can't decide on scope for ar build, help

[JBrady555]

Hey guys I need help picking glass for my new ar build. The ar has a 18" rainier match spr barrel along with a giessele 2 stage trigger. I want a scope that can maximize the potential of the barrel and trigger, but I've never owned a scope before so I don't need to break the bank because Im not gonna know the difference any ways. My range maxes at 300 yards and I want to compete in 200 yard hi power matches. That being said, any gun I build needs to be able to serve a defensive role should it be called upon. I really want to stay around 400 or even less because I know with mounting hardware I'll be pushing 500 bucks. Please help give me some options. Fixed,variable, dosent matter, just want a good scope that matches the gun. Here is what my research has found...

Vortex viper hst 2.5x10 , can't afford pst
Vortex diamondback hp in a higher power than viper hst
Millet trs1
swfa 10 or 12x fixed
primary arms 4-14 acss ffp

Open to all suggestions, please help, thanks.

 

[Sam1911]

When you say "defensive purposes" that would eliminate any scope that didn't go down to not much over 1x magnification. Citizen/civilian defensive shootings are going to be quick and very close. And almost any magnification is going to hurt you, badly, trying to engage a moving man-sized target at under [strike] 100 [/strike] 50 yards (and probably under 10...).

In other words, I don't think any of your given models will be even close to ok.

If I were you I'd consider something more like this: http://www.primaryarms.com/Primary_Arms_1_6X_Scope_with_Patented_ACSS_Reticle_p/paps1-6x.htm

Or the Vortex version if you'd like: http://www.vortexoptics.com/product/vortex-strike-eagle-1-6x24-riflescope-ar-bdc-reticle

Something that you can leave set at 1x for all practical uses, and then roll up to higher magnification if you really need to see a target clearly at 300 yds.


I don't know how any of this fits into shooting hi-power matches. That's just a whole different ball game. Most of those are shot with irons anyway, but the scoped rifle matches probably won't be won with a low-magnification variable.

 

[TTundra]

You're putting some nice parts into your build. Rainer match barrel and a Geissele trigger, those aren't cheap and I'm sure you picked them for a reason. I have a setup with a WOA 18'' barrel and Geissele SD-E trigger and its purpose is to throw 77'rs down range. Its heavier and not the most practical for clearing rooms... Has a Vortex 4-16x44 HS-T on their. Love the setup and it produces.

Be very sure of your scope purpose, If you're dropping the $$ into components, don't let the glass be the weak link. Get what you really need for your build for its primary purpose.

 

[Driftertank]

If you build a quality gun, don't skimp on glass. Cheaping out on glass will just disappoint you. Personally, I think the IDEAL scope for that setup (based on my experience with one) is a Viper PST 2.5-10x32 FFP. Not inexpensive, but an excellent value for the money.

Of the choices you listed I'd say Viper HST. Diamondbacks are alright, and you still get the awesome Vortex warranty, but the glass is not as good as the Viper line. IIRC, the Diamondback is assembled in China, the Viper in the Philippines...with Japanese glass (?).

I have 3 viper PSTs. I don't make a lot of money, but I save my pennies and know exactly what I want when I shop optics. I shot my AR carbine with irons for a year and a half while I saved up for a PST 1-4x24 and an ADM Recon mount.

 

[Sam1911]

Personally, I think the IDEAL scope for that setup (based on my experience with one) is a Viper PST 2.5-10x32 FFP. Not inexpensive, but an excellent value for the money.

Sure, nice scope, but that would be pointless on a defensive carbine. Just in your way, not helping you make fast hits on target in a dynamic, defensive situation.

 

[Walkalong]

You need two different sighting devices for precision shooting and self defense with an AR. The two don't cross over.

Sounds like your first goal is precision shooting, which IMO needs more than 12 to 14 power, but you can do OK with those.

The in between stuff that needs less precision can be done with the scopes you listed.

Or why buy a match barrel and a target trigger.

 

[TTundra]

You need two different sighting devices for precision shooting and self defense with an AR. The two don't cross over.

We all want the do all solution, but this is the truth. For the primary function and price range, two optics would be best. Or better yet, a reason to build 1 more!

 

[Driftertank]

Sure, nice scope, but that would be pointless on a defensive carbine. Just in your way, not helping you make fast hits on target in a dynamic, defensive situation.

I dont ENTIRELY agree with you there. I have this scope on my .308, it works fairly well close up at 2.5x, particularly if you use Bindon aiming. That said, I agree that it is not IDEAL for cqb purposes, but a better compromise for longer range precision shooting, particularly as it sounds like the OP has built sort of an SPR-type rifle.

On the other hand, a bit of searching around can produce a 1-4×24 PST in the price range (or near enough) that the OP stated, and I can vouch that THAT scope works brilliantly in close, and I really like the TMCQ reticle. Just a little harder to be precise at range with it.

 

[Sam1911]

Ok. I would say that 2.5x is sure pushing the very top of what I'd want to deal with on a fast/close carbine, but maybe "pointless" was too strong a term.

I do really like the 1-4x and 1-6x cross-over scopes for this task, as 6x (or even 4x) should be well better than what you need to hit human sized targets at anything under 300 yards (or quite a bit farther with practice) but the match/target shooting aspect isn't as easy.


Of course, a great option would be finding very good repeatable bases like LaRue QD style, for a more powerful scope and just leaving a 1x red-dot like an Aimpoint PRO (or whatever) on the gun most of the time for the close defensive stuff. Once sighted in, pop off the high-mag scope and store it somewhere until match day.

 

[greyling22]

how about a weaver v10? a 2-10x38m scope.
2x gets you down where you can use it both eyes open close up, and 10x should be big plenty for hitting anything bigger than a baseball out to 300. And it's pretty decent glass. Also, it's only 130 bucks, which is a great price point to start getting into scopes at. http://www.natchezss.com/weaver-classic-v-series-riflescope-1-tube.html

No, it is not a long range precision scope, and it is not the greatest "tactical" scope either, but is seems like it might do pretty decent for all the OP's criteria.

 

[JBrady555]

When you say "defensive purposes" that would eliminate any scope that didn't go down to not much over 1x magnification. Citizen/civilian defensive shootings are going to be quick and very close. And almost any magnification is going to hurt you, badly, trying to engage a moving man-sized target at under [strike] 100 [/strike] 50 yards (and probably under 10...).

In other words, I don't think any of your given models will be even close to ok.

If I were you I'd consider something more like this: http://www.primaryarms.com/Primary_Arms_1_6X_Scope_with_Patented_ACSS_Reticle_p/paps1-6x.htm

Or the Vortex version if you'd like: http://www.vortexoptics.com/product/vortex-strike-eagle-1-6x24-riflescope-ar-bdc-reticle

Something that you can leave set at 1x for all practical uses, and then roll up to higher magnification if you really need to see a target clearly at 300 yds.


I don't know how any of this fits into shooting hi-power matches. That's just a whole different ball game. Most of those are shot with irons anyway, but the scoped rifle matches probably won't be won with a low-magnification variable.

I guess we will take defensive out of the equation. In those situations I'll be grabbing my 16" build with a aim point pro anyways.

 

[Sam1911]

Ahhhh, well then sure! Funny, as the PRO is actually what I recommended later on in the thread. Good optic for that task!

 

[HRnightmare]

I will second Sam1911's post...sort of.

My first AR had an EoTech 512. It was all I knew, my military issued weapon had one previously. It took a dirt nap and I replaced it with the latest and greatest Micro EoTech, the much shorter version. I hated the button locations and ventured into an Aimpoint Micro for a 10.5" SBR. I love it soo much better.

Then I built a budget build SBR and decided to try the Vortex SPRC. It was on sale for like $129. IT came with 3 different height mounts, a 2X removable magnifier, I believe bikini cover, spare batteries. It is IR compatible and has an auto shut off feature. The buttons are easily located and it as held up to a SBR and another has held up for over 1000 rds on my buddies AK.

I would say, if you are doing budget optics, this is a sure bet. I believe it also has a lifetime warranty. I have heard good things about the Primary arms version but have never personally owned or used one.

Good luck.

 

[JBrady555]

I guess I just want to set it up for 200 yard competition, but dont want it to break the first time it gets knocked into a pine tree.

 

[Sam1911]

Cool. Which competition are you participating in? It probably makes the most sense to try and approach what the other successful competitors in that discipline are using.

 

[JBrady555]

Nra hi power matches. Very informal local club stuff. All at 200 yards. Slow and rapid fire shot strings. Ive not shot one yet. Really leaning towards the vortex viper. I can get a 6x24 for less than 500 but its not the pst or hstm just the regular viper.

 

[Driftertank]

Personal opinion here, but I think the 6-24 is a little overkill for a semiauto at less than 500yds. I took a 4-16x50FFP off my .308 largely because it was just too much scope for the gun. I rarely set it above about 12x because, where I shoot, when it warms up, the mirage can be kinda killer. I think the 6-24 is a benchrest scope.

Course my opinion is worth exactly what you paid for it....