CSA Marked Remington New Army ???? Can it be true?

[chriseger]

Ok guys, here’s what I have. I Remington 44-caliber Model New Army made during the Civil War. Correct Brass trigger guard, Stylized “GP” marking in small rectangle box on chipped grip panel which are the initials of Giles Porter, a Principal Sub-Inspector for the US Ordnance Department.
Under the barrel on the flat there are the markings 85504 CSA in a staggered strip as well as the same markings on the frame under the left grip panel.
There are no Barrel markings on the side of the barrel and it may have either been refinished or possibly not stamped at all as the barrel marking on the flat underside is still crisp and readable.

I have seen no other Remington New Army’s marked CSA anywhere and I ask the forum two questions;

1. – Could this be an act captured US Army weapon that was turned around and used by the Confederacy with CSA markings?

2. Could the markings instead have instead been placed post-war by a surplus seller such as Bannermans (which was known to place CSA markings on civil war era weapons to increase the value)
Any information or guidance anyone can give me would be appreciated.

 

[chriseger]

more images

 

[Ron James]

AFAIK, captured weapons were not remarked CSA.

 

[rcmodel]

Is it just me?
Or does the bluing look way too good to be a civil war gun?
No evidence of holster wear, and even a very light turn ring on the cylinder?

Just refinished recently?

rc

 

[Dr.Rob]

No pitting or erosion around the nipples, no nicks or marks in the frame around the chipped wood. Was this not fired much?

I'm curious as to the provenance. An Antiques Roadshow appraiser once commented 'there are so many FAKE CSA swords that they have become almost uncollectable.' I suspect someone added the CSA at another time, this was a VERY popular practice at one time to add some 'value' to otherwise dubious 'war surplus' items. The holster certainly looks vintage and the rust under the grips makes me beleive it's authentically old.

(Edited)

Based on other martially marked Remingtons I've looked up there should be single letter inspection marks (W, R, G and D) stamped on most of the components. (A crisp W stamped where the hammer enters the frame on the left side above the screw for example, and again on the cylinder) and the hammer should have evidence of case coloring. If these aren't there, it means they never were--or were 'polished out' in a refinish at some point. These are usually VERY deep on the trigger guard.

 

[rcmodel]

Must have been in Robert E. Lee's sock drawer all this time!

Even the hammer screw has never been buggered with a screwdriver, or the brass guard dinged!

As for the rust under the grips?
Looks like fairly new red rust just forming, not old old rust & patena one would expect to see under there after 150 years.

And no change in blue on the grip frame flat where that chip apparently has been missing since Andrew Johnson was president?

Even the inside of the "old" grips look like pretty fresh walnut with no oil stains or black grime in the wood grain.

I'd bet my bippy it has at least been hot blued in the last 50 years or so, if not an outright fake.

Authetic civil war revolvers just don't end up looking like that after 150 years.

rc

 

[eastbank]

i once bought a csa dog tag made out of a 1852 half dollar,the man was in the 8th texas ranger out fit,and boy did it look real. i got it at a real good price and wanted to make sure it was real so i contacted a expert. he said it was a fake and thought it was made in the 30,s, and that alot of the tags were out there with the same mans name on them, plus why would a man have 20 or so tags made? i sold it as a fake to a civil war reinactor who just loved it. eastbank.

 

[GeoffC]

I might be way off base here, but the front sight looks suspect to me. From what I've seen, and read, that front sight should be German Silver? No?

Are we for sure it's not an Italian revolver?

 

[Oyeboten]

Usually, also, Metal Stamp Caracters at that time would be Roman and not Gothic, or would be Serriffed Numerals or Letters, at any rate, far as that goes.


Also, it does not take much for intelligence to manage one's Stamping Characters to be straight and lined up, and, at that time, a man would have been chided or scolded by his fellows, if stamping something so crookedly, especially if it were an assigned Task of an Armorer, where, only a little care and forthought would allow a nice presentation of the Characters.


Condition also, does all in all suggest it is improbable that this is an original configuration Arm.


And, it does look like a re-Blue to me, also.

 

[Jim K]

If the CS Army had had a fourth the number of weapons in 1862 as they had in 1992, they would have won the war!

But not all are fake. I have the very M1 Carbine that Gen'l. Grant carried at Gettysburg, and am willing to part with it to any serious collector, a serious collector being anyone with a whole lot of money (US, not Confederate). I have Gen'l Lee's .45 Automatic also, with CSA on the slide, but I am holding onto that until I really need money.

Jim

 

[hardworker]

I'll trade you George Washington's Luger for the 45

 

[rcmodel]

Luger?
That's just silly!

Everyone knows George Washington carried a Glock Fo-Tay.

rc

 

[hardworker]

The guy at the gun show told me it was the same Luger Stalin used to shoot Hitler.