Trad Archer
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What do guys think is the best self defense 380 ammo?
Favorite 380 ammo
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IMO there's not a lot of difference in any of the SD ammo sold by the major manufacturers, they're all as good as you can get. Right now I'm favoring Winchester PDX1 but have some Hornady XTP's and FTX on hand as well as some Fed Hydra Shoks and Remington GS. I'd be happy with Speer Gold Dots or Corbon Power Ball too just haven't caught a good enough price to buy them yet.
R.W.Dale
Member
A good fmj flat point with a reputation for reluablity.
IMO sub 9mm calibers are FMJ only propositions. They fundamentally lack the energy to gain any benefits from expanding bullets at the expense of already marginal penatration.
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IMO sub 9mm calibers are FMJ only propositions. They fundamentally lack the energy to gain any benefits from expanding bullets at the expense of already marginal penatration.
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sgtstryker
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The Aquila 90 gr HP is a good price here. It feeds, shoots good in my TCP. Don't carry the pistol much, usually when I ride my bicycle. Not sure on the velocity concerning expansion, so as long it functions good, I'll stick with it.
mgmorden
Member
In my .380's I carry Hornady Critical Defense, but I'd have to agree with Steve C that there's not going to be a whole lot of real world difference between any of them. They all go bang, and I don't see a hit from one in the same location resulting in any different outcome as a hit from another brand. The only reason I'd avoid one is if the particular bullet type didn't feed well in the gun I was using.
Robbins290
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speer gold dot from a colt mustang plus II
I agree, with a few exceptions. I feel the .380 when loaded properly really tip-toes on that line of what I consider "FMJ only" calibers.
An XTP is the only hollow point I will use in .380, preferably one moving over 1000fps
"controlled expansion" for the win!
I would consider Buffalo Bore's .380+P Tac-XP round, or some form of soft point if I couldn't get ahold of XTP's.
Now, anything below a full power .380?
FMJ or Hardcast only!
NinjaFeint
Member
I have been using Buffalo Bore's .380+P Tac-XP 80 gr
bannockburn
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In SD ammo, I like Hornady XTP and Speer Gold Dots. I have some of the Winchester PDX1 but haven't had a chance to try them out yet.
R.W.Dale
Member
That's fine if its what you like. But there's no reason to pay that much and beat your wrists and gun. Any fmj will shoot through the human torso or arm from the side just fine.
That extra energy and velocity is just going to go out the back of your intended target
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tomwalshco
Member
Agree with this point and Dale's other comments, but my little guys don't like flat-nose stuff worth a damn, especially the Kahr. KT handles them best. Agree on Aquila. Always feeds and fires in my 380s. Cheap, too. Fiocchi has always done fine with me. A factory in my home state, so I try to support them. They put an XTP bullet in their 380s.
Not such good luck with S&B and Blazer Alum. Too many no go's, but deep strikes, mostly .
Probably so, but it feeds reliably and it is not and everyday shooing round ($$). Does give an extra kick in the pants.
I have raked this issue over time and again.
My nifty little LCP so far consumes everything it's fed.
What a wonderful little reliable pistol!!
But so many times I have read or watched tests on hollow points in small defensive sized carry 380's with on and off results that I have finally said well what the Hell Mary with the first round chambered which is a 102 grain Remington Golden Saber hollow point backed up by reasonably penetrating flat nose Winchester 95 grain White Box ammo x six more rounds.
Hopefully in the shtf moment it will see me through.
My nifty little LCP so far consumes everything it's fed.
What a wonderful little reliable pistol!!
But so many times I have read or watched tests on hollow points in small defensive sized carry 380's with on and off results that I have finally said well what the Hell Mary with the first round chambered which is a 102 grain Remington Golden Saber hollow point backed up by reasonably penetrating flat nose Winchester 95 grain White Box ammo x six more rounds.
Hopefully in the shtf moment it will see me through.
Certaindeaf
member
I like a hard cast LEE 105gr SWC driven as hard as safe.
Speer Gold Dot for my LCP. All the tests I have seen get 10-12" penetration, full expansion even through clothing, full weight retention, and it feeds well in the LCP.
For the penetration/expansion, you really have to think about the practical usage. IIRC a lot of the FBI penetration requirements were based on shooting through barriers, or through a guy's arm from the side and still hitting vital organs. They also have to use the same service pistol cartridge all year usually, whereas a carry permit holder can change it up summer/winter.
IMO a .380 that expands to a 0.50" or more and penetrates 10-12" is plenty for summer carry. I don't plan on shooting anyone through cover or through an arm, because if I am using my weapon they are probably coming at me and I am aiming COM. And 9 months out of the year a t-shirt or hoodie is the most clothing people wear. If the bullet gets clogged and doesn't expand it becomes an FMJ anyway, but I like the idea of possibly having over twice as much area of a hole with an expanding bullet, just making a bigger cavity. Remember area is proportional to the diameter square. Not only that but how often do we hear about someone who survived because the bullet missed their heart or their spine by 1/8" or something? That's just my thoughts but lots of other good and valid arguments both ways.
For the penetration/expansion, you really have to think about the practical usage. IIRC a lot of the FBI penetration requirements were based on shooting through barriers, or through a guy's arm from the side and still hitting vital organs. They also have to use the same service pistol cartridge all year usually, whereas a carry permit holder can change it up summer/winter.
IMO a .380 that expands to a 0.50" or more and penetrates 10-12" is plenty for summer carry. I don't plan on shooting anyone through cover or through an arm, because if I am using my weapon they are probably coming at me and I am aiming COM. And 9 months out of the year a t-shirt or hoodie is the most clothing people wear. If the bullet gets clogged and doesn't expand it becomes an FMJ anyway, but I like the idea of possibly having over twice as much area of a hole with an expanding bullet, just making a bigger cavity. Remember area is proportional to the diameter square. Not only that but how often do we hear about someone who survived because the bullet missed their heart or their spine by 1/8" or something? That's just my thoughts but lots of other good and valid arguments both ways.
The Bushmaster
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90 grain Hornady XTP/HP over 3.1 grains of W-231...
481
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Do you really think that "anyone that you have to shoot" is gonna avoid employing cover or keep their arms lower (assuming that they are upraised for the purpose of shooting at you) in order to assure you a clean shot or that "anyone that you have to shoot" is gonna commit to an unarmed charge against you as you fire on them?
Oh, I can just see it now.......
"Umm, excuse me, Mr Bad Guy? Uh, look, I hate to bug you, sir, I really do, but could you bring your arms down just a smidge? I know you're trying to shoot too, but your arms are kinda blocking my shot at your center of mass and I promised myself that I wouldn't be shooting through anyone's arms in order to defend myself. Oh, and while I have your attention could I also ask you to step out from behind that wall and stand real still?"
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...and hilarity ensued!
but in all seriousness, snark aside, I don't really envision a scenario where the BG is seeking cover and I am still shooting. Seems like it would be hard to prove self defense if they are cowering behind a wall. Heck, even a .45 won't do any good through substantial "cover" (concealment is a different matter, but again, if they are hiding, why am I shooting?) I don't think it's like in Hollywood where you put 3 rounds through the bare sheetrock wall and then the bad guy slumps over dead.As far as shooting through upraised arms, I tried "aiming" at myself in the mirror, and with a typical stance, the hands of an uplifted gun don't really cover too much of my CoM. Of course it depends on your height relative to the BG's height, and your respective shooting stances as far as what is still exposed. But my thought is if you hit his arm longitudinally (when it is up to point a gun at you) the bullet is not going to penetrate through and into the chest because the angle is too shallow, and if it hits the BG's gun then it isn't going to penetrate anyway (although hopefully it disables it or causes the BG to drop it!) I guess that is just how I envision it, and how I arrived at my choice of SD ammo, full weight retention, expansion to over 0.5" diameter, and 10-11" of penetration, but if you have some case studies or statistics that show bullet penetration through upraised arms is a common circumstance to put down a BG I may reconsider. Regardless, 12" is still just an arbitrary guideline. 12" doesn't mean dead where 11" means alive and totally okay. It isn't black and white, it's shades of gray.
I don't want to derail the thread which is supposed to be about ammo but if these hypothetical scenarios help someone make a decision then I guess it could be a tolerated distraction.
481
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You know, an assailant can also fire upon you from cover.
And both of these reasons (the need to possibly engage an active threat that is firing from behind cover and hitting an arm longitudinally meaning that your bullet must pass through that much more tissue to reach his CoM) are why I am perplexed at your preference for a JHP that gives you 10-12" of penetration.
Are you assuming that you're going to be able to direct your fire accurately enough to "shoot around" such obstacles even under the stress of such an engagement?
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