, apparently.

I'm skeptical that any x39 or x54R cases have been formed in the USA since the Wall fell. With so much European production getting sucked up by Ukraine, (and the loss of Russian imports), that may actually change soon- but I doubt we will like the prices.

 

[rdnktrkr]

When Walmart discounted their ammo once I purchased 10 boxes of Winchester White box 50ct, I still have them and was thinking it would be a good way to have once fired brass for my 6.5cm. I will look at the boxes later to check on the brass, I vacuum sealed the boxes and stored them in 50cal cans so they will stay fresh (hopefully).

 

[jmorris]

Don't forget the silly Ford 351 Windor/Cleveland enigma. Same displacement, used in some of the same models and years but totally different designs with no parts commonality.

Yeah but Ford has always done that, take a 302 and make it a 351, need a different intake, distributor, change the firing order...

 

[buck460XVR]

I can understand being upset as to getting non-Winchester brass, but as others have said the PPU is good ammo as is their brass. IMHO, I don't see it as any type of downgrading from the original WWB. I'm guessing once you get the brass reloaded, you will be happy with the price. How much did you buy?

 

[Show Me]

Yeah but Ford has always done that, take a 302 and make it a 351, need a different intake, distributor, change the firing order...

And chevy had 289,302,307,327,350,400. Whats your point. But back then people had brand loyalty. We expected an Olds engine. What's expected to be in a 70 ⁰Firebird . A 400 Chevy. Heck no. Look at those cheep throw away ARs that people want this name or that. Same old same old. I have a LAR grizzly who made many names. So lame. They all look the same. Parts interchange. Make from recycled bud light cans. Then look at Marlin 336. The manufacturing specs were in the machinists heads. Hard to put that in a computer. Men were men , beer cans were safe.

 

[Show Me]

The Buick-developed 3800-series engines remained in use until the late 2000s, although they were used by other GM brands as well.


Don't forget the silly Ford 351 Windor/Cleveland enigma. Same displacement, used in some of the same models and years but totally different designs with no parts commonality.


I've worked for two major automakers and at both we'd get parts all the time where the box is marked with one country of origin and whats inside is marked something different. It's funny because the window sticker on new cars has to show the % of domestic and foreign parts content, as well as the origin of the primary foriegn source. I've often wondered which label they use to determine this....
No one holds them to account, so they get away with it.
Same with ammo makers, apparently.

I'm skeptical that any x39 or x54R cases have been formed in the USA since the Wall fell. With so much European production getting sucked up by Ukraine, (and the loss of Russian imports), that may actually change soon- but I doubt we will like the prices.

At one time Toyota pu had more us parts than the others

 

[Show Me]

I can understand being upset as to getting non-Winchester brass, but as others have said the PPU is good ammo as is their brass. IMHO, I don't see it as any type of downgrading from the original WWB. I'm guessing once you get the brass reloaded, you will be happy with the price. How much did you buy?

No one was upset. Wasn't what was described. Made this clear. Bought plenty. I have brand loyalty. Don't guess on my account. Just want others to be aware but I was the last to know. Plus the arm chair crowd are very entertaining . Plenty for what I do with these. Thanks for asking !!

 

[Show Me]

The Winchester USA and the Winchester Target & Practice labeled boxes appear to have the same exact Product Code of Q3174 and UPC # of 020892201903. Winchester seems to be using two differently labeled boxes to sell the exact same product. OpticPlanet is simply using a stock image for the UPC.

Here is a box that has the same product code and UPC as the box titled "W TARGET & PRACTICE."

View attachment 1194171
View attachment 1194170 View attachment 1194177

Q3174 | Winchester Ammunition

www.winchester.com

Next, as far as what you received, take a gander at Winchester's product page, look at the pictures, and read the comments on what others received from various retailers, including BassPro/Cabela's. Seems like the problem here is with Winchester and not OpticPlanet like many have assumed. There's a reason why Winchester is selling these foreign made ammo at a discount. Looks as if they contracted out to fulfill orders, IMHO. The "TARGET & PRACTICE" labeled ammo seems to be the problem, but being that there's no distinction between manufacture product codes, a vendor probably has both types in stock, e.i., "Winchester USA" and "W TARGET & PRACTICE." IDK...
View attachment 1194173 View attachment 1194172 View attachment 1194174 View attachment 1194176 View attachment 1194175View attachment 1194178

One product code Q3174
One product code Q3174P take a gander

 

[Show Me]

When Walmart discounted their ammo once I purchased 10 boxes of Winchester White box 50ct, I still have them and was thinking it would be a good way to have once fired brass for my 6.5cm. I will look at the boxes later to check on the brass, I vacuum sealed the boxes and stored them in 50cal cans so they will stay fresh (hopefully).

I didn't vacuum suck my stash and they are starting to tarnish. That's what started this in fact. Wanted new to replace what I was going to use and rotate into my brass box's. But I got ppu in Winchester box this time. I have ppu and S&B brass also but I like made in USA. I've got decades old 30 06 that looks better. GO CHIEFS

 

[Speedo66]

And chevy had 289,302,307,327,350,400. Whats your point. But back then people had brand loyalty. We expected an Olds engine. What's expected to be in a 70 ⁰Firebird . A 400 Chevy. Heck no. Look at those cheep throw away ARs that people want this name or that. Same old same old. I have a LAR grizzly who made many names. So lame. They all look the same. Parts interchange. Make from recycled bud light cans. Then look at Marlin 336. The manufacturing specs were in the machinists heads. Hard to put that in a computer. Men were men , beer cans were safe.

No 289 Chevy, 283.

And beer cans were good strong steel, so you could use them as exhaust pipe patches.

None of which has anything to do with ammo.

OP, based on my experience with current Winchester ammo, you’re probably better off with the PPU.

 

[Show Me]

No 289 Chevy, 283.

And beer cans were good strong steel, so you could use them as exhaust pipe patches.

None of which has anything to do with ammo.

OP, based on my experience with current Winchester ammo, you’re probably better off with the PPU.

Thanks for the correction. Dont remember the size of the popular stroker. Falstaff cans for me. Ammo gets boring real fast. 60 comments. Keep in mind after seeing the price of brass it got ordered. It's the brass I was after . I don't partisapate in factory ammo much. 283 how could an old hot rodder mess that up. Back then BUILD included machine work. Not parts installing. Exchangeable parts make AR's a good hobby.

 

[DustyGmt]

PPU made really good bargain priced 7mm-08 jacketed soft point for $10.99 a few years back. They also made brass cased 762x39 stuff that shot really well in my mini. I also have a case of PPU M885 62gr green tip with the really nice uniform red primer seal. All of my experience with PPU has been excellent, but I didn't reload any of it but I have plenty of it to reload one day and somebody told me it was really good quality brass....... can't verify it though.

 

[Mars5l]

I bought some traded in WWB 7.62x54r. Says made in Czech Republic, but has WIN headstamps

 

[Show Me]

I bought some traded in WWB 7.62x54r. Says made in Czech Republic, but has WIN headstamps

Global economy. One world goverment.

 

[Show Me]

PPU made really good bargain priced 7mm-08 jacketed soft point for $10.99 a few years back. They also made brass cased 762x39 stuff that shot really well in my mini. I also have a case of PPU M885 62gr green tip with the really nice uniform red primer seal. All of my experience with PPU has been excellent, but I didn't reload any of it but I have plenty of it to reload one day and somebody told me it was really good quality brass....... can't verify it though.

Yes that red primer seal looks fancy. I'm going to pull a bullet and see if that's sealed. A person could store those for a while.

 

[Charlie98]

I would gladly take PPU over Winchester White Box any day

+1 And now that Winchester is running Lake City, I'd take PPU over Lake City. In fact, I do.

Yes that red primer seal looks fancy.

If it's like Prvi's red primer sealant from back in 2007 era, it will make a mess of your bolt and chamber. I'm still cleaning that crap out of my M1a's receiver.

 

[Hartkopf]

By memory: 262, 265, 283, 302, 305, 307, 327, 350, 400

Did I miss any? I used to know the bore and stroke of every one of ‘em too. Probably down to half at this point.

 

[Show Me]

By memory: 262, 265, 283, 302, 305, 307, 327, 350, 400

Did I miss any? I used to know the bore and stroke of every one of ‘em too. Probably down to half at this point.

But do you remember the 350 stroker. Think it was 400 crank

 

[Hookeye]

Only PPU Ive ever had, a box bought last week............22 Hornet.

Falstaff?

Knew a cool old guy that was a brewmeister for em.
Was a kid then, so never tasted it.

 

[Charlie98]

Falstaff?

We had a Falstaff plant in Fort Wayne, IN, where I grew up. (The Fort Wayne plant was actually the old Berghoff Beer plant, which Falstaff aquired. I grew up across the street and went to school with the Berghoff kids...) By the time I got to drinking age, the plant had closed, or was close to closing.

Remember back in the early '80's when the whole 'white box, generic' thing was big? Down the beer isle there was 'Beer' in white cans. That was actually made by Falstaff... or at least where I bought it.

 

[Derek Zeanah]

Remember back in the early '80's when the whole 'white box, generic' thing was big? Down the beer isle there was 'Beer' in white cans. That was actually made by Falstaff... or at least where I bought it.

In Southern Cal that was Coors that was making it, based on the location information on the label.