Colt M1877

[Chief TC]

So I have this model in .41 cal, which is the Thunderer. 6" barrel and nickle-plated. Never refinished and no rust or corrosion. It is a beautiful pistol and in pristine condition, EXCEPT, the trigger does not function properly which is supposedly a common issue with this model being one of the first double action revolvers. Not only does it not fire DA, it is unable to function SA either. You can hold the trigger and pull back the hammer and the cylinder with rotate and release the hammer. However, I would designate this issue as completely unsafe to fire as is. I spoke to a local gunsmith and he said they are a real pain to fix and would cost a lot of money to fix it.

I don't have a strong burning desire to shoot it. I'd like to load BP rounds for it but I'm fine with it being a collector's piece but it would best if it was fully functional. What would you all do? Any advice or ideas about what you all would do would be helpful. My best guess researching the internet is that if this was a fully functional M1877 in excellent condition, it would be valued around $3000+. It seems the mint condition and it being .41 cal helps with its value.

 

[PRD1]

The decision to repair is entirely yours, but the smith you spoke to was absolutely correct about the reluctance of most to work on these revolvers. There are essentially no parts to be had, and they are almost guaranteed to get out of order or break again if you actually use the piece. Many knowledgeable smiths won't work on them at all.

PRD1 - mhb - MIke

 

[Zygodactyl]

JackFirstInc makes parts for them but almost no smith will touch one. My neighbor has a Rainmaker (32 Long Colt) that is extremely rare. His has the same problem. Either learn to fix it yourself or sell it as is.

 

[Jackrabbit1957]

That was one of the few guns the gunsmithing school I went to wouldn't work on. My problem is that a non functioning gun drives me bonkers. If it don't work I want to fix it. It's your call as to whether or not you try to fix it or just look at it or send it down the road. Decisions, decisions.

 

[Chief TC]

Thanks for all the replies thus far. Seems the consensus is shaping up to be that it is destined to remain a nice collector's item. Again, I'm cool with that. Just would have been nice to load BP rounds and shoot it. I can appreciate people who collect and don't really shoot but I guess I have a more utilitarian view. I like to use and shoot all my firearms and try to improve. A gun that sits in a safe doesn't really do anything for me. Maybe I'll sell it one day but have no reason to sell it for now.

 

[StrawHat]

From what I remember, it was a double action revolver, but, cocking the hammer is what produced the problem. Good luck finding a reliable gunsmith. Ciccione has passed on and his son has left the pfofw

 

[Ugly Sauce]

Just to gain some knowledge of the pistol, Mike B./"Duelist Den" has a good video on your pistol.

For sure, I'd not try to have "any" gunsmith work on it. You'll need to find someone experienced with the pistol, or capable of working on it. Perhaps Mike or Jack would be willing to give it a try? I know they are not rocket science pistols, and can be fixed. The mechanics of them are unique, but not magic ju-ju. Can't get parts? Parts can be made. Tempering springs is not magic ju-ju. (even I can temper a spring)

Leaving any pistol as a "collector's piece" sure would not be an option for me. I have a Luger that is probably about worth it's weight in gold, I've been told by an appraiser to "NEVER" shoot it. "YOU MIGHT BREAK A PART! THEN IT WON'T BE ORIGINAL!!!" Hell with that, I shoot it quite often. Heck, I carry it hunting sometimes. So yeah, fix it or sell it, again the mechanics of those pistols are not un-knowable. You just need a smith with talent, not some guy who went to gunsmithing school, and was told never to work on them.

Good luck! Hope you get it shooting, even if you only shoot it a few times. Do it justice. Don't be cool with it being a collector's piece. yuk!

 

[Ugly Sauce]

You just need a smith with talent, not some guy who went to gunsmithing school, and was told never to work on them.

Ha! I quote myself! Just want Jack to know this comment was not in reference to him! I just realized it could be construed that way, if one was prone to construing. Sorry Jack!

And I will mention, that the cost of returning it to a functioning collector's piece, will be nothing compared to it's value as a functioning revolver. There will be a greater return. Those pistols function differently from Colt's and Smiths, etc., but again they were not built on Alien technology. They have parts. Parts can be figured out and fixed.

 

[Jackrabbit1957]

No offense taken Ugly. You are correct, folks get into a certain frame of mind on stuff like this. Colorado School of Trades would not work on them or Schmit Ruben straight pull rifles and a couple of others I don't recall. If the O P wants it looked at I ain't afraid. If it's too outta whack it gets sent back at no charge other than postage.

 

[Miguel Loco]

It's well worth getting into firing condition. Those are rare enough to make it all worth the time and money.

 

[Coyote3855]

JackFirstInc makes parts for them but almost no smith will touch one. My neighbor has a Rainmaker (32 Long Colt) that is extremely rare. His has the same problem. Either learn to fix it yourself or sell it as is.

I think Rainmaker is a very cool name for a handgun.

 

[Jim Watson]

The big 1878 DA Colt is the Omnipotent.
An auction ad for one says the names were coined by Benjamin Kitteridge, a big dealer of the day.
https://www.rockislandauction.com/detail/85/207/colt-omnipotent-etched-panel-model-1878-revolver

 

[Ephraim Kibbey]

The big 1878 DA Colt is the Omnipotent.

There is also a version of the 1878 DA with enlarged trigger guard called the Alaskan.
It is made to function while wearing gloves.
Edit:
OPPs!
That will teach me to read your link before I post something!

 

[Ugly Sauce]

JackFirstInc makes parts for them but almost no smith will touch one. My neighbor has a Rainmaker (32 Long Colt) that is extremely rare. His has the same problem. Either learn to fix it yourself or sell it as is.

Jack will touch it.

 

[Ugly Sauce]

The big 1878 DA Colt is the Omnipotent.
An auction ad for one says the names were coined by Benjamin Kitteridge, a big dealer of the day.
https://www.rockislandauction.com/detail/85/207/colt-omnipotent-etched-panel-model-1878-revolver

Truth, Colts never named them.

 

[Jim Watson]

Since the large trigger guard 1878 (1902) revolvers were earmarked for the Philippine Constabulary, it is more likely the point was a long trigger for more leverage against the heavy DA pull.

 

[Ugly Sauce]

Colorado School of Trades would not work on them or Schmit Ruben straight pull rifles and a couple of others I don't recall.

Would they work on Lugers? I replaced the mainspring in mine (yes the original is safe in the safe) which was quite an adventure. A Luger collector was amazed that I even accomplished it. !!!! But, I suppose there's a "technique", or it's usually done by people with three hands.

 

[Jackrabbit1957]

I did see a few Lugers go through, been many many moons since I was there. I definitely remember the nope thing on those early double action Colts plus some type of Colt rifle, wish I could recall which one. I will ask a couple of folks I know that went there as well.

 

[Shortgrub]

Look up Sal Lanara. He is a specialist on repairing the Colt 1878. I think his company name is Revolver Renovations. He did a great job on mine.

 

[hrt4me]

fortunately my own Colt 1877 Thunderer still functions properly in both single- and double-action modes, and I do still fire it occasionally with light black powder cartridge loads... in fact, just today Midway USA notified me the .41 caliber heeled bullets are back in stock

 

[Ugly Sauce]

Look up Sal Lanara. He is a specialist on repairing the Colt 1878. I think his company name is Revolver Renovations. He did a great job on mine.

What was the charge for such a service?

 

[Ugly Sauce]

Since the large trigger guard 1878 (1902) revolvers were earmarked for the Philippine Constabulary, it is more likely the point was a long trigger for more leverage against the heavy DA pull.

I have heard that before, by request of the Army because the first pistols had miss-fires due to light primer strikes, so they requested the strength of the mainspring be increased. ?? That's what I heard anyhow.

 

[Shortgrub]

The Colt I sent Sal had a timing issue. It was an 1878 in .32/20 caliber. He got it running for me. No parts were replaced. It has been several years ago and I don't remember the cost. It seemed pretty reasonable at the time. I'm thinking around $150 plus shipping.

 

[AJumbo]

Since the large trigger guard 1878 (1902) revolvers were earmarked for the Philippine Constabulary, it is more likely the point was a long trigger for more leverage against the heavy DA pull.

Told to me by a Colt collector, supported by the an article in the NRA American Rifleman, this is my understanding of the ugly, freakish "Alaskan/Philippine" trigger:

Though the date escapes me, Frankford Arsenal turned out a huge batch of .45 revolver ammo for the Army, and this particular batch had really hard primers. The standard mainspring couldn't light this ammunition, so (bureaucratic problem-solving alert!) extra-heavy springs were installed in the '78s. This worked, but it was found that the stock trigger didn't have the necessary leverage to draw the hammer in DA mode. Lengthening the trigger overcome that problem, but required a larger trigger guard. This was all done because the gummint didn't want to dump all that expensive .45 ammo and have to wait on a replacement batch. Kinda like the Brits re-barreling their Baker rifles to smooth .62-cal because they had too much .62 ammunition on hand, and didn't feel that making their soldiers into riflemen was a worthwhile endeavor.

 

[Bob Meyer]

There's a gun parts company called Poppert's that used to sell parts for these guns. They also sold a repair manual just about the 1887 Colt. I had a Colt Thunderer about 30 years ago. I couldn't keep the thing working. One part after another broke. That's why they called it the gunsmiths friend. I finally sold it.