Details of New Executive Actions to be Announced Jan.5

[george burns]

Judge Npolitano explains it here

http://www.bizpacreview.com/2016/01...ill-be-challenged-in-court-291134?hvid=11sfJi

 

[orpington]

One other thing that came to mind:

I do not purchase firearms over the internet. This does not mean that I don't occasionally browse gunbroker or other firearms related sites.

EVERY ONE of these sites require, for anything not pre-1899, and, therefore, by definition, not even a 'firearm', an FFL transfer. SINCE WHEN can one purchase firearms over the internet without a background check? What am I missing?

With regards to another post, I thought all handgun sales between private individuals had to go through an FFL? I guess that must be a state thing? (I am in Pennsylvania).

 

[jerkface11]

So how does the CLEO notification work?

 

[Arizona_Mike]

Declare Befriend_Noraty;

Subroutine New_NFA_Weapon (
Find_and_Replace(oldTrustName, newTrustName);
Add_Trustees; )

Mike

 

[TimSr]

Are they going to ease up the rules for getting a FFL if they are really looking at people that sell as few as two guns?

This is an interesting question when you consider this same administration pushed for more restrictions and license fee increases to drive all the "kitchen table" FFL dealers out of business.

 

[hso]

SINCE WHEN can one purchase firearms over the internet without a background check? What am I missing?

People using the Internet and social media to advertise guns. Most are harmless, some are illegal dealers pretending to sell personal items.

 

[Warp]

SINCE WHEN can one purchase firearms over the internet without a background check? What am I missing?

There is no federal law against this. Unless prohibited by state law, you can lawfully ship a firearm (at least a long gun, i'd have to double check on handguns) to another person within the state.

 

[X-Rap]

The sky will not fall with these new EO's, what will happen IMO will be more incorrect information being disseminated by the left including those in gov and media that will further degrade the 2A. It's incrementalism and the attempt to intimidate the citizenry shouldn't be down played.
I think the new dealer clarification will have a chilling effect on private citizens rights to exchange property and will further impact gunshows and private sales which is the declared intent. While this isn't UBC by law, the ambiguity of the dealer definition if taken to its fullest and worst could incriminate virtually all private sales.
Here in CO we have had gunshow UBC for years and have had full UBC for a year and a half and I doubt you'll find an enthusiast who in the past has bought or sold
privately that will say it hasn't had a detrimental effect on them and their hobby.

 

[Yo Mama]

Am I the only one worried about funding smart gun technology?

They are really pushing harder lately on this front, and it scares the heck out of me to mandate a chip in my last ditch effort to stay alive.

 

[X-Rap]

Quote:
Are they going to ease up the rules for getting a FFL if they are really looking at people that sell as few as two guns?

This is an interesting question when you consider this same administration pushed for more restrictions and license fee increases to drive all the "kitchen table" FFL dealers out of business.

This is a question that has bothered me here in CO.
If there is/will be some sort of cap or limit that puts one at a dealer level but all your transaction are run through a licensed FFL could you still be prosecuted under the law as a non licensed dealer for having to many transactions?
Under the federal criteria I say yes but you are also following the letter of the UBC law and its intent? I see this as a potential issue if complying with the EO's if you believe as I do that they will be cracking down on private sales.

 

[jr45]

Current law prohibits individuals from buying a gun if, because of a mental health issue, they are either a danger to themselves or others or are unable to manage their own affairs. The Social Security Administration (SSA) has indicated that it will begin the rulemaking process to ensure that appropriate information in its records is reported to NICS.

This portion I find alarming. Sounds like the same MO that was used on thousands of our vets but now this can affect millions. I don't understand how this can be legally done? Does this some how meet 18 U.S. Code § 922 definition of legally defective?

 

[PapaG]

Looks like the rest of the country will be operating under Illinois type rules. In IL you, by law, must check validity of a buyer's FOID before making a private transfer, apply to the ISP for recognition before having a gun show, make background checks selling at a show. Also, reporting losses of firearms is required.
Not supporting any of O's package, just telling you all that for some of us it ain't new.
Still to be seen on the "what is a dealer thing".

 

[Sam1911]

EVERY ONE of these sites require, for anything not pre-1899, and, therefore, by definition, not even a 'firearm', an FFL transfer. SINCE WHEN can one purchase firearms over the internet without a background check? What am I missing?

I don't know about "every one" of those sites requiring that. There certainly are gun classifieds online -- and general classified ad sites as well -- that have no requirements other than a request that you follow the laws of your state and the federal government.

If you find a gun you want on your local classifieds board you can go to the guy's house, or meet at McDonalds or whatever and buy that gun with no paperwork at all. It is even legal (in almost all states) to do the transfer entirely by mail without even meeting the buyer or seller. (Careful on how you do the shipping, though. Tricky with handguns.)

With regards to another post, I thought all handgun sales between private individuals had to go through an FFL? I guess that must be a state thing? (I am in Pennsylvania).

I am also in PA and we are one of the few states that DO require all handgun transfers to go through a dealer.

 

[Warp]

With regards to another post, I thought all handgun sales between private individuals had to go through an FFL? I guess that must be a state thing? (I am in Pennsylvania).

That's just a stupid Pennsylvania thing. That is not the norm. Most of us can transfer handguns between private parties with the only requirements being all within the same state and no reason to believe the person receiving is a prohibited person.

You guys are effectively creating a handgun registry. Watch out or you'll follow Michigan's path...

 

[Sam1911]

You guys are effectively creating a handgun registry.

That's a hotly argued point. The PA court says no, not a registry, that would be illegal. PSP has used it as a registry though, and given people trouble over it when they clearly should not. Probably an argument that will eventually see that requirement destroyed, but ... not yet.

 

[Elkins45]

I heard a bunch of commies on the POTUS channel crowing about how Obama was "closing the gun show loophole" with his actions today.

I always thought that what they meant by that phrase was actually "making all private sales illegal," but I guess I was wrong???? Or maybe they were just little dogs barking at the end of their chains.

I am disappointed that I didn't submit one more electronic Form 1 for a SBR before 41P was implemented. I hate the idea of getting fingerprints done and I really notifying my small-town Sherriff that I have an NFA item. He's a great guy, but it's still not something I want the world to know.

 

[Gottahaveone]

The 200 new ATF agents, 230 NICS people, and the $500 Million for 'Health Care', all need to be funded by Congress in order to be implemented...

That's certainly not a problem for him. Congress has proved time and again that they are eager to roll over and give him anything he asks for in funding.

 

[Gtscotty]

Just to clarify, only trusts and corporations are affected by the change. Individuals don't have any change.

If your talking about the CLEO certification requirement the actual text of the rule change is pretty clear in that the CLEO certification is being changed to a notification for all applicants.

 

[anothernewb]

Somebody correct me if I'm wrong.

I'm reading in other places that basically, the new crap basically boils down to forcing private sellers whether online or face to face transactions to have a ffl and do background checks?

 

[mokin]

I feel safer.

I'm convinced The President is a shill for the gun industry. Every time he opens his mouth gun sales soar. Dec. 2015, in anticipation of his new gun rules, was one of the largest gun sales months in the last 2 decades, with over 1.6 million guns sold. He is probably personally responsible for keeping several faltering gun companies alive. He's the man!

I've heard several others say this as well. Furthermore, any imperial decree affecting a much broader firearm owner base would drive those gun owners who may go along with "common sense" infringements away from whichever candidate supports them.

I haven't made it to a store yet today but I can't imagine the shelves are bare. (I hope not anyway). Maybe I'll get started on that AR-15 I've got in boxes to celebrate.

 

[X-Rap]

That's a hotly argued point. The PA court says no, not a registry, that would be illegal. PSP has used it as a registry though, and given people trouble over it when they clearly should not. Probably an argument that will eventually see that requirement destroyed, but ... not yet.

This is one of our biggest problems IMO, it takes so long to get through the court system that even if a law or EO is found illegal there are so many hurt by the action that in many ways it has done its damage even if rescinded.
This new round has a lot left to interpretation and while it is just using existing laws with regards to dealers the ambiguity of the original law will now work against us.

 

[Sam1911]

Somebody correct me if I'm wrong.

I'm reading in other places that basically, the new crap basically boils down to forcing private sellers whether online or face to face transactions to have a ffl and do background checks?

No. Not even that. It basically didn't do anything.

 

[paradox998]

How soon are executive orders effective?

Are executive orders effective immediately? If so Obama is going to create large new class of felons as it takes quite a while to get a FFL03 license. As currently written there are requirements for a "place of business" that would be a major problem for individuals and potentially open their homes to federal inspection by the AFT.

 

[Mike OTDP]

If Obama were serious, really serious, he'd be trying to come up with a way for any seller to be able to run a background check on any buyer. No need to mandate its use, people will use it for their own peace of mind.

But that would require a degree of seriousness well beyond him.

 

[anothernewb]

As a non-political aside. Obama has done one thing for sure. Someone will note that he likely just created one of the largest (if not the largest) post-holidays new year gun sales surge.