CZ 75 9mm and 147 Grainers

[Chuck R.]

I'm attempting to load 147s for my new CZ75 "Accu-Shadow" Lite from CZ Custom and running into issues due to the short throat.

Prior to this my shortest throated pistol was my Walther PPQs and I've managed to make several ogive profiles work. The new CZ though is a PITA as I have to seat short enough that I'm running into buckling brass issues.

I've contacted several smiths (known for throating CZs) about reaming the throat, but none are doing it now due to the nitriding and reamer wear/damage.

Do any of you have success loading 147s for your CZ?? IF so what make bullets?

 

[otrman]

While not exactly the same gun, I have a CZ 75 SP-01 and a 75 Tactical Sport Orange. Haven't gotten around to reloading yet, bought 2000 from Georgia Arms for the brass. I shoot their 147 gr JHP and have no issues in either gun, OAL is 1.128". No idea what bullet they use, maybe see if you can guess from their site or maybe call and ask.

 

[rfwobbly]

In eastern Europe all the ammo is Round Nose FMJ, so that's what your chamber is cut for. The safest bullet for you to start with then is the 147gr RN from Berry Mfg. I know that one will work at an OAL around 1.140-1.150 without trouble from the chamber or case. (This assumes that you are not trying to use brass with the internal step.) There is a short list of other 147gr bullets that will work, but Berry is one that works in every CZ chamber.

 

[Artofgolf]

I'm attempting to load 147s ...I have to seat short enough that I'm running into buckling brass issues... IF so what make bullets?

I don’t load for a CZ, but I think the 147gr XTP may be helpful with the buckling brass with the boattail configured base. Good luck!

 

[roval]

i mainly shoot 147 gr rn or flat point . used to be plated with xtreme, then sns casting powder coated. i have never had a problem with my czs: pcr, 75 b since traded, 85 combat , 75 sp o1, p10c, 75 Shadow 2

i have it from 1.117 to 1.120 coal.

 

[Chuck R.]

Guys,

THANKS! Should have been a little more specific. I'm looking for a 147 match bullets, not JHPs. I go through about 20-25K of these a year between practice and matches. I've tried these 147 RNFPs when loaded to 1.130" or so and they chamber:



Wondering if anybody has any other bullets they've gotten to work. I'll take a look at the Berry's or at least a similar profile.

 

[fxvr5]

If by Match bullets mean mean accurate ones, the Hornady 147 XTPs tend to be some of the more accurate 147 grain bullets out there. Other bullets that might also do well are the Remington 147 FMJ and RMR 147 FMJ FP.

 

[Chuck R.]

If by Match bullets mean mean accurate ones, the Hornady 147 XTPs tend to be some of the more accurate 147 grain bullets out there. Other bullets that might also do well are the Remington 147 FMJ and RMR 147 FMJ FP.

More like IDPA & 3GUN......max accuracy not required, volume loading/shooting is.

 

[fxvr5]

More like IDPA & 3GUN......max accuracy not required, volume loading/shooting is.

Well, accuracy is relative and in order to meet your goal you might have to use whatever bullet will provide the necessary accuracy. This is to be determined by what your gun likes. If only 'max accuracy' bullets will do that, those are the ones to use.

Also, the RMR FMJ FP bullets are surprisingly inexpensive. Less than many plated bullets.

 

[Dudedog]

RMR 147 FMJ FP.

This bullet shot well for me but I don't think it will be happy with a short chamber.
From RMRs web site

his bullet requires a seating depth minimum OAL of about 1.10″ to chamber reliably in most handguns when loading 9mm. Most reloading manuals will specify a 1.13″ for a flat nose 147 and we’ve found that it works well in our guns. However, there are some handguns that have a very short leade that will not allow for the bullet to be seated that long. Glock Gen 5’s and CZ pistols are known for their short leades and this bullet may not work for them. For those guns we recommend the 124 grain MatchWinner.

Nothing wrong with the bullet it's just the profile might not be what you are after with a short lead chamber.

I really like the RMR MPR 124s and the 124 Match Winners work great to, but of course are not 147gr bullets.


Pic of the 147s, Note the shape long body/bearing surface short nose.
A long bearing surface is good if you don't have a short lead barrel.

 

[roval]

Guys,

THANKS! Should have been a little more specific. I'm looking for a 147 match bullets, not JHPs. I go through about 20-25K of these a year between practice and matches. I've tried these 147 RNFPs when loaded to 1.130" or so and they chamber:

View attachment 806235

Wondering if anybody has any other bullets they've gotten to work. I'll take a look at the Berry's or at least a similar profile.

forgive my ignorance but why load them so long? the pic looks like it was from MBC 147 gr fp i've used them in my czs but not seated too long.

 

[DLrocket89]

I shoot an SP-01 in USPSA Production class and I run these:

http://www.acmebullet.com/bullets-reloading-brass/9MM-Lead-Cast-Reloading-Bullets?product_id=456

Match load is that over 3.3 grains of Win 231 with a CCI primer and a COAL of 1.09". Regular primer (CCI 500) is good for about 905 fps (pf 131) and a magnum primer (CCI 550) is good for about 918 fps (133 pf) last time I clocked them, which was at about 65 degrees F outside.

I've run about 2300 rounds of that load this year, zero problems. I should note that I disassemble my pistol and use the chamber as a "plunk test" gauge, every round gets tested. I use mixed headstamp brass and there's one headstamp in particular ("CBC") that the chamber really doesn't like. Prescreen and you're good to go.

 

[Chuck R.]

forgive my ignorance but why load them so long? the pic looks like it was from MBC 147 gr fp i've used them in my czs but not seated too long.

When I seat them to a length the CZ75 will "plunk" at, the brass (approx 5 out of 100) will buckle, creating a ridge above the web that will not chamber. I've tried going light on the taper crimp and belling and I still get a couple. Brass is mixed, and at this volume I'm not sorting, nor trimming.......RMR 147s bullets loaded to 1.15xx don't have issues in:

HK (2)
S&W (2)
COLT (Carbine)
Walther (2)

And load with the typical "wasp waste".

Since I'd like to find a load that works in everything (it's a logistics thing) I may not be able to use the RMRs. I also ran into the same issue with the coated 147 "grooveless" bullets. The ogive shape prevented seating long in Walther's.

I'll take a look at DL's recommendation and order 100 to test.

 

[Chuck R.]

Well, accuracy is relative and in order to meet your goal you might have to use whatever bullet will provide the necessary accuracy. This is to be determined by what your gun likes. If only 'max accuracy' bullets will do that, those are the ones to use.

Also, the RMR FMJ FP bullets are surprisingly inexpensive. Less than many plated bullets.

Understood...normally I would, but I load for 10 9mms, none of which are used for bullseye level competition. So far I place pretty well with a "factory level" of accuracy and a a lot of practice. So my emphasis is on OK accuracy combined with volume.

The RMR cost was why I was so interested....but IF the profile doesn't work, "it is what it is" so to say.

 

[roval]

When I seat them to a length the CZ75 will "plunk" at, the brass (approx 5 out of 100) will buckle, creating a ridge above the web that will not chamber. I've tried going light on the taper crimp and belling and I still get a couple. Brass is mixed, and at this volume I'm not sorting, nor trimming.......RMR 147s bullets loaded to 1.15xx don't have issues in:

HK (2)
S&W (2)
COLT (Carbine)
Walther (2)

And load with the typical "wasp waste".

Since I'd like to find a load that works in everything (it's a logistics thing) I may not be able to use the RMRs. I also ran into the same issue with the coated 147 "grooveless" bullets. The ogive shape prevented seating long in Walther's.

I'll take a look at DL's recommendation and order 100 to test.

but they won't plunk at 1.05 to 1.120 or thereabouts? the lyman 356637 cast bullet data has a coal of 1.058. looks similar to the mbc in appearance, i never loaded it that short but it should be safe to do so. is bullet jump to the rifling as crucial in pistol? you're not shooting bullseye.

to be honest i hardly plunk test. i just go within the coal and use my chamber gauge. i plunk test swcs and cycle dummy swcs

i load with mixed brass. i shoot slow but they're still good for 50 yrd gongs 10 to 9 inches with the shorter seating.

 

[Chuck R.]

but they won't plunk at 1.05 to 1.120 or thereabouts? the lyman 356637 cast bullet data has a coal of 1.058. looks similar to the mbc in appearance, i never loaded it that short but it should be safe to do so. is bullet jump to the rifling as crucial in pistol? you're not shooting bullseye.

to be honest i hardly plunk test. i just go within the coal and use my chamber gauge. i plunk test swcs and cycle dummy swcs

i load with mixed brass. i shoot slow but they're still good for 50 yrd gongs 10 to 9 inches with the shorter seating.

Some will....but then I get the bulge in the brass while seating. So far it's just the RMR 147 grain RN that does it. Unfortunately I bought a couple K of them. I'm loading them now "Long" and will just use them in my carbine and S&Ws. Not a huge deal, but I am researching for my next bullet purchase in a month or so. I've got 2.5K loaded now of bullets that work in everything, but that's about a month of shooting.

 

[kmw1954]

Chuck R., sounds like a familiar story. I have a Witness 45acp that I was having a horrible time with as far as loading for it. This gun shoots factory stuff all day long. Finally found by talking with some guys on the CZ forum that the CZ and Witness barrels have short throats and tight chambers and most there know and accept this. I have found that with the 3 different bullets I use I have to load them all about .005" to .010" shorter to get them to chamber reliably. Also found that for this gun I really need to use a Factory Crimp Die to get them to reliably feed and chamber.

Hope you are able to find a profile that will fit and suite your needs! I Love my Witness and am not going to alter it.

 

[Average Joe]

Bullets with a fat head ( v-crowns) will not fully chamber in my CZ, and they also FTF on almost every round. It's just because of the short throat.( when I seat them deep so they chamber , they FTF ) Use a round nose, or tapered bullet like( Precision Delta's FMJ, ) For round nose bullets , any brand will do.

 

[Artofgolf]

Chuck, I looked thru my notes and found this:

https://www.thehighroad.org/index.php?threads/9mm-147gr-coated-bullet.773917/#post-9837029

I'm wondering if the ogive here could help with CZ-75? The Better Bullets RNFP coated 147gr worked well in some tests back in 2015.

 

[Chuck R.]

Chuck, I looked thru my notes and found this:

https://www.thehighroad.org/index.php?threads/9mm-147gr-coated-bullet.773917/#post-9837029

I'm wondering if the ogive here could help with CZ-75? The Better Bullets RNFP coated 147gr worked well in some tests back in 2015.

Yup! that profile will work. I still have some dummy's loaded from when I used those coated 147s. They dropped right in and "plunked" at 1.132".

Looks like I'm getting some on order!

 

[Dwb1957]

I have been shooting the acme 147 f/p out of my shadow 2 the longest I can load this bullet is 1.130 and found that it groups the best at 1.110 oal using 3.1 grs of sport pistol, getting right at 900 fps with this load.