Cylinder locked up with Buffalo Bore .38 +P?

[Scotticus]

What happened here?

I was out shooting my Taurus 85 SS Ultralight yesterday and thought I'd try some Buffalo Bore Heavy .38 Sp +P 158 gr. L.S.W.C.H.P.--G.C. (1,000fps/M.E. 351 ft.lbs.).

I was shooting single action and fired 2 rounds just fine then the cylinder locked up. I could not cock the hammer and I had a really hard time getting the cylinder open. I checked the 3 remaining rounds for jumped crimp and did not see anything unusual. I reloaded those three rounds and fired them all without further incident.

The gun is +P rated and I've never had a speck of problem with anything else I've fed through it before or since.

First off--let me say that's the last time I try that! When BB says they are low end .357 mag ballistics, they aren't kidding! Aside from the reliability issue in this gun, those things almost hurt in that 17 ounce gun! These will be confined to my SP101 from now on.

 

[XDShooter07]

I was gonna say crimp jump but you already ruled that out... Maybe you had some kind of trigger reset issue? I only say that because you said you couldn't cock the hammer. Have you ever had the internals cleaned out? I don't know how many rounds you have through the gun.

 

[Jim March]

Something tied up the action from recoil. Damned if I know what, but, a quality gun shouldn't do that.

I have a 17oz 38snub too - a vintage Charter Arms Undercover (late 1970s production). Good gun, unusually accurate, but there's no way I'd shoot BB 38+Ps in it.

 

[Old Fuff]

This is a long shot...

Taurus revolvers often have very tight cylinder/barrel gaps - sometimes too tight if you shoot lead vs jacketed bullets. Those super-hot BB loads could have let enough lead smear on the back of the barrel and cylinder face to bind up the cylinder.

I also would recommend that you not shoot those loads in any aluminum or titanium frame revolver. Do stick to your Ruger.

 

[Hawk]

With the caveat that the Fuff has forgotten more than I'll ever know, I like to take guesses on occasion.

Perhaps check for primer flow tieing up against the FP bushing. If the Taurus recoil shield / bushing is like the 686 "pre 'M'" the extra pressure might have uncovered a problem that ordinarily would have stayed hidden.

How's about a pic of the primer?

It's a long shot - BB is careful about pressures generated and "low end .357 mag ballistics" != "low end .357 mag pressures".

 

[rdrancher]

I have a 17oz 38snub too - a vintage Charter Arms Undercover (late 1970s production). Good gun, unusually accurate, but there's no way I'd shoot BB 38+Ps in it.

I wouldn't fire them from my vintage Undercover either.

For testing purposes I have fired that same BB round in my sub-15oz 642-1, but I have no intentions of doing it again. I'll stick to BB's standard pressure rounds or the softer recoiling Speer Gold Dot 135gr +P in my middleweight j-frames.

rd

 

[Scotticus]

Hawk--I am sorry, but I am just a casual shooter and don't have the slightest idea what you are talking about. I don't know what primer flow is or an FP bushing or recoil shield, but one of the five rounds I shot has the primer sticking up just the tiniest little bit ever so slightly more than the other four. I don't think my camera can take a clear pic that close.

 

[SDC]

One possibility is that the ejector-rod started to unscrew, making it just long enough to make it difficult to push out of the frame; this or the bullets jumping the crimp are the two most common causes for a locked-up cylinder.

 

[Water-Man]

Had the same thing happen to me with a Taurus. It was a
.45 LC using Cor-Bon ammo.

 

[Hawk]

I'd bet it's not the ejector rod unscrewing - only because he reloaded three rounds and they worked fine. An unscrewed ejector rod would give grief with the last three.

I don't know what primer flow is or an FP bushing or recoil shield, but one of the five rounds I shot has the primer sticking up just the tiniest little bit ever so slightly more than the other four. I don't think my camera can take a clear pic that close.

I'm no expert either but your original description is reminiscent of what can happen with very light loads or the "primer only" wax bullet loads.

On firing standard loads, the primer backs out and is pushed back in by the recoil shield. If the load is too light, the primer is left sticking out the nether end of the brass and ties up against the recoil shield.

I was speculating that a heavy load might cause the primer to back out and stay that way. I've seen something similar with a bad lot of S&B where the primers were just loose.

Anyhow, if you've got one with a primer backed out, regardless of how it got that way, that may have been it. Revolvers hate "sticking out primers" and they'll wrap the thing around the axle emphatically.

Somebody else will have to advise how your primer got that way. I don't know if high pressure "flow" can mimic a low-pressure phenomenon. But you've sure got me interested now.

I've got a fair amount of first hand experience with tieing up cylinders with "primer only" rounds from my attempt to "shoot out" over-seated primers from a noob reloading whoops (no projectile). Locks it up solid. It took a while before I stumbled across a Jim March / Old Fuff thread explaining the dynamics of primers under pressure. It's not something I'd have guessed.

 

[Scotticus]

It was the primer. I loaded the spent case in which the primer wasn't flush and sure enough, it bound up when I tried to cock the gun. The other cases had no problem. Thanks for everyone's help.

 

[Hawk]

WooHoo!!

Didja see that Fuff?
I got one!

By accident, and only partly, but I sort of got one.

Thanks, Scotticus. You've made my month.

 

[loneviking]

It was the primer. I loaded the spent case in which the primer wasn't flush and sure enough, it bound up when I tried to cock the gun. The other cases had no problem. Thanks for everyone's help.

You do spin the cylinder after you load and close it, don't you? If not, it's a good habit to get into...

 

[contenderman]

With the tight tolerances ... a primer sticking up "slightly" can be just enough to lock things up.

Stick w/ loads/ammo appropriate for your pistol and you should have no problems.