Elected representative calls for ban on 3D printed guns.

[Justin]

Via a story at Boing Boing

Well, that was predictable: days after a 3D printed gun fired a few rounds, Rep Steve Israel has called for a ban on of Wiki Weapons. The congressman points out (correctly) that all-plastic 3D printed weapons would not be easy to spot using traditional methods, such as metal detectors.

It turns out that Steve Israel (D, Huntington) is just calling for a renewal of the "Undetectable Weapons Act."

http://www.meetthe112th.com/latest-news/rep-steve-israel-urges-congress-to-renew-wiki-weapon-ban/

 

[smalls]

The congressman points out (correctly) that all-plastic 3D printed weapons would not be easy to spot using traditional methods, such as metal detectors.

I wonder how accurate that plastic barrel is?

Our education system has failed tremendously. Well, I guess you can't teach sense.

 

[hq]

Has anyone even tried to inform Mr. Israel that weapons like this don't exist and most likely won't in the foreseeable future? He might as well campaign for banning Star Wars handheld blasters.

 

[smalls]

Has anyone even tried to inform Mr. Israel that weapons like this don't exist and most likely won't in the foreseeable future?

They do. Sorta. A few people have made lowers from 3D printers. I think I saw that someone on another forum had a few hundred or a thousand rounds of .22 through one. Then there's the one in 5.56 (?) that only lasted 6 rounds.

Obviously there is some advancement needed to make useable firearms out of them, though. And obviously they aren't completely constructed of plastics. There are barrels, bolts, pins, springs, etc.

 

[hq]

They do. Sorta. A few people have made lowers from 3D printers.

Yes, lowers, but as far as I've understood, we're talking about a complete firearm. The distinct lack of non-metallic barrels, bolts and slides regardless of price range is an indicator that Mr. Israel is addressing a problem that doesn't exist.

Even the most modern carbon fiber barrels have a fairly thick steel lining. All it takes, of course, is one invention that'll replace steel, but considering how much effort and money has been put to developing one during several decades, the likelihood of it happening anytime soon is slim. And when that happens, it still has a long way to trickle down to 3D home printing reality.

Mr. Israel might as well be concerned about the legality of light sabers and Star Trek replicators, without sounding the slightest bit more ridiculous than he does now.

 

[MachIVshooter]

All it takes, of course, is one invention that'll replace steel, but considering how much effort and money has been put to developing one during several decades,

Oh, there are several other materials that can work for barrels. But they're still metals, and will still set off any detector.

It is theoretically possible to make a firearm that is completely polymer, but we're talking about a one or two shot liberator-type gun using a very low pressure cartridge and having pretty much zero accuracy. There are high impact resins that could take the abuse a time or three. However, these are high tech thermoplastics that require very expensive and precise manufacturing processes, not something that you can squirt out on a rep rap. Build a barrel out of the ABS or nylon coming out of a 3D printer, expect to dig it out of your body in small pieces.

Of course, all the speculating about how it could or couldn't be done kind of ignores the fact that it's still unlawful to possess any firearm that can pass through a metal detector anyway. Furthermore, continued renewal of the UWA won't affect 3D printed firearms in the least, since they'll still need many metal parts. It's clear that this Steve Israel knows nothing of firearms or the state of polymers and ceramics technology.

 

[smalls]

Yes, lowers, but as far as I've understood, we're talking about a complete firearm. The distinct lack of non-metallic barrels, bolts and slides regardless of price range is an indicator that Mr. Israel is addressing a problem that doesn't exist.

You're absolutely right, he is.

Why is he doing this?

It's clear that this Steve Israel knows nothing of firearms.

Pretty much sums it up.

What really infuriates me is that he is trying to pass legislation on a (non)issue that he hasn't even researched, or even has a basic understanding of.

 

[mg.mikael]

What's the point of a law banning 3d printed guns, when there's no possible way to enforce such a law in the first place? At most I see it being symbolic, because in the real world it would be a logistical and technical nigthmare to actually have control over every single item being 3d printed. That's something the lame-brain politican should have thought of first.

 

[Cosmoline]

You can make a lower out of newspaper and glue. And it might last longer than the one they printed did.

 

[Carne Frio]

So, are we next to register all 3D printers ? Or only
automatic and semi-automatic printers ? How about
black powder printers ? (Or is that racist ?)

 

[Skribs]

I know this guy isn't media, but to any media sources who agree with him: If you want to regulate 3D printers, don't be upset when someone else says they should regulate your 2D printers.

 

[hq]

My first color copier was "regulated" back in early 90's. A set of keys, a multi-page agreement of terms and conditions and an interview at Canon headquarters, them asking me to explain what I'm going to use the copier for.

Back in those days some people were horrified that this new, dangerous technology enables people to copy money in COLOR, and overreacted accordingly.

 

[M-Cameron]

ah yes, i can see it now....an unprecedented storm of nerds with crappy and expensive plastic weapons committing atrocities with 'undetectable' weapons that arent really undetectable......

....man, im glad our elected leaders are utilizing their time and tax payers money to battle this menace.

i mean, after the last crime committed with a 3d printed gun, we really aught to crack down on this epidemic!.........oh wait!

 

[ATBackPackin]

Sounds like maybe would should ban our elected officials from watching movies because obviously they cannot determine fact from fiction. The fact that this person would react this way without knowing that there will actually still be metal parts to the gun is pathetic. Not to mention a very good reason why our country is going in the direction it is. However, for arguments sake, lets just say you could be a reliable firearm without any metal or high density materials.......................wouldn't the rounds still be made of metal?

 

[M-Cameron]

Sounds like maybe would should ban our elected officials from watching movies because obviously they cannot determine fact from fiction. The fact that this person would react this way without knowing that there will actually still be metal parts to the gun is pathetic. Not to mention a very good reason why our country is going in the direction it is. However, for arguments sake, lets just say you could be a reliable firearm without any metal or high density materials.......................wouldn't the rounds still be made of metal?

they have made polymer cased bullets (most notably the tround).....however that still leaves the projectile and the primer.

i dont see any reason you couldnt have a plastic bullet....now would a plastic bullet be as effective as a lead bullet.......well no, not even close....but it could still be potentially fatal.

that leaves the primer....now i havent researched materials too deeply.....but i dont know of any material off hand that you could make a primer out of that is non metalic.

 

[EOD Guy]

It has been illegal for years to make a firearm that won't set off a standard metal detector. Why does the wheel have to be reinvented?

 

[M-Cameron]

It has been illegal for years to make a firearm that won't set off a standard metal detector. Why does the wheel have to be reinvented?

because some two-bit politician wants to make a name for himself and get his face all over the news.

nothing new, as stated before with the color copiers......they just take new technology and make it to be "the new evil technology wich has no legitimate use other than crime"......

 

[WardenWolf]

Not all metals will set off a common metal detector, at least in small quantities. It would be theoretically possible to make or reinforce critical components with low-detectable metals. However, these metals can be prohibitively expensive, like gold. It's just not a viable option.

 

[gym]

The problem lies in the fact that all of these politicians are more concerned about making headlines rather than actually reading past laws and restrictions already placed on weapons and weapon reproductions. It's like when xerox came out with laser printers, and everyone was in an uproar about counterfitting our currency. it was so bad that they actually had to modify the printer. Meanwhile no one had the paper or the safety strips then anayway.
It's just a headline grabbing politician, who knows so little about how things are made that he should work at Hasbro.
someone should do utube video with AR's stacking up on the floor as the printer banged them out in different colors.

 

[Prince Yamato]

He might as well campaign for banning Star Wars handheld blasters.

Phaser guns are already illegal in New Jersey. I kid you not.

 

[Tommygunn]

Phaser guns are already illegal in New Jersey. I kid you not.

What the--- !?

No one even knows WHAT A PHASER IS!!!!!
By which I mean "how it works."

 

[Ragnar Danneskjold]

Just because the tech to "print" a fully functional firearm from synthetic materials doesn't exist now, doesn't mean it never will. This law would get the jump on us all and ban the future tech before it's been developed.

 

[MachIVshooter]

If you want to regulate 3D printers, don't be upset when someone else says they should regulate your 2D printers.

A lot more harm has been caused with the 2D variety, that's for sure.

but i dont know of any material off hand that you could make a primer out of that is non metalic.

My dad died when I was 11, and my mom hated guns. When I was 13, I secretly made a muzzle loading pistol from a heavy pellet gun barrel by brazing a nipple on one end. The action was modeled after a cap gun I took apart, and the whole thing was assembled on aluminum bar stock with clamps and other fasteners. For ammo, I would pull the bullet from a .22 LR round and swage it to .177" in a steel block I drilled. I'd use the powder charge from that shell, and I crushed the case rims to get the priming compound out. I tamped that compound into a plastic cap gun cap, and this was my percussion cap. It worked, except that I'd sometimes have to dig little pieces of red plastic out of my fingers. So I shrouded the hammer. Of course, being a stupid kid, I decided that being able to punch through a 6" chunk of pine with my swaged bullets wasn't enough, and started upping the charge. Luckily, the hammer deflected the nipple away from me when the brazing let go! This didn't stop me, of course. I just tapped the back of that barrel and was back in business with a drilled-through piece of grade 8 bolt.

I must've played with that thing for a year until a friend and neighbor bought me a Remington Viper in exchange for some work I did, which stayed at his house until I was 18.

Not all metals will set off a common metal detector, at least in small quantities. It would be theoretically possible to make or reinforce critical components with low-detectable metals. However, these metals can be prohibitively expensive, like gold.

Actually, gold picks up very easily. Metal detectors work on conductivity; The better a conductor the metal is, the easier a detector will pick it up.

 

[barnbwt]

Phaser guns are already illegal in New Jersey. I kid you not.

Sheesh, why don't they ban the T-virus and flux capacitors, while they're at it . Or just "Bad Things"; I'll bet that would be popular with the folks back home.

No one even knows WHAT A PHASER IS!!!!!
By which I mean "how it works."

Soooo, they could basically ban anything they feel "constitutes a phaser"--which is an undefined entity. Sounds like a law out of The Trial by Franz Kafka (or a Catch-22, for the more modern set). Isn't law fun?

TCB

 

[k_dawg]

Don't let him know about the 'duck tape cannon' made by Mythbusters!!!