CZ-75 Vs CZ-75B

[phoglund]

I was ordering a CZ-82 from AIM Surplus when on impulse I added the CZ-75 they had on the same online catalogue page. I've always heard great things about CZ-75 pistols but am now wondering if I should have saved the money spent on the original CZ-75 and bought one of the new CZ-75Bs. Does anybody have both and if so what are their impressions of the differences and relative useability/accuracy/value. Here is the description from the AIM website:

Item#CZ75
We just received a small lot of the Original CZ-75 9mm Pistols. These unissued pistols were manufactured in 1992. These are Pre "B", Non-Transitional Pistols. Features include Round Trigger guard and Spur Hammer. Comes in original CZ box with 2-15rd magazines, Test Target, Certificate, Cleaning Rod, and Bore Brush. We have only a very small quantity of these pistols so order fast.

Thanks inadvance for your help.


- Paul

 

[Gary G23]

The B has a rounded hammer, firing pin safety, and replaceable sights.

 

[270Win]

Anyone know why it says "No sales in MD"?

 

[Will5A1]

I was considering buying one of the CZ75's AIM has but have decided against it for a number of reasons. As I understand the pre-B 75 may or may not accept current CZ75B mags and older style mags are more expensive and hard to find. Some of the parts will not interchange and CZ-USA will not offer warranty support. You may want to check the information on the forums at CZ-USA.com

 

[Tecolote]

Don't second guess yourself, you did good ordering a CZ75. Having said that, I opted against ordering one:

1. Replacement take down/slide stop levers and safety levers are no longer available
2. Front sight is milled into the slide
3. I've had bad experiences with CZs made at the end of the Red era
4. No warranty from CZ USA, something goes wrong you're SOL
5. May or may not take newer mags without modification
6. Fit and finish on newer CZs is nicer than older examples
7. $383 for NIB CZ75B (Bud's price) compared to $450

But on the other hand:

1. The rounded trigger guard and original back strap look great
2. What's the likelihood of breaking a slide stop or safety?
3. Chance to own something stamped with the name of an extinct country
4. Probably won't be able to get them once the AIM batch is gone

A lot of people claim that triggers are nicer on pre-Bs. I've had the chance to try a fair number of CZs, and IMHO it's the luck of the draw. Some pre-Bs have terrible triggers and some Bs have great triggers. It's not consistent enough to support the generalization that one is better than the other.

Congrats on your pre-B. Please post pics and a range report.

 

[atblis]

Common question

The older 75s
have spur hammers, which bite some people
have no firing pin safety (cocked and locked carry only)
have rounded trigger guards (a matter of aesthetics)
sometimes are picky about mags (not always though). Usually factory mags will work. They just don't like aftermarket mags.
Generally have nicer triggers

Newer 75bs
have rounded hammers (with the exception of the the retro)
Have a firing pin safety (can carry hammer down)
Don't have to worry about parts ands mags

SOme other things. Some of the older finishes (enamel and polycoat) on the CZs are not as durable as the newer polycoat guns. The new polycoat is quite robust. As far as reliability, accuracy, and durability, that is pretty much a wash. I have both, and both have been great. If you want something older and maybe someday collectable, then get a PreB. If you just want a good shooter, get a new 75B.

 

[Tecolote]

atblis,

Not trying to flame, you made some great points, but either the CZ75 or the CZ75B can be carried loaded hammer down. Both require care when lowering the hammer, and some would say that the B is safer due to the firing pin safety, but loaded DA is possible on either model.

 

[Golddog]

Older (pre-2002) CZ's should be MD legal. Newer models must come with an internal lock or one of a few approved aftermarket barrel locking devices, and they must include a fired cartridge.

Some dealers and distributors are peeved at MD laws and so won't sell anything here, even when legal.

 

[Walt Sherrill]

1. Replacement take down/slide stop levers and safety levers are no longer available

Not exactly.

The current slide stop is a replacement. It looks different but functions fine in the pre-B guns.

A few parts, like a safety detent on the oldest pre-B, are hard to find, but not all pre-Bs use that part. The parts are sometimes available, just not from CZ-USA.

Mags are an issue, but the guns can be modified to make that less of an issue. At least one Gunsmith participating on the CZ Forum does this. But older 15-round CZ factory mags fit well, and aren't particularly expensive. Most shooters who have them will happily trade you one for a 16-round Mec-Gar mag.

But, in keeping with the general theme here, I'd prefer a new CZ-75B, with an action job over a pre-B. Its still covered by warranty, no problems with mags, and parts are great supply, and you can find a number of replacement sights, including tritium, if you want them.

And an action job (done by someone with the proper jigs to redo the hammer/sear angle) will give you a smooth double-action trigger, and a SA trigger nearly as crisp as a 1911.

I've had a number of CZ-75s, but no longer have any. I've got two B models (a75B SA, 75B Compact), and an 85 Combat -- plus a couple of clones.

 

[Deer Hunter]

I was thinking about getting one of the pre-B CZ 75s, but then I saw the price. I paid less for my CZ 75B in Satin Nickle.

 

[cvb]

CZ warranty

My expereience has been good so far with CZ USA re
help with pistol repair on a 1985 75. Wouldnt worry so much
but then again there are only a handful of proven pistol designs
worth spendin.

 

[atblis]

Forgot about the warranty

"Not trying to flame, you made some great points, but either the CZ75 or the CZ75B can be carried loaded hammer down. Both require care when lowering the hammer, and some would say that the B is safer due to the firing pin safety, but loaded DA is possible on either model."

You could carry a 75 with hammer down, but that would be no different than carrying a single action revolver on a loaded chamber (as far as safety is concerned). Would most people carry a SA revolver on a loaded chamber? Don't think so (it isn't recommended). That is why I say you must carry cocked and locked with a non firing pin safety CZ. CZ75s were originially intended for cocked and locked. The DA is for second strike capability.

 

[Tecolote]

You could carry a 75 with hammer down, but that would be no different than carrying a single action revolver on a loaded chamber (as far as safety is concerned). Would most people carry a SA revolver on a loaded chamber? Don't think so (it isn't recommended). That is why I say you must carry cocked and locked with a non firing pin safety CZ. CZ75s were originially intended for cocked and locked. The DA is for second strike capability.

Good analogy, there's a risk with carrying hammer down on a loaded chamber with a CZ75, no doubt that's why CZ came up with the B mods. You're right about the cocked and locked carry, and DA intended as a second strike. CZ wasn't alone in their thinking, Beretta 92s operate the same way.

 

[Walt Sherrill]

I think you've greatly exaggerated the risk associated with carrying an older CZ hammer down -- as it is certainly NOT the same as carrying a SA revolver (with a fixed firing pin) in the same manner.

The CZ-75, like nearly all semi-auto pistols made prior to the introduction of firing pin blocks (a relatively recent enhancement) has an inertial firing pin. The firing pin must be slammed forward, after a healthy strike, to bridge the gap to the primer. A revolver with a solid pin (like the old Colts), if struck or dropped, would fire easily. The firing pin was virtually ON the primer. A semi-auto pistol with an inertial firing pin is much less likely to fire. While it can happen, its not nearly as unsafe or likely as an old SA revolver.

Then, too, if there's no firing pin block, even carrying COCKED AND LOCKED doesn't keep an inertial firing pin from going forward when there's enough force applied to the gun (as in a drop). Cocked and locked, because it keeps the hammer out of the way, makes it less likely to happen with some type of blows.

I've been following CZs for a number of years and haven't heard that hammer down with the pre-B was a common cause of Negligent Discharges... I have heard of ONE neg. disch. (from an owner) when the hammer dropped from the half-cock notch, but don't remember if that was a pre-B or B model (with trigger pulled back.

 

[atblis]

If you've ever dropped a loaded gun

that firing pin block sure makes you feel better.

 

[Cliff47]

A while back CZ-USA brought out a CZ75 Retro model. Has the profile (round trigger guard, spur hammer) of the original CZ75, and the internals of the CZ75B (Internal firing pin block and takes the current 16-round mags). This would be the 'best' of both designs for someone that likes the 'old' profile, but wants the 'new' improvements. Check out www.RSRgroup.com for availability. RSR has them listed with two 10-round mags. Additional information can be found on the www.czforum.com under the Retro Club.

Something to consider. Just my .02.

 

[Croyance]

I thought that the metullurgy of the pre-B CZ-75's was different.

It might not be for sale in Maryland because they don't want to fuss with supplying a spent shell casing. Must that be supplied by the manufacturer or can a distributor test-fire it?

 

[steveracer]

Man! People are really confused about physics.

It takes an enormous amount of force to make that very small firing pin move forward against the inertial spring and into a primer hard enough to fire it. Enough force that the gun would likely be badly damaged or destroyed.
The military did this with the 1911 pistol: They dropped these guns directly on their muzzle on concrete from 12 feet, and none of them ever fired.
You just aren't going to make these guns fire by dropping them. The firing pin spring is what, 11 pounds? The firing pin weighs a few grams. Hammer down, hammer back with safety on, you're going to be fine. CZs WILL fire from the half-cock notch, however. This according to Jim Miossi. His recomendation was hammer back, safety on, like the BHP.
I remove the firing pin block from all my guns that have them, right from the start. I did this with my CZ-75BSA, and the trigger is better, and it's no less safe than my 1911s.

 

[atblis]

Well

What's to keep the gun from falling on the hammer? If everytime you dropped a gun, it fell on its muzzle you might have a point.

 

[MikeH]

It might not be for sale in Maryland because they don't want to fuss with supplying a spent shell casing. Must that be supplied by the manufacturer or can a distributor test-fire it?

That's usually the case (pun fully intended). Between the laws on spent casings and integral locks, a lot of dealers simply give up on Maryland.

AFAIK, the casings have to be supplied by the manufacturer/importer.

 

[270Win]

Thanks a lot, Maryland

Does Massachusetts have the same law? I noticed they won't ship the pre-B CZ-75 there either.

 

[steveracer]

if you dropped it on the hammer, you'd have to break it.

It would have to drop the gun with enough force to override the sear. We're talking sledgehammer force here.
I think all you guys who feel like you need a firing pin block should leave your guns at home. How many decades have people carried 1911s and HiPowers without such things, cocked and locked, without incident? From the perspective in these posts, a transfer bar revolver is the only safe gun to carry.
The original CZ-75, carried cocked and locked, is IN NO WAY less safe than the "B" model.

 

[Walt Sherrill]

I'm not sure I'd say a pre-B was NOT less safe than a "B", but I'd not be greatly concerned about the possibilities of a accidental discharge from either of them -- due to blows or drops.

 

[atblis]

What's wrong with you people?

I am talking about carrying hammer down!

hammer down, no firing pin safety, drop gun, gun lands on hammer. Is that something you'd like to try?

Cocked and locked is fine in either case.
Hammer down on firing pin safety is probably fine.
Hammer down with no firing pin safety...

I don't believe the 75 was ever intended for hammer down carry.

 

[Walt Sherrill]

I'd be curious to know if anyone has any materials from CZ (or a reputable historian familiar with the topic) that tells us anything about the designers' intent on this matter. It would be interesting.

CZs were FREQUENTLY carried hammer down prior to introduction of the firing pin safeties. Many using the gun felt the potential "danger" of cocked and locked was greater than the potential danger of a drop or strike with hammer down.

All we've got now is opinion.