collapsible baton?

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Omni04

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http://www.pssstequipment.com/images_products/2389_big.jpg

hey everybody! i just recently bought one of these (silver though) and i was wondering if anybody could tell me the legal aspects of carrying this concealed. I'm guessing it is considered a weapon, is there anyway i can play it off so it isn't? I live in kentucky and i don't have a CCW since im not 21 yet. What type of trouble will i get in if i use it in a defensive situation? After playing around with it i noticed it is quite formidable when used.


is there a certain class of weapon this belongs to? like bludegoning kind of like a basball bat? Thanks in advance!
 
Don't know about Kentucky, but here in NC it's considered a prohibited weapon and if your carry it concealed well then you stand a good chance of being charged with carrying a prohibited weapon conceled (worth going to jail for?) Call your local state attorney's office (prosecuters) and get them to tell you what the statue is on carrying a asp baton ( BTW ASP batons are considered a deadly weapon in most states ;) )
Also ask them what you could carry for protection as far as the law goes: asp, mace, folding knife etc etc etc. :rolleyes:
 
I second what Bushwhacker has to say. The legality of these varies from state to state. In Michigan it is illegal to carry one concealed.
 
'Asp' is the name of the manufacturer.

Legality of these items varies by state. A baton can kill, so be prepared to justify using lethal force should you ever need defend yourself with it. Batons are also generally considered to be a "police" weapon, so be prepared to justify why you felt the need to carry police gear on your person.

That said, they can be very effective defense tools. They're as mean as knives are, but they have much greater range. I certainly wouldn't want to fight against someone with an Asp.
 
ASP = Armament Systems and Products. Located in Appleton, Wisconsin. And before they became famous for making collapsible batons and small LED flashlights, they did one of the nicest mini-Smith 39 conversions you ever did see. The success of the ASP Mini Nine and some of the other conversions at the time prompted S&W to come out with the 469/669/3913. I am sure that an ASP Mini Nine with the classic windowed grips and magazine (so you could count the rounds) would be worth a lot of money today.
 
I don't think they are legal in Texas either, but I could be wrong. Does anyone have a list of states where it is legal?
 
Yea here in NC they are NOT a good idea...I made me a sheath to fit along the back side of my belt, so that a short jacket could conceal it...Cop dude that I know told me that it wasnt a good idea...Course then HE wanted one just like it.. :D (yea i watched the movie "Hunted" wayyyy to many times!)

And this was in Randolph county...In Davidson under the old regime' I am told that having one of these could get ya arrested and possibly shot!! (inside NC joke :neener: )

Now I carry a 26oz framing hammer in my car...Ya just never know when something is gonna need to be whacked!...







unpleasant dreams :evil:
 
Yeah, that MF sheriff and his deputy do-rights murdered one of my distant relations. Arrested him based on hearsay that he'd molested his daughter. He was divorced from his wife who was not a nice person and she coerced their daughter into claiming to the authorities that her dad had molested her. The deputies came and arrested him at work and took him to the jail and beat the crap out of him so bad he had to go the hospital. The only close relative he had left was his mother who was old and not quite right. She went to the hospital to see him when she found out how what had happened and talk to him, but the Sheriff wouldn't let her see him because he was a "suspect" and under survellience or some such BS. He died from his wounds without getting to tell anyone what really happened. Of course, right after he died the daughter felt so bad about what she'd done she admitted that it was just a lie that her mom had pushed her into telling.
Of course, since his aged mother wasn't quite all there, nobody sued or investigated this little incident. It was all neatly forgotten. I didn't find out about it until a year after it happened at a family gathering. My mom grew up with this relative of mine and said he was a really good person. She said he'd had an unfortunate childhood with his mom and all but hadn't let it determine his outcome in life.

Sorry for the tangient. Yeah, the Davidson SD has quite the statewide reputation as an organization straight out of the dark ages. I can't believe that guy stayed in office so long or that we allow these kinds of people to remain in power in the late 20th century in America.
 
I looked into this a while ago after realizing how useful a long pole, like an ASP can be for defense. The ability to block and hit at a distance is an undeniable advantage. Unfortunately, there are two down sides. The first has been mentioned: for some reason it is illegal to carry a folding stick in most states. The second is that in order for the baton to be useful at a distance that will give you an advantage, you'll want a baton at least 28" in length, preferably 30. Even collapsed, most of these batons are nearly 12" long which makes them very difficult to conceal unless you always have a jacket or vest which has a holster system sewn into it, or you happen to like the feeling of a metal rod spanning accross your spine.
 
A cane is legal everywhere and gives you great reach, many striking, grappling, and pressure point abilities with the right training. Of course, you have to be comfortable carrying around a cane all the time which is not something young healthy people like to do for social reasons.
 
I'm guessing it is considered a weapon, is there anyway i can play it off so it isn't?
Click to expand...

RAM11020.jpg

http://www.tacticalflashlights.com/flashlights/RAM11020.html

Voila! It's a flashlight. :) Kentucky has a concealed weapons permit, so an ASP would be legal with a permit. Check packing.org for links about legality sans permit
 
wow good point. I wonder if i could carry that flashlight and it would be legal! The one i have isn't nearly 24 inches i would say it is close to 18. Give or take, still need to measure it. Kinda looks like a huge door stopper.
 
ive got a asp airweight 21" coming for ccw in mo ok and az where its legal on my permit.im thinking itll make a good backup for nogun areas and situations where i dont feel a firearms warrented. i never was big on the idea of cutting someone tho id not hesitate if i had no choice.

in contact weapon encounters all the way back to my youth ive always done better with a stick ymmv.
 
I have an ASP, 8" when closed. I used to carry it quite frequently way back. I always figured it would be more useful in a fight than a knife. Someone would have to get past it to get to me. Plus, even unextended, you have a very solid 8" bar in your fist...


I never checked at the time to see if it was illegeal to carry it or not. Now that MO and I have CCW, I guess it doesn't matter.
 
tactical texan

hey, i have been reading those statutes off and on for a couple days now. I Can't find anything about knives, batons, tasers, anything. Only handguns. Is there a different place i may be able to look?

Although i know enough about gambling, prostitution, and kidnapping to last me 10 lifetimes!
 
I've got one. Small 8". But I'll still take a knife thank you.

Batons have their strengths and weaknesses. Great for striking, lousy for stabbing. If I'm close enough to use a baton or knife, sorry I'll be using lethal force. (Is there any other?)

Besides a knife engenders less evil connotations with authorities, and can be argued it's not a weapon, but a tool. Let's see you try that with an 8" - 18" baton. "Yes officer, I use this here baton also for chopsticks while I'm traveling". Or "Yes, your Honor. I realize I stabbed him 13 times with my 3.5" blade, but you see it is a tool, letter opener/nail trimmer, etc. And I was afraid he was going to kill me. I'm emotionally scarred your Honor. SCARRED!!".

BTW in a defensive scenario you are NEVER unarmed. There is always something available. A stick, loose dirt, loose clothing like a shirt (great for choking). Your belt. Anything is better than an empty fist.
 
isn't a baton considered a lethal weapon? I was under the impression it was worse to carry than a knife. Plus unless you are carrying a machette, the ASP baton has better range :)

Yea yea, i know a .357 trumps it all though :D
 
ASP can also stand for A Steel Pipe cause basically that is what it is lol. if you get caught you could say its a replacement anntena for your car, kinda looks like a giant one
 
isn't a baton considered a lethal weapon? I was under the impression it was worse to carry than a knife. Plus unless you are carrying a machette, the ASP baton has better range
Click to expand...

It depends on state and local laws. Some states don't consider it a deadly weapon untill it is USED as a deadly weapon. (for example a chair is just a chair untill someone tries to hit someone in the head with it, then viola, deadly weapon).

I used to think that an ASP was an awesome weapon untill I actually trained with one. Now I am a little dubious. The big downside is that they have a "minimum range". By that I mean that you have to have room to swing it and you cant get enough force if the subject is too close or you arent free to move your hips properly. On a weapon designed to be used up-close and personal I find this to be a pretty fatal flaw. As a compliance tool for law-enforcement it has some value but, for defense I am not convinced.
 
A KY CCW includes all weapons and a CCW would cover the ASP. If you're too young for a KY CCW then check for certification for the baton.

ASP or baton certification is usually available and it is advisable to get the training. The fundamental issue is to not strike to the head/face/neck with a less lethal impact weapon. Strikes should be from the shoulder and follow through should bring the baton back to the opposite shoulder or opposite hip for a following strike. Think of the pattern as a figure 8 laying on it's side e.g. right shoulder to left hip moving to left shoulder then to right hip and back to right shoulder while keeping left hand close to the chest.
 
Does anybody have a copy of State Statutes for Dummies book i could borrow?

I understand the stuff i am reading pretty well but i can't find any information about what KY considers a deadly weapon or a list of these things. It is all about firearms. Is there a place kind of like packing.org for non-firearm weapons?
 
I mean that you have to have room to swing it and you cant get enough force if the subject is too close or you arent free to move your hips properly.
Click to expand...
Doesn't this apply to all non-firearm weapons?
 
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