Civil War Whitworth & .45 cal. ammo.

[Bill B.]

I am a bit of a Civil War buff and had read a book: Mountains Touched with Fire about the Battle of Lookout Mountain. In this book it told a tale of CSA sharpshooters making unreal shots distance wise with a Whitworth .45 cal. rifle.

Well I just got back from Gettysburg and got to see one of these rifles for my self. Per what I can find out about the Whitworth it had hexagonal rifling and a matching bullet. My question is does anyone have more information on this rifle as to why this rifling was supposed to have made it so accurate? I would also like to see a picture of the ammo it shot if anyone can come up with one. I was talking to one of the Battle Field guides at Gettysburg and he had even told me I must have the wrong info from the book on it being .45 cal. as he thought it would be at least .50 or .52. Well I then found one in the case and it was indeed a .45 cal. and said on the information card that it was imported from England and gave to the best CSA Sharpshooters. Any links or information appreciated!

 

[Hobie]

You must be just a bit of a CW buff as there is lots of info out there on the Whitworths.

These guns were accurate in the field for several reasons. #1 is that they were well made and the molds provided with the rifles produced bullets which fit the bores. #2 is that they were issued (usually) to folks with good attention to detail. #3 is that there were also telescopic sights issued with or added to the rifles. All this made these rifles stand out from the average (much like the Berdan Rifles Sharps rifles) such that there is the usual "war story" exaggeration of feats accomplished with the rifles.

The rifles were indeed .45 cal and the rifling was hexagonal. The bullets were also hexagonal (as designed) and these fitted bullets provided a mechanical fit to the bore such that they could not strip the rifling. The twist provided was also suitable for this length of bullet (approximately 500 gr.). However, one can also use a more easily loaded cylindrical bullet of the same approximate length. The Whitworth rifling can be considered an early version of the polygonal rifling as used in the Heckler-Koch military firearms such as the G-1 and MP-3.

The form of the rifle was very similar to the 1853 Enfield rifle and some believe that it's performance contributed at least a bit to the popularity of the "Volunteer" rifles of .45 caliber but more conventional rifling form purchased for units (by units) during the period of the "volunteer" movement in England. Reporductions of both the Whitworth and the Volunteer rifles are available, new and used.

As might be expected, these rifles are as effective on game as any .45-70 BP rifle using 500 gr. bullets.

 

[Zeke/PA]

A .45 cal Whitworth was on display at the Visitor Center years ago that was supposidly picked up in Devils Den after the battle.
The rifle was indeed issued to a sharpshooter as it weighed close to 40 lbs., was equipped with a long brass tubular sight and had provisions for use with a false muzzle.
As the story goes, the Confederate sharpshooters in Devils Den made it very warm for the Federal artilleryman on Little Round Top which is by the way 700 yards distant.
For awhile the Whitworth was displayed in the same case as a rifle used by Berdans unit.
Needless to say, the Federal rifle was chincy by comparison.
Respectfully, Zeke

 

[Hobie]

Zeke,

The 40 lb rifle was NOT a Whitworth. Here's a pic of a repro...

 

[Bill B.]

Thanks for the replies and the information provided. Hobie as I said I am a bit of a Civil War buff and only have a general knowledge of the weapons used and am still learning a little every day. Would you happen to have a picture of a Whitworth bullet with its hexagonal shape? There was 2 bullets that had been recovered from the battlefield at Gettysburg that had had struck each other in flight and fused together. One of which I suspect could have been a Whitworth and I would like to see one to know for sure. By the way the reproduction Whitworth you posted a picture of looks like a rifle that I have saw in the musem at Chickmauga Battlefield. I at the time had not even heard of the Whitworth and thought it to be a Enfield set up for Sharpshooter use. Thanks for any help.

 

[Bill B.]

A .45 cal Whitworth was on display at the Visitor Center years ago that was supposidly picked up in Devils Den after the battle.

Zeke, the guide I spoke about at Gettyburg even sent me to look at this rifle and told me it was a Whitworth. I saw that it wasn't a Whitworth since I had already found one in the display case but that's one reason as they say the wrong information gets passed around. As I said before he was telling me the Whitworth would be in the .50 cal range and would have had a max. range of 500 yards. I did get some information from him that was very helpful so I guess you have to sort out what you are told and go from there .......... .

 

[Zeke/PA]

The rifle that I speak of was a.45 cal. with a heavy octogon barrel and a hexogonal bore. The bullets on display were of course hexogonal and about 1&1/4 inches long.
A mystery for sure as the rifle was labled a Whitworth.
Respectfully, Zeke

 

[Jim Watson]

Mr Whitworth set out in 1854 to see if he could do better with the then new Government (British) load of 2 1/2 drams powder and 530 grains lead than the .577 Enfield. After a lot of calculation and testing he settled on the .45 calibre with 20 inch twist rifling. All tests showed it superior in range and accuracy but more expensive to manufacture. Probably slower to load, too.

Whitworth sold 8000 rifles to the Army and some to Volunteer units, but most true Volunteer rifles were .577 to take Government ammunition; the misnomer by a modern Italian reproducer of British rifles for American sales notwithstanding.

Several other gunmakers jumped on the .45 bandwagon, to include Rigby, Henry, and Gibbs with as many more smaller makers. By the end of the muzzleloading era the Gibbs rifle with Metford pattern rifling was the industry leader. So there was nothing magical about the Whitworth hex barrel, it was just the first approach to the "smallbore."

Most Whitworth shooters these days (and some in the old days) use conventional round grease grooved bullets which slug up to fit the hex bore. The price of mold and swage to make fitted bullets will definitely get your attention.

DeWitt Bailey II did a series of articles in early 1970s Gun Digests on the Whitworth, the Volunteer rifles, and smallbore rifles other than Whitworth. Interesting reading if you can round them up.

 

[4v50 Gary]

The rifle found at Devil's Den was a custom target rifle and not a Whitworth. Whitworths weighed about 10 lbs and that's the beauty of it. It could reach out to a mile's distance (no jive) like those heavy barrel target guns and still kill. Mind you, most shots at that distance were for harassment value but who wants to hear that peculiar sound when a bullet passes nearby?

As to why the Whitworth was so accurate, the mechanical fitting is only one factor. Less slop, more consistency. Another advantage of the Whitworth is the ballistic coefficient. Same weight, but longer and narrower projectile (.451 as opposed to .577). Guess which has less wind resistence and carries further? Not all Whitworth bolts (as the bullets were called) were hexagonal. Sir Joseph Whitworth also tried cylindrical bullets and found them to be accurate in his gun. Many of the bullets recovered from the battlefield were cylindrical. As to fired bullets, it depends on what it hits and how much energy was left when it struck the target. Deformation is inevitable.

Best book is John Anderson Morrow's, "The Confederate Whitworth Sharpshooter." You can buy it directly from him at:Whitworth book Don't be a cheapo (everyone and not just any individual in particular). Buy the book! It's singularly the best one on the subject and you'll enjoy it immensely. I searched for it for years and everytime I tracked one down, it was sold about 2 weeks before. Then Morrow came out with the 2nd edition (Thank Gawd!) and it's available again. So buy it and don't suffer like I did.

Finally, if you haven't, check out the mislabeled thread, "Bedtime Stories." It's got plenty of accounts of sharpshooting including those from the Mother of American Family Feuds, the Late Unpleasantry Between States (1861-65). A Whitworth story is on page 8.

 

[Zeke/PA]

Gary,
Believe it or not, this particular rifle was once identified, in the display case, as a Whitmore.
I think what throws everyone, myself included, is the hexogonal bore of the rifle.
The lock is of the back action type and as I stated before a false muzzle was used in loading.
This particular rifle held a lot of appeal to me and I would like to see it positively identified.
I'm not sure, based on some past expirence with SOME of the Gettysburg
experts(guides, curators, historians) that I would be confident of their integrity.
Respectfully, Zeke

 

[4v50 Gary]

Zeke, there is a heavy barrel rifle with a back-action lock that was purportedly found at Devil's Den. It's provenance was questioned for about a century until someone finally established that the initials on the silver inlay, HCP, could be attributed to a soldier in the 1st Texas Infantry. Since then, they have a photo of the soldier (post war with wife). He was injured on the 2nd day of the battle (which would be about right) and left to seek medical care. This is the heavy barrel gun that took a false muzzle. Somewhere around here I have a photo of it, courtesy of Gettysburg National Battlefield Park. It'll be in my book along with the brief story of the soldier. If we're talking about the same gun, then it's not a Whitworth.

The other heavy barrel rifle that is displayed beneath it was a Sharps with a target barrel. It had some inlays on the right side of the stock. I remember Wyman White mentioning that he used a heavy barrel breech loading rifle that was equipped with telescope sights (period venacular for scopes).

Gettysburg does have a Whitworth rifle with Davidson scope displayed at the Visitor Center Museum. That one in the white (bluing removed) but the lock isn't back action. It's placed among the rows of other weapons that is displayed there and isn't apart like the first two guns mentioned.

Displays do rotate at the whim of the curator and we may be talking about different guns too. I visited Gettysburg for the first time last year (see Bedtime Stories as it somewhat accounts for my absences here).

BTW, anybody find a pic of those hexagonal bullets? It was asked for in the begining of the thread.

 

[Cap n Ball]

There is a picture of many loads right here at THR. Go to

http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=41072

There is even a comment there by you Gary...Of course this was back in 2003 and none of us has perfect memory....at least I know mine isn't.

 

[Bill B.]

Wow! & Thanks!

I asked and received! Great pictures of the different bullets and a very interesting thread! Thanks for letting me know Cap n Ball!

 

[dbm]

Have a look at at my Long Range Muzzle Loader web site: there is a section on collecting which includes pictures of several Whitworth rifles. Go to: www.lrml.org

most true Volunteer rifles were .577 to take Government ammunition; the misnomer by a modern Italian reproducer of British rifles for American sales notwithstanding.

Volunteer Infantry in the UK originally purchased their equipement and used various patterns essentially of the Enfield rifle. The P/53 Rifle Musket was eventually the arm of issue.

With the establishment of the NRA in Great Britain in 1859 and their annual rifle meetings which commenced in 1860 there was a great growth in the interest of target shooting. Volunteer matches were for military rifles, but many also entered the any-rifle matches which permitted the small-bore rifles. The 'Volunteer' rifle as originally marketed in the UK by Parker-Hale is a generic copy of a military match rifle that would have been widely used by the Volunteers in target shooting.

I don't see how the Volunteer tag is a misnomer nor how it would improve American sales, where in general I find that little appears to be known in detail of the British Volunteer movement, and as I know little of the detail of the US National Guard.

David

 

[4v50 Gary]

For those who aren't familiar with the 19th Century British Military, home guard type units, or volunteers, were organized in response to the need for domestic defense in event the National Army could not return to the island nation. In some respects they were superior to their American militia counterpart in that many equipped themselves with firearms and not only drilled (marched) but engaged in target practice as would regular British infantry. This is better than the Hardee or Casey Drills (identical in all respects and totally useless). The British volunteered learned not only skirmish drill, but also range estimation, parts nomenclature and care for his weapon, military etiquette, and marksmanship. Back then (1850-1860's), virtually all European powers and the English maintained schools of marksmanship. In England, the School of Musketry was at the Hythe and many civilian manuals were based on the military manuals developed there.

Welcome to THR dbm.