Colt .38 Army Special (1923)

[Charly2020!]

Howdy everyone,

My uncle passed away and left me this handgun. Since this is my very first revolver, my knowledge is quite limited and would appreciate your help/point-of-view.

Here are some facts:

• Brand: Colt.
• Model: Colt .38 Army Special.
• Year: 1923.

My questions:

1. Given the current (poor) state of the gun, is it advisable (due to any possible depreciation) to re-blue it? (see images).
   
2. Several .38 S&W-UMC rounds were in my uncle's closet. Was this specific round made for this revolver? (see images).
   
3. Can I use current .38 Special rounds on this revolver?

Thank you.

 

[BigBlue 94]

Dont reblue it. Personal preference of course.

Colts are notoriously difficult to fix if something goes wrong. How is the cylinder lockup? Meaning when the hammer is cocked, can you spin the cylinder back and forth a bit?

And yes, 38 special is correct.

 

[NIGHTLORD40K]

.38 Special is the correct ammo for the gun- NOT those .38 S&W rounds you found. They have a larger diameter bullet.

Honestly, the exterior condition is not that bad for one of those, but it takes it out of the "collector" catagory, and into the "shooter" catagory- assuming the timing, lockup, and endshake are ok.

If you want to keep the "barn-find" patina, just keep it rubbed down with an oiled cloth after shooting or handling and it will be just fine.

Hard core collectors are really only interested in guns with a high percentage of the original finish remaining. If you would enjoy owning the gun more with it refinished and new grips, go for it- either way the value is about the same, figure $400-500. The Army Special (and basically identical Official Police) are some of the most common vintage Colt revolvers and dont command stellar prices unless they are immaculate.

That said, they are relatively strong guns- this is the same frame the Python uses- and make nice shooters.

 

[Monac]

I don't have any advice for you, Charly2020, just a quick fact or two: To expand on what NIGHTLORD40K said, the part of the frame of your revolver where the grips are attached is identical to that of the later Colt "Official Police" and "Python" revolvers. Any grips made for those guns ought to fit yours, which is a good thing to be able to tell someone who is interested in buying it.

The grips on your guns are made of hard rubber, which was the standard grip material for that model, and for many other revolvers from about 1875 to about 1925. It is not bad stuff, but it gets brittle with age and so they are often found broken, as the grips on your gun are. Replacements of identical design but made of more modern materiala are almost certainly available for your gun, on Ebay as well as other places. It might be better to save the money and let a purchaser make that expenditure, though.

Although others here will have a better idea, to me your gun appears to be in decent shape mechanically, even though it has substantial wear to the finish. It is not rusty, and does not look abused. Colts were among the finest revolvers of their day, so people tended to take care of them, and many collectors are interested in them. In particular, the cylinder ratchet (your IMG_1300.jpg) looks good, and the cylinder axis/ejector rod (IMG_1295.jpg) is not bent, and those are a good signs.

Which reminds me - thanks for putting up useful pictures. Too often, people ask similar questions without them, and that makes it hard to give useful answers.

While NIGHTLORD40K is correct about hardcore Colt collectors wanting guns with excellent original finish, quite a few collectors cannot afford to be hardcore. They often like guns in the condition yours is because they feel it "tells a story", while a mint condition gun does not. Also, there is then no harm putting a bit more wear on the gun by shooting it. But they expect to pay a lot less too.

PS - Despite the name, these guns were never US Army issue, although they were an improved version of earlier Colt revolvers that were. The Army had decided it wanted a 45 caliber pistol by about 1905, and it adopted a Colt automatic pistol in 45 caliber in 1911.

 

[NIGHTLORD40K]

Oh, sure you can be a collector and not a "Collecteur," lol. By that I just meant those who are willing to pay top-dollar for the nicest example they can find. Even then, a serious collector will sometimes buy a lower-grade specimin as a placeholder in the collection until a nicer one can be found.

Army Specials are common enough that one like the OP has wont attract much of that kind of attention, but you, I and many others would be happy to have it- at a reasonable price.

Seeing as how it was his uncles, and not worth a billion dollars, I hope the OP keeps it in the family anyway.

 

[Dr.Rob]

Nice old colt. I would not reblue it.

 

[wiscoaster]

Having bought a number of "old guns" online through Gunbroker and other sources, I'd say your Colt looks in dandy shape for its age.

 

[MAKster]

For a 97 year old gun I think it looks good cosmetically and is probably in better shape than a typical pistol of that age.

 

[Charly2020!]

Dont reblue it. Personal preference of course.

Colts are notoriously difficult to fix if something goes wrong. How is the cylinder lockup? Meaning when the hammer is cocked, can you spin the cylinder back and forth a bit?

And yes, 38 special is correct.

@BigBlue 94 thank you. The cylinder lockup and the other parts are in perfectly mechanical shape. I will clean it, lube it and shoot it.

 

[dfariswheel]

Here's some addition general information about the Colt Army Special......

http://www.coltfever.com/Army_Special.html

 

[Charly2020!]

@NIGHTLORD40K @Monac Thank you for your feedback and POV.

From the cylinder ratchet to the cylinder axis/ejector rod, trigger, hammer mechanism, etc. mechanically speaking, the gun is in very good shape.

I will proceed to clean it, lube it, and shooting it at the range. If something unusual happens, I will definitely let you know.

P.S. Do you have any comments regarding the ammunition I found? Also, I want to be 100% this revolver can shoot today's typical 130-150 grain .38 special.Thoughts?

 

[bannockburn]

Charly2020!

If it were my gun I wouldn't refinish it either. It looks to be in halfway decent shape and keeping it in the same condition as you received it would be a nice connection to when your uncle owned it. I would definitely get some new grips for it though!

 

[Dr.Rob]

158 gr lead round nose is what that was designed to shoot.

 

[Dr.Rob]

Colt did claim back in the day that any of their revolvers could handle 38/44 heavy duty loads, I would not recommend that.

 

[Monac]

Any standard velocity 38 Special ammunition, including modern self-defense hollow points or copper-nickel jacketed bullets, should be fine. They may not shoot to point of aim because, as DrRob points out, this gun was made for 158 grain loads. Of course, with any fixed sight gun, you may have to try different bullet weights to find one that shoots accurately for you. Fortunately, 38 Special is still a very popular cartridge, and many bullet weights are available even if you limit yourself to standard velocity loads. You may already be aware that guns often differ in their preference for ammunition, and will be more accurate with cartridges from one manufacturer than another for no reason anyone can tell.

Generally, using a heavier bullet in ammunition of the same power raises the point of impact on the target, while using lighter bullets lowers it. I do not think bullets heavier than 158 or 160 grains are commercially available for standard velocity 38 Special any more.

Low velocity or "mid range wadcutter" ammunition should be fine too, and will have milder felt recoil. I have no idea how their point of impact will differ from standard velocity 158 grain ammo. They do make very neat holes in paper targets, however. (As I understand it, that is where the name "wadcutter" came from.) Where I live, at least, this type of ammunition has become difficult to find on store shelves.

If the old 38/44 loads were ever acceptable in this gun (and I have no reason to doubt DrRob), then modern high velocity or "+P" loads should be fine too. There is much debate about the advisability of shooting them in old guns, however. As I said, Colt made some of the finest revolvers of their day, but the day of your revolver was nearly a century ago. You may not want to put it to the test. I once had a Colt Official Police, which was identical to your gun but slightly newer, and I had no problems with +P ammunition. But it is difficult to advise someone else to take any risks with their safety or their gun.

At the risk of stating the obvious, if you are going to shoot this gun, I would get some inexpensive grips for it, possibly used ones to keep the price down - there should be a wide choice available. That will preserve the original grips, and they may be a better fit for your hand as well. There has been a lot learned about good grip design since 1923. Of course, you may want to get grips of the original shape just to find out what that was like. If you find you enjoy shooting it and wish to keep it, you can always get better grips then.

 

[toivo]

I actually have one of those in .32-20.. I saw it on Gunbroker and had to have it, mostly because I'm a blues fan and had just been listening to this song:



Mine has wood grips that look pretty clean. Maybe replacements?

 

[Monac]

I actually have one of those in .32-20....Mine has wood grips that look pretty clean. Maybe replacements?

The website that dfariswheel provided a link to said that Colt switched from hard rubber to walnut on the Army Special in 1923, so if they are Colt factory grips, they could easily be original.

BTW, for some reason I have it in my head that Colt made a few Army Specials in .25-20 Winchester. Is that crazy, or just not actually true? A quick Google search produced only confusion.

 

[NIGHTLORD40K]

The website that dfariswheel provided a link to said that Colt switched from hard rubber to walnut on the Army Special in 1923, so if they are Colt factory grips, they could easily be original.

BTW, for some reason I have it in my head that Colt made a few Army Specials in .25-20 Winchester. Is that crazy, or just not actually true? A quick Google search produced only confusion.

The only ones Ive seen were .32-20 and .38spl- though the Official Police was also made in .22 lr.

 

[GBExpat]

I actually have one of those in .32-20..

Same here, in addition to an Official Police also in .32-20 (below, top two in right column)



As you can probably tell from my .32-20 line-up, I am not a vintage revolver rebluing enthusiast.

Upon acquisition, 3 of my 4 Colts required "clock-work" repairs, so count yourself blessed in that regard.

The Good News side of that was that I learned a lot about working on such Colts.

O'course, such maintenance is not limited to Colts ...



A couple of .38spl S&W Model 1905 Hand-Ejectors.

 

[jar]

@NIGHTLORD40K @Monac Thank you for your feedback and POV.

From the cylinder ratchet to the cylinder axis/ejector rod, trigger, hammer mechanism, etc. mechanically speaking, the gun is in very good shape.

I will proceed to clean it, lube it, and shooting it at the range. If something unusual happens, I will definitely let you know.

P.S. Do you have any comments regarding the ammunition I found? Also, I want to be 100% this revolver can shoot today's typical 130-150 grain .38 special.Thoughts?

The 38 S&W is also a great cartridge but considered low power even though it was used right up through WWII by police and military. I happen to enjoy the 38S&W and have several guns chambered for that cartridge, the oldest being a S&W DA Model 4 top break and the newest an H&R top break that was made just prior to WWII.

The 38 S&W is fourth from the left:


Colt Police Positive in 38S&W:


Army Special & Police Positive:


the Smith & the Colt PP:

 

[Dr.Rob]

I have an official police in 32-20 made in 1927, locks up tight and shoots sweet.

 

[BigBlue 94]

My New Navy in 32-20 barely locks up at all... But I got it for a song, from cabelas of all places.

And whats this about blueing? Mine dont have none of that haha

 

[Charly2020!]

The website that dfariswheel provided a link to said that Colt switched from hard rubber to walnut on the Army Special in 1923, so if they are Colt factory grips, they could easily be original.

BTW, for some reason I have it in my head that Colt made a few Army Specials in .25-20 Winchester. Is that crazy, or just not actually true? A quick Google search produced only confusion.

yes, they are originals.

 

[Charly2020!]

Same here, in addition to an Official Police also in .32-20 (below, top two in right column)

View attachment 944918

As you can probably tell from my .32-20 line-up, I am not a vintage revolver rebluing enthusiast.

Upon acquisition, 3 of my 4 Colts required "clock-work" repairs, so count yourself blessed in that regard.

The Good News side of that was that I learned a lot about working on such Colts.

O'course, such maintenance is not limited to Colts ...

View attachment 944919

A couple of .38spl S&W Model 1905 Hand-Ejectors.

Beautiful collection! Thx for sharing.

 

[film495]

the OPs photos of that old revolver looks perfect to me. exactly what it should look like, and you can not recreate aging like that. the wear is character and tells a story of handling and use when I look at it.

just keep a little oil on it, and that finish will grow on you. in a year you'll think it is funny you considered changing it.