Double Negligent Discharges ... I'd rather have the hot brass please ...

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SharpDog

SharpDog

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Don’t Be That Guy: Double Negligent Discharges:

Pictured here is another apparent bonehead doing stupid things. It is vital to maintain composure and practice firearm responsibility regardless of outside forces affecting you. In this guy’s case, he does the ‘hot brass dance’ with a loaded weapon in his hand. Muzzle awareness and trigger discipline is crucial to avoid negligent discharges. Watch the cringe worthy video below: he performs double negligent discharges.
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http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/...ampaign=Carbines&utm_content=Popular+Trending
 
And this is true, even if say you are walking to your car with a hot coffee in your hand, or in your car, and drop it all over your leg or lap when action is required. Mind over matter.
 
RPZ said:
And this is true, even if say you are walking to your car with a hot coffee in your hand, or in your car, and drop it all over your leg or lap when action is required. Mind over matter.
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I hate to go there, but this is where your comment led me... You have to be a little like the devoted drunk who falls and never spills his beer.
 
Kind of like the fry cook who's running around the kitchen doing 5 different things, and just won't put down the prep knife.

I'd have put the gun down, in order to chase the hot brass with two hands.
 
At one of the military matches I took a hot .45 ACP down the back of my collar that left a scab. I kept my gun pointed down range. I was taught gun handling at the age of six by my Dad, a WWII vet, 6th Inf Div, Pacific Theatre, Bronze Star and Purple Heart. It would be desecrating his memory to let a minor distraction like hot brass make me wave my gun about. If I ever violate safety protocol I want my range mates to correct me.
 
That why I try not to go to un-monitored ranges. Even so, I guess it could happen even with attentive ROs present. Definitely a poorly trained shooter.
 
Sadly a lot of people never think this situation out ahead of time. They are not experienced shooters and react accordingly. One of the downsides of liberty is that anyone with a good record and enough money can own/shoot a firearm, training not required.:eek: Many of us at this site have the luxury of being taught safety by someone with prior experience. I imagine a lot of this stuff happens at local pits, informal ranges, etc and is never reported. FWIW I will insist that the female shooters I teach refrain from wearing loose T shirts and low neckline tops when I shoot with them.
 
I agree with you guys completely and even wrote about the same problem happening to myself in another thread. Not so bad, but an eye-opener just the same. The hot brass situation is a really tough one. Until it happens to you, you may not have even considered the possibility. I know I didn't. The safety rules keep us out of trouble when something surprising happens; the fewer the surprises, the better, IOW the rules work hand in hand with experience. I actually think this one is worth some drills. Maybe an assistant could be behind you with an ice cube and apply it to your neck right after a shot. Of course you would be prepared in advance not to do the stupid thing. But that practice could be very helpful in preventing something disastrous in a real situation.
 
You have to make that mental commitment to keep the gun down range or set it down regardless of what it going on. I've had hot brass down the shirt and even once behind the glasses and knew I had to keep the gun safe instead of risking the catastrophic injury from a round fired unsafely.

I make sure people I'm teaching to shoot understand that hot brass will find a way to bounce into their clothing at some point in their shooting experience and that they shouldn't make it easy for it to get in and they should always remember that shooting themselves is worse than the little burn from the brass.
 
Thanks for the video clip link, Sharp Dog. It looks like range staff went right behind the shooter when the hot brass incident occurred. I wonder if the shooter also let's go of control of his car if he spills something hot in his lap?

I've had hot brass in the shirt and behind the shooting glasses as well. Gotta keep focused on what's more dangerous. The brass burn will subside and you won't die from it.
 
Hell, I've had hot brass and links raining all over me, and didn't do something that unsafe. My friends and I deliberately rain .22's on each other; I consider it 'good training'.
 
You guys a very cocky about this whole thing. "Hot brass don't bother me none. I'm a real man." Well guys it is just not that simple. We are human and have human responses. Pain hurts. Raining brass on someone and putting a fresh one down someone's shirt are two very different things. We have no argument about how one has to train oneself to behave properly when surprised by something while shooting. Absolutely necessary. And no argument about criticizing those who screw up. Agreed. But don't say responding correctly isn't a hard thing to do. If it were not, we wouldn't be talking about it.
 
rpenmanparker said:
You guys a very cocky about this whole thing. "Hot brass don't bother me none. I'm a real man." Well guys it is just not that simple. We are human and have human responses. Pain hurts. Raining brass on someone and putting a fresh one down someone's shirt are two very different things. We have no argument about how one has to train oneself to behave properly when surprised by something while shooting. Absolutely necessary. And no argument about criticizing those who screw up. Agreed. But don't say responding correctly isn't a hard thing to do. If it were not, we wouldn't be talking about it.
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I don't think we are saying that at all. Hot brass, especially one piece at a time, is nothing like a broken nose, a baseball to the eye, or a dislocated joint. I'd liken hot brass in the shirt to a wasp sting while riding on a motorcycle. Yep it hurts, but don't take your hands off the handlebars in the middle of that turn you're riding through.
 
Did I really see that?! Mr. Hot Brass came within a whisker of shooting a passerby!


Others have said all I can say.

I've had brass get me. With a repro Winchester 1873 I ejected a .44-40 case which landed right on top of my head --- and my hair ain't THAT thick. Nevertheless I put the carbine down and calmly removed the brass from my nicely coiffed and now singed hair.
 
what ever happened to tunnel vision? Every inexperienced shooter I have seen get hit with brass ignored, or brushed it off, because they were focused on the shot. I don't normally judge people for spraying at the target doing mag dumps, but if your minds in it so little a case makes you jump and spray bullets maybe its not your sport. Theres always baseball.
 
chicharrones said:
I don't think we are saying that at all. Hot brass, especially one piece at a time, is nothing like a broken nose, a baseball to the eye, or a dislocated joint. I'd liken hot brass in the shirt to a wasp sting while riding on a motorcycle. Yep it hurts, but don't take your hands off the handlebars in the middle of that turn you're riding through.
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Exactly.

It's not that difficult to cope with the pain of small burns. I get them constantly, and believe me, the stainless steel chips coming off a piece of 1.625" bar stock turning 525 RPM with a heavy cut are a whole lot hotter than fired brass. I want them off of me, but take the time to stop the feed and back the cutter out first, lest I damage a part or the machine. The pain is lower and the stakes a whole lot higher with fired brass and a gun in your hand. Put the thing down pointing in a safe direction first. Mind over matter.
 
I have never understood the hot brass dance. I have had down the front, down the back, I have had stuck in ear pro and even between eye pro and my eye brow. Its just not that hot. Yeah it leaves a little red mark sometimes but come on. Put the gun and then take care of it.
 
chicharrones said:
I'd liken hot brass in the shirt to a wasp sting while riding on a motorcycle. Yep it hurts, but don't take your hands off the handlebars in the middle of that turn you're riding through.
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I like your analogy. I will add though that sometimes no matter how focused we are, we get startled and panic for a split second. It’s human instinct.

I once hit a yellow finch while on a gsxr1000 at a good rate of speed. It was hot and I had the visor cracked. When the bird was in the helmet clawing his way through my face I would like to say I stopped and gracefully corrected the situation. Instead I unclipped and tossed the helmet while still traveling at about the speed limit. The only thing on my mind was getting that freakin bird off of me. I curled back to get the helmet and The bird was still in it.

Watch the video, guy might be an experienced shooter but that wall deflecting brass back at him might have caught him by surprise, especially since it took so long to get to him. I’m not saying it’s ok, but sometimes we react out of instinct instead of out of conscious thought.
 
entropy said:
Training inures one to pain. You have it happen enough to you, you don't hardly notice it. M60 brass and links in the hundreds will make the odd piece of pistol brass seem very uneventful.
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You have to train yourself to put down the gun, when you are dealing with a problem at the range.

"Hot brass don't bother me, I'm a real man." No, proper training prepares you for hot brass, and other
revolting situations.
 
WestKentucky said:
I like your analogy. I will add though that sometimes no matter how focused we are, we get startled and panic for a split second. It’s human instinct.

I once hit a yellow finch while on a gsxr1000 at a good rate of speed. It was hot and I had the visor cracked. When the bird was in the helmet clawing his way through my face I would like to say I stopped and gracefully corrected the situation. Instead I unclipped and tossed the helmet while still traveling at about the speed limit. The only thing on my mind was getting that freakin bird off of me. I curled back to get the helmet and The bird was still in it.

Watch the video, guy might be an experienced shooter but that wall deflecting brass back at him might have caught him by surprise, especially since it took so long to get to him. I’m not saying it’s ok, but sometimes we react out of instinct instead of out of conscious thought.
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Ya think?
 
WestKentucky said:
I once hit a yellow finch while on a gsxr1000 at a good rate of speed. It was hot and I had the visor cracked. When the bird was in the helmet clawing his way through my face I would like to say I stopped and gracefully corrected the situation. Instead I unclipped and tossed the helmet while still traveling at about the speed limit. The only thing on my mind was getting that freakin bird off of me. I curled back to get the helmet and The bird was still in it.
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Glad you didn't go down. Anyone that rides long enough gets hit with all sorts of things. :D

Same goes for shooters and hot brass. :)
 
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