Fast Pistol Powder Options

[JimKirk]

Ramshot ZIP .... Pretty close to AA#2 in speed also .... Meters great too...

 

[ArchAngelCD]

Many good choices already mentioned.

My choices for fast-paced to substitute for Bullseye would be AA#2, WST or the newer IMR Target. Target is very clean according to my shooting buddy, I have not shot it yet.

 

[CoalTrain49]

Titegroup or American Select. I've quit using Bullseye because of the soot.

Just about any of these fast powders will work.

 

[Lennyjoe]

https://www.hodgdon.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/09/burn-rate-color.pdf

 

[Elkins45]

AA#2 is the one that comes to mind first.

 

[ulflyer]

Galil5.56: Pardon my ignorance but can you tell me what "peaky and unforgiving" means in relation to Clays? Have just begun to use Clays for light loads in 45acp and don't want any surprises. It does seem to meter well in my 550, but is much coarser than Bullseye and 231 that I've used in the past.

 

[Walkalong]

Galil5.56: Pardon my ignorance but can you tell me what "peaky and unforgiving" means in relation to Clays?

When you get near the top it goes from OK to very hot real quick, as in another .1 Gr sometimes. Work it up in .1 increments.

That said, one more .1 can also mean so so to very good, but if you get that, be real careful about the next .1.

N-310 tends to be that way as well, very quick powders.

 

[ulflyer]

Thanks Walkalong. I started yesterday very low.....3.5gr with 200gr lead swc and my PPQ and Kahr functioned well them. I only load for plinking but with only one mag thru the PPQ, they seemed to print well. WX not turned cold so won't be shooting again for awhile.

 

[Jim Watson]

AA Plus was pretty good but did not last long in the lineup. Current production WST would be close.

 

[thomas15]

Titegroup or American Select. I've quit using Bullseye because of the soot.

I was going to mention American Select but need to point out that you need to tinker with it a little and it's a little bit of a pain to meter. But I personally use quite a bit of it for plinking ammo in 9mm, it's the only Alliant powder I use. Not that I'm the measure of all things.

 

[Galil5.56]

Galil5.56: Have just begun to use Clays for light loads in 45acp and don't want any surprises. It does seem to meter well in my 550, but is much coarser than Bullseye and 231 that I've used in the past.

I like Clays it in .38 Special and .45 ACP that you mention, and Walkalong explained the phenomenon well. Despite less than stellar extreme spreads (poor metering perhaps?), it shoots accurately and very clean.

You will see marked differences, esp in .38 Special even at a .1 grain variation, and things get very exponential quickly as charge weights increase. Mess up with Clays, and it will bite back very hard - But no reason to not want to use it; just be very mindful of its nature. Here is a bit of data I worked up, if interested:

3" Mod 60, 3.5 Clays Lee 125 RN sized .358" WW SPP
749, 656, 680, 725, 722, av 706 es 93 sd 37

3" Mod 60, 2.8 gr Clays 148 Horn BBWC WW SPP
747, 768, 732, 729, 738, av 742 es 39 sd 15

W. German Sig P220 4.4" barrel 4.2 gr Clays CCI 300 MC .452" 200 SWC
768, 795, 805, 767, 777, 811, 779, 778, 754, 791, Avg 782 ES 57 SD17

 

[ArchAngelCD]

I stopped using Clays in less than 2lbs. It just wasn't worth the erratic behavior even though it was clean and accurate.

I'm using mostly W231 but you are looking for a faster powder so like I nen!tioned, try the new IMR Target. It was designed to rival Bullseye only new tech and cleaner.

 

[gunlaw]

I’ve heard good things about Accurate #2. Does it perform well in 38 special where the case volume to powder volume ratio is high and operating pressure is low?

I have used a lot of #2 in 38 spl and 45 acp. Great substitute for bullseye. Seems to work well at lower pressures and less volume. 3.8g of #2 works like 4.0g of bullseye.

 

[kmw1954]

I have recently started using AA#2 in 380, 9mm and 45acp and am quite impressed with it in all three.

 

[k4swb]

I've been playing with Winclean244 lately. Haven't chronographed any but As for being forgiving and clean burning it looks very promising. Not done enough testing to actually say it is as clean as WST but it is darned close and shoots cooler.
Usage in both 9mm and .45ACP.
I can't find it on a burn rate chart. Anyone see it on one?

 

[Jim Watson]

Hodgdon shows
#29 = W231
#30 = Alliant 20/28
#31 = W244
#32 = Unique

That is a very wide spread and does not mean much data wise. W244 data is a lot closer to W231 than to Unique.

 

[Walkalong]

I picked up some W244 at the last gun show, but have not tried it yet.

 

[k4swb]

Hodgdon shows
#29 = W231
#30 = Alliant 20/28
#31 = W244
#32 = Unique

That is a very wide spread and does not mean much data wise. W244 data is a lot closer to W231 than to Unique.

Yeah, I would love to see it amongst all the different powders/brands in the area around it. It's really not that new now and there should be more info.

Looks like if one of you guys don't do some chronograph work, I'll be forced to see if my old PACT that is about 25+ years old still works but I really don't want to.

 

[k4swb]

I picked up some W244 at the last gun show, but have not tried it yet.

Well sir, time's awasting!

 

[CoalTrain49]

I was going to mention American Select but need to point out that you need to tinker with it a little and it's a little bit of a pain to meter. But I personally use quite a bit of it for plinking ammo in 9mm, it's the only Alliant powder I use. Not that I'm the measure of all things.

Yep, it's a flake shotgun powder but it works.

 

[Walkalong]

Well sir, time's awasting!

So what should I try first?

 

[ArchAngelCD]

So what should I try first?

The 45 ACP at least that's what I'm going to do when I get off my butt.
I'm going to try that first then the 45 Colt.

I was thinking of the 9mm after that but I think W572 will be better in the 9mm.

 

[ulflyer]

Clays: having said above that it meters well in my 550, decided to check it more thoroughly. Ran 20 loads thru, weighed on a digital, and got a lot of variance: majority loads were 3.32 to 3.38, several 3.42-3.46, several 3.56-3.58. Going from low of 3.32 to high 3.58 seems way to much to me. Dang, I have nearly 3 cans of Clays, and one of Bullseye which I haven't used in long time. Looks like its time for BE again.

 

[Jim Watson]

Going from low of 3.32 to high 3.58 seems way to much to me.

Those of us with one decimal place scales would see 3.3 to 3.6, a total spread of .3 grain. This is not unusual.
I am loading 3.5 gr Bullseye and even on random checks am seeing a fair number of 3.6 and the occasional 3.4; a spread of .2 grain.
I don't get dead nuts powder charges even with HP38 Spherical.

I got a can of W572 in a match goodie bag. My standard 9mm load is a 147 at 880-900 fps. W572 at that level was erratic with high variation and SD.
I had to go to the MAXIMUM load of 4.1 gr to get it to even out and that got me 929 fps which is more than I needed.
I did not try any other bullet weight, it might do well at factory equivalent of a 115 or 124.

 

[k4swb]

So what should I try first?

Well, some midrange 9mm loads would be nice. and I did find a burn rate chart that had all the powders around it.
Let's see: