Do I really have to get a rifle with a scope?

[Gewehr98]

It really does depend on the situation at hand.

I have no problem hitting life-sized buffalo silhouettes from 800-1000 yards with the Creedmoor vernier sight on my Sharps pictured earlier. But were I to try and win a benchrest competition with that rifle, I'd certainly need a scope, plus a little "assist" from the man above.

BTW, I'm very much aware of scoped Confederate sniper rifles - they were .451" Whitworth rifles, supplied by the British. ArmedBear's link doesn't like the external referral, so here's another pic of the infamous scoped Whitworth:

 

[ArmedBear]

Most people learning to use a scope have trouble finding the target in the scope and adjusting themselves to the rifle for proper eye relief.

...and yet, some people bash the idea of a scout-mount scope, which doesn't have either of these problems, without ever trying one...

 

[BC_bush_man]

Thanks!

Thanks for the great replies.

Scopeless it will be, for now anyways. I looked at the Marlin rifles--very nice! I think I will buy one of those (or maybe two). I like some of their small models too, like carrying a giant handgun, which we can't carry here in Canada. (Only criminals and cops have handguns here, law abiding citizens are not allowed to carry a handgun in any other place than a shooting range).

Besides the .22 which is a must, I might just get me a .44 mag or .357 model to handle any rabid bears that want to feed me to the cubs at my rural Cabin.
They are really nice and Marlin appears to have that "classic" look to their rifles.

I stand corrected: even Blondie used a metal scope for the hangman's rope and I guess scopes were around back then too.

Except for needing 1% reading glasses, I have 20/20 mid to long range vision, so I should be fine. (I had an eye exam 2 weeks ago)

This is way too exciting: I can't wait to get my first gun. I've learned so much from prowling this site, it's amazing.

Thanks again.

 

[Jack19]

Iron sights are great until you reach about age 40, plus or minus. Then, ever so slowly, that front sight starts getting aliiiiiittle fuzzy.

Then optics are your friend.

 

[ArmedBear]

BC- The sort of rifles you're talking about are the sort that are perfect for iron sights, since the rounds they shoot are very effective inside 100 yards, but drop fast past 150.

I was thinking of a bolt-action rifle, as opposed to one of those handy lever guns, which really fills the gap between the full-sized bolt-action, long-range rifle, and the handgun. With a long-range bolt gun, you're not going to get the full benefit of its great accuracy without a scope; the lever guns you want are very different firearms.

Hey, can you hunt with handguns in Canada?

BTW you can have guns up there that are illegal in many parts of the US, and a PITA to get elsewhere, though, like short-barrel shotguns.

 

[MatthewVanitas]

http://www.lymanproducts.com/lymanproducts/images/tangsght.jpg

Both Marble and Lyman also make tang sights for Marlins, if you feel inclined to upgrade your levergun.

If you're unfamiliar with peep sights, run a search here on THR, generally more accurate than open sights, and the older folks say that they're easier on the eyes.

Tang sights are the traditional way to get a peep sight on a levergun, but there are some modern peep sights out there that are less obtrusive.

-MV

 

[trstafford]

SASS

Sounds like you would like the Single Action Shooting Society (SASS) they shoot western type firearms in competiontions pistol, rifle, shotgun also long range period type rifles and from horseback with blanks at balloons. If you get OLN channel check out a program called Cowboys or go to Cowboystv.com

 

[BC_bush_man]

"Hey, can you hunt with handguns in Canada?"

I'm too new to this to have a definitive answer for you. I did look into it a while back and asked the president of the local shooting club about handguns.
He said it is illegal to use a handgun for any other purpose than target shooting at a range. Not permitted under any circumstances for anything else. Cannot be used even on your own property no matter where you live even if you are a bushman in the Yukon. Instant confiscation and jail term will ensue.

On the other hand, my police recommended training instructor has told me that you can carry a handgun for hunting. Unfortunately, our conversation was cut short and i did not get any more info than that. Ask me again in six weeks, I will probably have found all the right booklets and legal literature on the subject by then.

 

[TimboKhan]

I scanned through the responses to this fairly quickly, but did anyone actually address how easy or difficult it would be to cut a rope using iron sights from any distance? I actually don't know, but it seems to me that it would be pretty darn hard to do simply because the front sight would eliminate any precise aiming on something like the average hangin' rope. Certainly, it is a possible shot, but unless I am really off, it seems like it would be one hell of a difficult shot at anything approching distance. On the other hand, I have never tried it, so far all I know, shooting ropes in half is as easy as petting a dog.

 

[Coronach]

Well...elevation wouldn't matter much, as long as they had enough rope! Windage would be a bear, though.

Mike

 

[gila_dog]

Two things...

If a 150 lb + hombre was hanging on the rope all you would have to do is nick it and it would probably break, like they do when the coyote is hanging from a cliff and the roadrunner starts pecking the rope.

BC_Bush_Man says he is interested in a Marlin lever action in 44 mag or 357 mag. These are real sweeties to shoot, no doubt. But you can also shoot 44 special and 38 special in them. DON'T DO IT! It won't be long before the shorter cartridges have boogered up the chamber and your rifle won't eat the longer magnum cartridges any more. :banghead: Either shoot nothing but magnums or nothing but specials.

 

[Frenchy]

These are real sweeties to shoot, no doubt. But you can also shoot 44 special and 38 special in them. DON'T DO IT! It won't be long before the shorter cartridges have boogered up the chamber and your rifle won't eat the longer magnum cartridges any more. Either shoot nothing but magnums or nothing but specials.

Actually, the same thing applies to the charge holes in the cylinders of revolvers. Attentiveness to proper cleaning will however alleviate the problem in both cases.

 

[LAK]

Bwana John

I love the fact that with firearms you can use a small amount of stored energy, use that to set off a lot of chemical energy, and in turn that is transformed into a large amount of kinetic energy. No batteries, no glass, no bulbs, no lasers, just the pure machine. A perfect illistration to Newton's 2nd law of thermodynamics.

I like that too.

-----------------------------------------

http://ussliberty.org
http://ssunitedstates.org

 

[Gewehr98]

It's called cleaning.

BC_Bush_Man says he is interested in a Marlin lever action in 44 mag or 357 mag. These are real sweeties to shoot, no doubt. But you can also shoot 44 special and 38 special in them. DON'T DO IT! It won't be long before the shorter cartridges have boogered up the chamber and your rifle won't eat the longer magnum cartridges any more. Either shoot nothing but magnums or nothing but specials.

Hogwash. It's no different than one shooting .38 Specials in .357 Magnum revolvers. People have been doing that for over 50 years, and they learned a long time ago that if you're going back to the magnum length rounds, clean out the carbon and lead ring in the chambers first or you'll get difficult feeding and extraction. They're not "boogered up", they're dirty. A little situational awareness goes a long ways.

 

[gila_dog]

Until you get it cleaned up, it can definitely be boogered up. I have seen people who normally keep 357 mags in their revolvers shoot a bunch of 38's for fun or practice. When they try to reload with their normal 357 mag business rounds, they don't go in all the way. And if you cram a 357 mag into the dirtied-up chamber of a lever action rifle like a Marlin, it may get stuck pretty bad. Sure, applying sufficient elbow grease and solvent will eventually get it clean enough again. But until you do that, your gun may (or may not) be boogered up. Go out for a day or weekend of plinking with .38's and hunting with .357's, interchanging ammo without having the time or equipment along to thoroughly clean your gun, and you could be disappointed. If I had one of those rifles I would feed it one kind of ammo or the other, and not mix it up. Reliable feeding and extracting is something to not be put at risk, especially if the rifle is for a serious purpose.

 

[NYHunter]

Learn the basics of shooting first...this will include a lot of missing...which is good for the learning experience. Try a good receiver / peep sight to start with. When you've mastered that then think about a scope.

Have fun...good luck.

NYHunter

 

[TimboKhan]

Reliable feeding and extracting is something to not be put at risk, especially if the rifle is for a serious purpose.

Honestly, your kind of making it sound like your potentially putting your life in grave danger if you shoot .38's in your .357, and the fact is, your not hurting a darn thing. All you have to do is a little extra cleaning. You need to clean the rifle after shooting it anyway, right? If your like me, and you don't want to clean anymore than you have to, don't shoot .38s (or, alternatively, .357's), but if you want to shoot both, just be prepared to clean a little more diligently.

 

[vmfrantz]

no scope

for what its worth, most rifles in the military are scopeless. And when I was in the Marines if I didnt go atleast 9 for 10 at the 500 yard line it was a bad day. rifle qual is 200 300 and 500 yards with the 5.56

 

[gila_dog]

I think BC_BUSH_MAN said he wanted to have the rifle along in case a momma bear wanted to feed him and his family to her cubs. Sounds like a potentially life-and-death situation to me. If all you are doing is going out for a day at the range, then coming home and cleaning your guns while you watch football on TV, then there's not much to worry about. If the rifle gets messed up a little, so what. Put back in the truck and shoot something else for a while. Clean it up when you get home. Of course you don't know that you've actually cleaned out all the crud so that your rifle will reliably (cold or hot) feed and extract 357's until you run some thru it (not a good idea while sitting in front of the TV). But if you are going out into the boondocks and staying out there for a while, especially if you are camping out and hunting, you may not have all the tools necessary to thoroughly clean your rifle or remove a stuck cartridge. And if you get a round stuck in the chamber your rifle may be disabled until you can get home. Another reason to not change ammo types is that with a rifle, shooting 50-150 yards, there may be a big difference in the point of impact between 38s and 357s. After 5 or 6 rounds you figure out that you have to hold 4" high an a little to the left to hit anything with those 38s. What's the point? It's not useful target practice anyway. I shoot a lot of 38s thru my 357 (S&W Model 19). It has loose chambers and never jams up. But I wouldn't do it with a lever action rifle whose chamber is probably tighter and and where I can get a 357 stuck after shooting 38s. I know it can happen because I saw it happen with a friend who was shooting a Marlin 44 mag and feeding it specials.