conceal in church

[eagle45]

Firepower! -

I truly understand your perspective, even though I don't share it, but what if the 'something fishy in the air' did not materialize until you had entered your place of worship? Are you willing to accept the potential consequences for yourself and your family? That is a personal choice that we all make.

I was working on a piece of equipment at church one morning before service began, and needed my pocket knife to pop open a little plastic cover on the device. As I closed it and put it back in my pocket, a friend that was helping commented "I would never carry a knife in church". To him it was disrespectful. To me it was a tool, and this is a small Case pocket knife with a 2.5" blade, not menacing at all. I would think no more of carrying a knife than a screwdriver, it is a tool for the job at hand. So is my SP101.

Perspective is everything.

BTW - I really appreciate the fact that this thread has stayed open. This is an interesting topic and very much relevant for our society today. The respectful conversation is truly THR.

 

[DawgFvr]

People are funny...why would carrying in church be any different than carrying anywhere else? Disrespectful to whom...God? Like God needs to go to church. People are funny...and some are werid...and that's why I carry. Lots of Bad Guys go to church...Mafiaso types have probably attended more than me.

 

[hrgrisso]

Not Carry



If I carry everywhere else... Why would I not while worshipping? After all it's my belief that self defense is a god given right. I doubt he has a problem with it, so what's the issue? Of course learning that the LDS church in Utah has banned CCW has seriously put a damper on my desire to move to the land of snow hills...

GOD BLESS ARIZONA!

 

[KI.W.]

In my country "mad" people take vodka and shoot the bullet in the own head. Therfor it is so many suisites in Finland. In the some other coyntry they take gun and go to church, market, restaurant, bar e.g. and start to shoot. This one reason no carry in church in my country.

 

[sandwich]

It's legal for me to and I do. Whackos shoot up churches, too.

This sounds about right.

 

[jdmbackdoc]

Me and 3 buddies all carry concealed at our Church. With all of the instances lately of wackos killing perfectly good Christians we decided to approach our Bishop and tell him we wanted to start an informal security squad. He said okay just not to advertise it, which we wouldn't have anyway. Poor bastard who breaks into one of our meetings with evil on his mind will shortly meet his master.

 

[Jaenak]

The churches usually ban guns on their premises BUT the law says you can carry a concealed weapon in the churches with the proper concealed carry permit. So basically, the churches have been over ruled. It might look funny to all the "institutionalized" believers but it is practical. Think about it, we always talk about how crime would be higher if guns were banned. We also say that gun free zones are the most dangerous because that's gonna be where the criminals feel safest to commit their crimes. A church is a practically understood but not legally instigated "gun free zone" so you can carry in church but no one will expect it. Meaning, the church would be towards the top of my "Must Carry Zones" list.

 

[Jorg Nysgerrig]

The churches usually ban guns on their premises BUT the law says you can carry a concealed weapon in the churches with the proper concealed carry permit. So basically, the churches have been over ruled.

Depends on the state. Not every state law says that, in fact some specifically say the opposite.

 

[Owens]

Absolutely. Legal to do so.

 

[Firepower!]

Very interesting spectrum of views.

 

[lance22]

I carry in church 3x a week.

I've been carrying in church for several years. Most of the people there have never seen me unarmed. Concealed means concealed so no worries about what other people think or how they would react.

I hug many, many people each time I'm there. Every now and then a hand goes squarely on the 4:00 position of the belt right on top of my 1911 or Kahr but nobody has ever thought twice about it.

Churches have a number of security issues: (1) They collect large amounts of cash that are loosely (if at all) guarded. (2) Rough characters are often dragged in by relatives 'to get some churchin' (3) Estranged, vindictive spouses know they can find their x there every Sunday and sometimes show up to share choice words (4) Preacher visits prisons and some of these people show up after release, sometimes only to look for money (5) Drifters and lowlifes view churches as a general purpose charity [which they really are not] and some get angry when they are offered food instead of cash. (6) Pedophiles never prey upon children at church, right? Hey, my church has 3 registered sex offenders and I have no doubt that they'd be allowed to teach a children's class if they requested to do so.

My efforts to protect me and mine don't require an explanation nor an apology, but I do think it's worth noting that bad things sometimes happen at church.

 

[MD_Willington]

Uhmm, maybe...

 

[Jason_G]

Nope.

Illegal in Louisiana. Not worth losing your right to own a gun or going to jail over. I find it silly, but I obey the laws.

Jason

 

[DawgFvr]

Lance22: You have said it all....and so succinctly!

We need to get all the politicos to begin thinking like you and me...or, we can just move them all to Louisiana.

 

[ldp4570]

950BS, it beats throwing the good book at the bad guy.

 

[Geronimo45]

I carry to church. It's legal. I don't find it disrespectful.

 

[LT1coupe]

Concealed, would not be known unless there was a dire need, At that point I doubt anyone would consider stopping someone from harming the flock as disrespectful. Odds are none of us will ever need our CCW, I'm grateful for that, but I couldn't live with the outcome if the odds ran out & I was not prepared

 

[gggman]

I always carry in church, but my wife is the only one in the church who knows. Usually I carry in a pocket or in an ankle holster, because the butt of the gun tends to clunk against the hard wooden pew when carrying on the belt.

 

[351 WINCHESTER]

I can't believe that the Church of LDS doesn't allow ccw in Utah. They must have forgotten that Mr. John Moses Browning was one of their elders in the Mormon faith.

 

[mljdeckard]

I heard it expressed this way once.

When Brigham Young was giving counsel about dealing with hostile Utes in the Utah territory, he advised; "Pray always, but keep your powder dry."

Many of us would just keep the powder dry.

 

[KI.W.]

Don´t keep powder too dry. It means big troubles for you and people near your gun when thu gun speaks.

 

[BozemanMT]

I do snow plow for a few church's. In one of the contracts it says "no weapons allowed"
It's 3 in the morning, there is nobody around, it's dark and you are alone, church's are NOT in high visibility area's, they are big parking lots.
What do you think I do and I have my wife do (she plows also in a seperate vehicle)?
contract be dammed.

someone mentioned up above that (and I'm paraphrasing here) "they obey all the laws because the church said to".

I would ask, do you obey all laws, or do you obey all just laws?
I think there's an important difference. The law of the land was slavery not very long ago, would you have obeyed that? In Missouri the law said that it was legal to kill Mormon's (and that law wasnt' repealed til recently (last 20/30 years or so). I ask this LDS gentleman, would he have that all should obey all laws? Or only just ones?

Something to think about.

 

[RKBABob]

An incident happened at a church I used to attend a few years ago that helped me see the value of CCW at church, just as well as any other place.

It was a very evangelical, full-gospel kind of church. Many would say it is on its way to becomming a 'mega-church' with multiple locations and over 6,000 active members, most of them describing themselves as born-again Christians. It was also very youth-oriented, with modern decor, large video screens, and a live band at every service.

It so happens that a young lady, maybe in her mid 20's attended this chrurch, and became quite active in it. She attended the Sunday service, the Wednesday night believers' service, the Bible study club, and the young adults group at the downtown location.

A stranger wanders into the young adults group one night, and gives himself to Jesus after repenting of his sins. This young lady was unaware that his sins included wife beating, and took him under her wing. He began attending the various Bible studies and groups with her, and the two became romantically involved.

After a while, she became weary of living in sin with the man she met while discussing the Bible, and was especially alarmed by his controling nature. She attempted to change him through Bible study and prayer, but it didn't work. Eventually her friends began to notice something was wrong with the relationship, and advised her to back away from the relationship for a while.

After she told the guy she'd like a little space, and to discontinue the premarital sex, he became enraged. She told friends that his attitude scared her, and that he may be stalking her. She was correct, unfortunately. The guy she met at church followed her to work one morning, and shot her dead in her car.

There is no guarantee that a person professing to be a Christian, and attending church and Bible studies, doesn't have dangerous issues with rage! Many people in prison find religion, and unfortunately, some people in our churches may belong in prison. Don't be a sheep. Be a strong man of faith, peaceful in nature, but capable of defending his family and all that G-d has given him.

 

[RKBABob]

Lance22 wrote:

Churches have a number of security issues: (1) They collect large amounts of cash that are loosely (if at all) guarded.

My last church had 2,000 members at each Sunday service, and many of them tithe. If the average donation was $20, that would be $40,000 during each of 3 services! That would certainly get a thief's notice. The thieves were already stealing the CDs, books, and devotional materials that traveling preachers would bring along with them. A volunteer had to be assigned to stand in the lobby during service, and guard the religious goods.

(2) Rough characters are often dragged in by relatives 'to get some churchin'

Yep, we'd especially reach out to those having issues with drugs, sex, and bad relationships in order to help them get their lives straightened out.

(3) Estranged, vindictive spouses know they can find their x there every Sunday and sometimes show up to share choice words

See my previous post, above.

(4) Preacher visits prisons and some of these people show up after release, sometimes only to look for money

We just began an official prison ministry when I stopped attending... I believe members were ministering to prisoners on their own prior to this. Who knows, maybe I worshipped next to a convicted rapist and didn't know it.

(5) Drifters and lowlifes view churches as a general purpose charity [which they really are not] and some get angry when they are offered food instead of cash.

I haven't seen this at any church I've attended... but I had the misfortune of meeting someone who would beg money from pastors every Sunday, and move on to the next church when the pastor would cut off the financial aid to this person within a few weeks.

(6) Pedophiles never prey upon children at church, right? Hey, my church has 3 registered sex offenders and I have no doubt that they'd be allowed to teach a children's class if they requested to do so

In many states, churches are exempt from criminal background checks, and the usual paperwork involved in running a daycare or childrens' classes. The church I used to attend had a very good eye toward security when it involved children. All childcare workers had to pass an FBI and state criminal background check before they were allowed into their volunteer positions. This wasn't required, but was done anyway. Other security measures involved security doors that you had to be buzzed into, and strict sign in and sign out of each child. The children weren't released to anyone except the person who signed them into the room.

Talk to your pastor, and suggest that all workers involved in the childrens' ministry undergo a background check. The cost is only $35, I believe, and well worth the piece of mind it provides.

 

[Thor Bloodax]

gun carry in Georgia

Georgia's Firearms License states: "Except as provided . . . a person is guilty of a misdemeanor when he or she carries to or while at a public gathering any explosive compound, firearm, or knife designed for the purpose of offense or defense. For the purpose of this Code section, "public gathering" shall include, but shall not be limited to, athletic or sporting events, churches or church functions, political rallies or functions, publicaly owned or operated buildings, or establishments which alcoholic beverages are sold for consumption on the premises. Nothing in this Code section shall otherwise prohibit the carrying of a firearm in any other public place by a person licensed to or permitted to carry such firearms by this part. This code section shall not apply to competitors participating in organized sport shooting events. Law enforcement officers, peace officers retired from state or federal law enforcement agencies, judges, magistrates, solicitors-general, and district attorneys may carry pistols in publicly owned or operated buildings. It is an affirmative defense to a violation of this code section if a person notifies a law enforcement officer or other person employed to provide security for a public gathering of the presence of such items as soon as possible after learning of its presence and surrenders or secures such item as directed by the law enforcement officer or other person employed to provide security for a public gathering."