Carcano carbine

[wiscoaster]

Inter-ordinance is doing most of the importing, and they're selling through various dealers, including their own subsidiary company. Multiple threads here detailing peoples' experiences if you just search on "Carcano".

 

[Mars5l]

It's mostly been carbines that ive seen. Either Troop Specials or Cavalry. I bought a TS from Palmetto and the Cavalry from Classic Firearms. I've heard the ones DK have been selling have been the better condition of the batches

 

[Ugly Sauce]

Will do. Thank you. I didn't know!

 

[Mullo98]

I recently bought to carcanos, one from IO, and an M38 sporter. There is pretty much no ammo around. I really wanted the m38 to be a deer gun.

 

[Mr. Zorg]

I recently bought to carcanos, one from IO, and an M38 sporter. There is pretty much no ammo around. I really wanted the m38 to be a deer gun.

That's what I used my M38 for, simple iron sights and younger sharper vision.

 

[Mullo98]

That's what I used my M38 for, simple iron sights and younger sharper vision.

I never hunted before and it seemed like a good choice. The sporting job also wasn't bad. Just needs a butt plate and maybe a scope.

 

[jobu07]

I jumped on the Carcano import frenzy myself picking up a 91/24, 91/28, a M38 cav 7.35, and a 91 cav in 6.5. Of course, I'm sitting on a good stockpile of 6.5 ammo as these Carcano's were part of rounding out my collection. I can't say as I would advise anyone who wants to do a lot of shooting to buy them up right now, clearly everyone has laid out ammo and components are scarce. But from a collectors standpoint now is a great time to pick these up.

 

[caribou]

The 91 Carcano cavalry carbine is known as the "Moschotto", and has a short stock with an under folding bayonet.

The 91/38 infantry carbine, known here in the US as the "Oswald gun", has a full stock and knife type bayonet.

 

[wiscoaster]

The 91/38 infantry carbine, known here in the US as the "Oswald gun", has a full stock and knife type bayonet.

More specifically, for identification purposes, the groove on the underside of the stock's forend, which at first glance suggests a missing cleaning rod, is there to receive the bayonet blade when the bayonet is folded back.

https://ebayonet.com/ARTICLES/M38C/M1938Carcano.htm

I don't have a bayonet for mine, yet ... it's still on the to-do list.

 

[jobu07]

One of these guys.

I bought this rifle maybe 15 years ago. I recently picked up the bayonet for more than the gun...

 

[wiscoaster]

Jealousy!!!

FIRST-CLASS specimens all!!

 

[kBob]

So how well do Carcanos of either caliber handle gas checked lead bullets at reduced velocity?

Can't you just run Mannlicher 6.5 brass through a Carcano die and trim to length?

-kBob

 

[theotherwaldo]

I wound up paying as much for the bayonet for my 91/38 as I did for the gun itself.
Then again, I just had to have one for old time's sake.
I used to carry one back in my South Central Los Angeles days.
Having a folding blade pop out that was twice as long as the handle proved to be a bit of a distraction to the aggressive... .

 

[Terry G]

There is a problem with PPUs 6.5 Carcano ammo. It's loaded with .264 dia. bullets. Carcano's bore .268. They will fire OK but may have poor accuracy. Norma ammo is pricy but loaded with the right dia. bullet. ( I think !! )

I've had really bad accuracy with PPU. I'm going to try Norma when it get's back in stock.

 

[caribou]

Once you figure out the sights, its decently accurate.....at least for my rifle.

I have a folding knife type 91/28 bayonet, but no 91/38.....LOL!! My Moschotto has its sticker bayonet

 

[cluttonfred]

My Carcano arrived today and it’s a little rough but also intriguing.

The Terni barrel has the rounded shank of an M1938 but it’s marked 1937XV and FP.

It has the old-style adjustable rear sight but also the sight blade all the way forward like an M1938 moschetto.

The bolt appears to be mismatched as the four digits on the handle don’t reflect the rifle serial number.

The stock shows a major repair on the top of the butt with the screws standing proud of the buttplate and appears to have been cut for a rifle with a longer tang behind the striker and later patched.

There is another stock repair to the right of the chamber...perhaps cut down from a stock prepared for a Tromboncino grenade launcher on a TS carbine?

There is a nice FAT cartouche on the stock dated...1916.

Can anyone explain any of this?

Cheers,

Matthew

 

[JCooperfan1911]

To me and every person of my generation when I hear the name Carcano I think of this:



That and at three to four bucks a shot, kind of an unsavory rifle all around.

 

[cluttonfred]

Well, that’s not terribly helpful, and FWIW when ammo was available before the the current influx of Carcanos drove up demand, it was less than half that price.

To me and every person of my generation when I hear the name Carcano I think of this:

That and at three to four bucks a shot, kind of an unsavory rifle all around.

 

[wiscoaster]

Can anyone explain any of this?....My Carcano arrived today and it’s a little rough but also intriguing.

<edited by wiscoaster to rearrange for effect>

Sorry to take liberties with your words, but ya, you sort of answered your own question in general if not in specifics.

My first Carcano arrived in much rougher condition than yours; unfortunately I didn't take any pics. After a huge amount of elbow grease, and several shooting sessions, it cleaned up well, and began functioning and shooting fine. Unfortunately, I made the mistake of getting it chambered in 7.35 and now that caliber isn't being produced any more.

The importers, distributors and dealers of the Ethiopian Caracanos invented new condition descriptions like "surplus turn-in" to describe what basically means "as-is" and "crap-shoot". My guess is that the only screening done is to filter out rifles with broken or missing functional parts, so little parts like barrel band or butt plate screws might be missing or incorrect. So long as people understand that the usual NRA condition descriptions don't apply and that what they get will be what they get then doing business with them is fine. When I pulled that first rifle out of the box I laughed semi-hysterically and said "now there's a real project rifle!!"

The Italians changed their minds multiple times about the caliber, characteristics and features of what they wanted to supply their troops, and each time some of the existing rifles were modified to comply with the new specs, so it's not unusual to get a rifle with mix-master parts.

I think that one exceptional positive for your rifle is having the visible stock cartouche. Most have so much wear, including multiple rearsenalling and refinishing, that these distinguishing marks disappear without affecting functionality. So when you clean it up, try to preserve those marks as well as you can. Good luck and have a good time with your project rifle!!

 

[wiscoaster]

This may answer one of your specific questions:

Model 1938 Cavalry carbines mirrored original M91 cavalry carbines but featured fixed sights. *FNA-Brescia did return to the adjustable rear sight (200 meter battle sight with 600-1500 meter adjustable) when they began producing in 6.5x52mm again. Some may have stocks previously produced and unused for the M91/28 rifles intended to equip the M28 grenade launcher. These will feature prominent replacement wood fittings in a bid to recycle raw materials. Produced until 1944.

from: https://surplused.com/index.php/201...uick-and-dirty-guide-to-carcano-rifle-models/

 

[indy1919a4]

One of these guys.

I bought this rifle maybe 15 years ago. I recently picked up the bayonet for more than the gun...

I love those folding bayonets those are so neat.. And they have never been cheap. It was so hard to spend more on the bayonet then the rifle... But darn that looks nice. Thanks for sharing.

 

[cluttonfred]

I have been doing some digging and found this site to be most useful, especially the pages on model identification and productions changes:

http://personal.stevens.edu/~gliberat/carcano/

So, to answer a few of my own questions:

• The rounded barrel shank was introduced a couple of years before the introduction of the M38 and 7.35mm cartridge, so my gun appears to be a normal pre-WWII Terni m91 cavalry carbine.
• The "FP" on the barrel shank just above the wood on the right side seems to indicate the source of the steel, in this case "Fonderie Piemontesi."
• The stock cartouche that I read as "FAT 1916" (cursive 1s looking like inverted Vs) is probably actually "FAT 1946" indicating a postwar arsenal refurbishment program.
• The stock repair that I thought to be evidence of being originally cut for a longer tang may just be a neat crack repair.
• The stock patch on the right side near the receiver does seem to indicate a stock originally cut for (but probably never fitted to) a TS carbine with M28 grenade launcher.

The stock is quite dry and the finish has been completely worn off in places, and there is some heavy grease on the magazine follower and the rear sight. I plan to do a complete disassembly and cleaning of the metal as well as rubbing down the stock with lacquer thinner and giving it a couple of coats of linseed oil to bring it back to life.

I am glad I chose to get the cavalry carbine model, it's quite handy and has a lot of character, let's just hope it cleans up and shoots well.

 

[theotherwaldo]

This thread reminded me of the old folding bayonet that I mutilated (I cut off the muzzle ring) and carried back in my East L.A. days.
So I went to EBay and, lo and behold, there it was!
I bought it and it's on its way back to me... .

 

[indy1919a4]

This thread reminded me of the old folding bayonet that I mutilated (I cut off the muzzle ring) and carried back in my East L.A. days.
So I went to EBay and, lo and behold, there it was!
I bought it and it's on its way back to me... .

You know I never thunked of using one like that.. But those folding bayonets would make one hell of a nice carry knife.

So the one you got on E-bay, is it the same one??? or one like it?? Or in original condition??

 

[theotherwaldo]

I can't really tell - I sold it over 40 years ago.
Not that I really care... .