Colt Dragoon 3rd model revolver

[electricfactory]

I thought as a new poster I'd use the occassion to post some pics of my latest acquisition and to open the topic more broadly to include both the Colt Dragoon and Walker revolvers.
Though there are surviving examples of both guns, original vintage Colt revolvers have eclipsed what my wife would be ok with. Fortunately there are terrific examples of reproduction Dragoon pistols which I get a lot of enjoyment from and have the benefit of being able to shoot!
Recently I picked up this 3rd model Dragoon, it's a reproduction but the gun was defarbed when I got it so I can' t say who the makers was. Anyway I'm an enthusiast of all things C&B, not to mention muzzleoading rifles of both percussion and flintlock variety. Please feel free to post your own Dragoon revolvers in this thread.

 

[1KPerDay]

Looks great. IMO the coolest Colt revolver overall.

 

[electricfactory]

I think so too, espeically with the leaf sights! Now if only I could stumble across a Dragoon shoulder stock!

Looks great. IMO the coolest Colt revolver overall.

 

[1KPerDay]

I've got one for mine. LMK how yours shoots... most I've seen shoot so high with any of the leaf sights as to make them useless. Shooters usually drift out the leaf sight and use the hammer.

 

[expat_alaska]

I've got one for mine. LMK how yours shoots... most I've seen shoot so high with any of the leaf sights as to make them useless. Shooters usually drift out the leaf sight and use the hammer.

You have a Dragoon shoulder stock?!

Photos please!!

Regards,

Jim

 

[45 Dragoon]

OP, that's an Army San Marco. It has a short arbor by the way (all the copies do . . . ).

Mike

 

[expat_alaska]

OP, that's an Army San Marco. It has a short arbor by the way (all the copies do . . . ).

Mike

Very nice defarbed gun, although I detest the idea.

Mike (Goon) beat me to this post. ASM was the only repro manufacturer to offer the barrel mounted three-leaf rear sight. Since yours is a 4-screw CFS revolver, ASM also offered a shoulder stock for it that is unlike any other modern shoulder stocks. ASM shoulder stock furniture in the early to mid-70's was either blackened brass (early) or blackened steel (later).



If you can find one of these for sale on the used market, they are worth their weight in gold insofar as collectors are concerned as ASM ceased operations ~2002 and parts are scarce as hens' teeth.

Regards,

Jim

 

[expat_alaska]

Please feel free to post your own Dragoon revolvers in this thread.

This is my Uberti Whitneyville Hartford Dragoon (CU/2019) It shows the bolt/trigger screws protruding on the right side of the frame, not historically correct.



Early Uberti WH revolvers were historically correct, but maybe they devolved because it was not economically practical for Uberti to continue in this vein. I don't know.



Regards,

Jim

 

[electricfactory]

Thanks Jim and Mike, very much appreciate the information. The stocks are of course as hard to come by as hens teeth, although I don't understand why some other manufacturer hasn't stepped up to fill the void. There appears to be enough interest in these impossible to find Dragoon shoulder stocks for some enterprising company to make a few every year, no ? There's certainly enough interet to continue making the guns.

Very nice defarbed gun, although I detest the idea.

Mike (Goon) beat me to this post. ASM was the only repro manufacturer to offer the barrel mounted three-leaf rear sight. Since yours is a 4-screw CFS revolver, ASM also offered a shoulder stock for it that is unlike any other modern shoulder stocks. ASM shoulder stock furniture in the early to mid-70's was either blackened brass (early) or blackened steel (later).

View attachment 943902

If you can find one of these for sale on the used market, they are worth their weight in gold insofar as collectors are concerned as ASM ceased operations ~2002 and parts are scarce as hens' teeth.

Regards,

Jim

 

[electricfactory]

Jim, we may be having a similar discussion about shoulder stocks at another forum ?

Why do you think no one is making these now ?

 

[arcticap]

Jim, we may be having a similar discussion about shoulder stocks at another forum ?

Why do you think no one is making these now ?

Uberti makes the Remington Revolving Carbine, so maybe they figure that folks can buy one of those instead.
Why produce a product that will cut into their other sales.
No one else makes a Dragoon, but if you want a shoulder stock revolving carbine then buy their 1858 carbine.

Uberti has expanded the variation of models that they offer. Maybe they don't have a lot of extra production capacity.
Or perhaps they don't want to incite Pietta to start making Colt models that Uberti already has a monopoly producing.

Nothing stops Pietta from making a Dragoon or a Walker with a shoulder stock, which would hurt Uberti's percentage of the C&B market.
But Pietta doesn't because they both have their comfortable market niche.
But if one company tries to upset that market balance then the other company may want to do something about it.

Pietta doesn't offer a Remington revolving carbine when they very easily could out of respect for Uberti's marketing of it.
So by Uberti not trying to increase their market for Dragoons by making buttstocks for it, Pietta lays off direct competition.
It keeps the peace among the Italian producers because money spent on one company's products can't be spent on the other company's products.
So Uberti is keeping the peace with Pietta by not making any of those buttstocks for the time being.

 

[electricfactory]

I never thought about it that way. Has the ring of truth though, more's the pity.

Uberti makes the Remington Revolving Carbine, so maybe they figure that folks can buy one of those instead.
Why produce a product that will cut into their other sales.
No one else makes a Dragoon, but if you want a shoulder stock revolving carbine then buy their 1858 carbine.

Uberti has expanded the variation of models that they offer. Maybe they don't have a lot of extra production capacity.
Or perhaps they don't want to incite Pietta to start making Colt models that Uberti already has a monopoly producing.

Nothing stops Pietta from making a Dragoon or a Walker with a shoulder stock, which would hurt Uberti's percentage of the C&B market.
But Pietta doesn't because they both have their comfortable market niche.
But if one company tries to upset that market balance then the other company may want to do something about it.

Pietta doesn't offer a Remington revolving carbine when they very easily could out of respect for Uberti's marketing of it.
So by Uberti not trying to increase the market for Dragoons by making buttstocks for it, Pietta lays off direct competition.
It keeps the peace among the Italian producers because money spent on one company's products can't be spent on the other company's products.
So Uberti is keeping the peace with Pietta by not making any of those buttstocks for the time being.

 

[1KPerDay]

OP, that's an Army San Marco. It has a short arbor by the way (all the copies do . . . ).

Mike

Mike, is there any special way to tell an ASM? Mine has the leaf rear sight. The only marking other than the serials is a G M on the cylinder (in addition to the etched or roll marked cylinder scene) and both my old Walker and the Paterson have a similar G M. I wonder if it identifies the defarber or antiquer. None of mine have much blue at all and look grey like many original Colts do.
Last time I asked nobody could confidently identify the maker/s for me. All have timing issues so I haven’t shot them. I shot the 3rd model once with my dad when I was about 12, 30+ years ago. My ears are still ringing. Lol

 

[1KPerDay]

Some pics I tracked down

 

[Sim Carstairs]

I’ve owned an ASM 3rd Dragoon for a long time and it’s been a deadly accurate deer hunting companion. I shoot with this regularly.

 

[45 Dragoon]

1KPerDay, as far as I know, ASM is the only manufacturer that offered the flip-up sight. On older ASM Walkers and Dragoons the turn back on the barrel lug (under the loading plunger) is a little prominent . . . sort of like a jutting chin (like in the op's pic.). They fixed it later but I can't say when.

Mike

 

[electricfactory]

1KPerDay,
Is this your collection ? Very impressive, please ID everything! One of the things I like most about the ASM guns are that they serial number all the places that should be serial numbered.

Some pics I tracked down

/UOTE]

 

[Jackrabbit1957]

The name could be under the loading lever if who ever defarbed it missed that area, maybe look with a 10 x magnifying loupe.

 

[1KPerDay]

1KPerDay,
Is this your collection ? Very impressive, please ID everything! One of the things I like most about the ASM guns are that they serial number all the places that should be serial numbered.

This pic is part of it... the Walker, 3rd model, and Paterson are replicas (I’m now guessing all ASM) but the others are originals.
1849 pocket
1862 Police
1861 Navy
1860 Army

 

[1KPerDay]

Sorry for hijacking the thread further but I took some pics of the buttstock. It’s serialed to the gun and similarly antiqued.

 

[1KPerDay]

Some more

 

[electricfactory]

Just... wow. Really, that's a collection I'd love to see in person! Do you shoot the originals ? They look like they're in great shape, I certainly would!

 

[1KPerDay]

I haven’t yet but some are certainly in shooting shape. They were my dad’s. I shoot my pietta and Uberti replicas a good bit.

 

[expat_alaska]

1K, you have very nice collection! I really like ASM guns because Uberti can't even come close to what ASM produced back in the day, insofar as variations. To me it is very sad that ASM closed its doors ~2002. They produced so many accurate guns for decades, and Uberti and Pietta have never stepped up to the fore to take ASM's place. Yes, there are folks who claim that ASM guns were made of soft steel, and maybe that is so. I have an ASM 1860 Army (BD/1994) that belies that notion.

Very good to see your collection, sir!

Regards,

Jim

 

[Tommygunn]

Expat, I first got into BP in the early 1990s with ASM. The guns I got were DEFINANTLY made of soft steel, and were crudely made. I thought Pietta was better. A little later I saw a used ASM Colt 1861 Navy that was very nicely made, nice bluing, with safety pins and all. In fact I thought it was a Uberti, but was surprised to see it was ASM.
I think ASM started out making very good guns but by the '90's I think they'd done a lot of cost-cutting , hence the soft metal and crude parts.
I think that might be largely why they died out .....