WestKentucky
Member
I'm confused. 5 in a revolver or pocket auto is not enough...but 5 in a Remington 870 is good enough?
Forget the 5 shot self defense!
- Thread starter Old Guy
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You are confused about the difference in terminal effectiveness between a round of handgun ammo out of a short handgun barrel, and a round of 12 gauge buckshot?
Have you ever fired a 12 gauge shotgun?
Ironicaintit
Member
Nope! I want 8, with another 5 in the butt cuff, and a pocket full, too.
I like to carry as much "extra" ammo as I reasonably can....just because. I do not have that crystal ball that'll tell me how many I will need. It may be 5, or 1, or 20+!
If all goes as I hope, it'll be zero. I hope for that, but it wouldn't be wise to plan for it panning out that way. I also wear my seatbelt, and make sure my spare tire is full of air.
The difference in perception, my Son and I have Shot Gun waivers "For high risk Patrol"
Only time I carried a Mossberg 12 gage, a late in the day job at a Jewelry store, reason I was called in, all other armed (G licensed Security Officers had long term locations) other uniformed Staff was not available.
This big store, on East West running Road, in Orlando, had a group of Hood dwellers, take up positions, in the parking lot, sitting on hoods of their older model cars, prior to closing, waiting to make foul taunts at the attractive female staff exiting, to go home. The reason for rush contract, Female staff said no armed Security, they would quit.
Me in uniform with Glock 19, and carrying this older ex Police 18" 12 gage, SECURITY in 1" white letters on each side of the plastic buttstock.
Cost $87.00 from B&H on Merritt Island. Taking up position in the parking lot, me first one out, then the Lady's, then the Manager, who set the alarm.
The visitors left! And never came back. This was 6+1 slug loaded, reduced velocity (No, not known by the waiting group) and not in a holster, but in my hands.
That is the only time we carried a Shotgun. But it was really effective. There is something about a 1" pipe, that a holstered 9mm does not convey.
Does that answer the capacity question, re Shotgun?
Only time I carried a Mossberg 12 gage, a late in the day job at a Jewelry store, reason I was called in, all other armed (G licensed Security Officers had long term locations) other uniformed Staff was not available.
This big store, on East West running Road, in Orlando, had a group of Hood dwellers, take up positions, in the parking lot, sitting on hoods of their older model cars, prior to closing, waiting to make foul taunts at the attractive female staff exiting, to go home. The reason for rush contract, Female staff said no armed Security, they would quit.
Me in uniform with Glock 19, and carrying this older ex Police 18" 12 gage, SECURITY in 1" white letters on each side of the plastic buttstock.
Cost $87.00 from B&H on Merritt Island. Taking up position in the parking lot, me first one out, then the Lady's, then the Manager, who set the alarm.
The visitors left! And never came back. This was 6+1 slug loaded, reduced velocity (No, not known by the waiting group) and not in a holster, but in my hands.
That is the only time we carried a Shotgun. But it was really effective. There is something about a 1" pipe, that a holstered 9mm does not convey.
Does that answer the capacity question, re Shotgun?
I did find it kind of priceless myself.
Just a good reference to none action people, compared to actual doing it individual's.
My Wife's Sister, thought it would be a good idea, to have her Husband take up a space when we were Staff down (Bouncers) at the Cavern (Of Beatles fame, on Matthew Street, Liverpool.) Tony was big chap, 6"4" and a total wuss!
When I would take a turn downstairs, just a walk about, show the flag, so to speak, he was so close behind me? almost on my back. He was petrified!
Everybody is not a scrapper. That was his one night there.
The kids (Girls) inside, were young teens, dressed up, made up, to look 19/20, when they were actually 15/16! So as no alcohol was sold, age was not a problem. Friday/Saturday nights were packed! Friday night was fight night!
Our job was to stop potential problems at the door! The little groups of guys, 4 or 5, had a few pints, not drunk, but the heat inside could soon change that! We stopped them at the door. Mostly just talk, sometimes not.
You had to be there, early 60s, black suit, white shirt, clip on bow tie, and polished safety shoes, fiber toe caps (steel toe caps? to heavy) three of us were out and out fighters, the rest, just looked the part.
And has been said by others before, many Men, have not been in a fist fight, as adults. And remember this was before licensing, training, radios.
Just young married men, needing the extra few Bob to help out the full time job. My Wife did not work, two young kids, stay at home Lady.
Three nights under the counter wages, about half the take home pay from the full time, 5 and a half day job. That's why it was worth it. Thur/Fri/Sat.
Thursday night Jazz night? never any trouble.
45_auto
Member
old guy said:
No. It seems that you are implying that since you didn't need any in your one particular situation, then you'll never actually need any rounds with a shotgun. The intimidation factor is sufficient for your defense. Just think, if in addition you had made the "slide racking" sound, your bad guys would have probably been in such terror that they would have all headed down to the local police station to turn themselves in.
Are you unaware of the difference in effectiveness on target between a properly loaded 12 gauge shotgun, and a service pistol?
Most people are well aware of this difference.
Vern Humphrey
Member
And while I'm well aware that statistics don't apply in individual cases, most armed confrontations end without a shot being fired. Some estimates run as high as 90%+.
So I would say intimidation is an important factor in NOT having a gun fight. And I think everyone will agree, a shotgun IS intimidating.
So I would say intimidation is an important factor in NOT having a gun fight. And I think everyone will agree, a shotgun IS intimidating.
fallingbird
Member
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- 54
Just ask our famously favorite VP 'Uncle Joe'!
Five is plenty. Remember your goal is personal survival. The only way to engage shooter with assault weapon is at very, very close range surprising them from cover. The best way is Ole' Wild West gun fight style you know from behind.
ColoradoMinuteMan
Member
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- May 8, 2015
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- 702
If I ever end up at a night club I'll only need one round to put myself out of the misery of listening to that godawful house music.
Don't assume every other person's goal is the same as your own.
And it is a lie to straight up claim that 5 is enough, that is impossible to know until after the fact.
Redlg155
Member
The good ol "Texas heart shot". The should make a training silhouette for that. Double tap to the center point of contact.
The argument for a 5 shot revolver as being good enough, sufficient is based on the average? Armed confrontation being 5 yards 5 shots?
The pistol carried for self defense, needs enough rounds for peace of mind, mine 15+1. A pistol you have shot a lot, and be accurate past the 5 yards some subscribe too.
And it has to be a comfortable carry, concealable, and work every time you press the trigger. Mine, Glock 19 4th Gen.
To argue on this matter is childish, "More is better, always" I coined that expression in the mid 80s, and have not changed my mind.
The pistol carried for self defense, needs enough rounds for peace of mind, mine 15+1. A pistol you have shot a lot, and be accurate past the 5 yards some subscribe too.
And it has to be a comfortable carry, concealable, and work every time you press the trigger. Mine, Glock 19 4th Gen.
To argue on this matter is childish, "More is better, always" I coined that expression in the mid 80s, and have not changed my mind.
GBExpat
Member
You're right about that.
45_auto
Member
old guy said:
Sgt Maynard "Snuffy" Smith was awarded the Medal of Honor for disagreeing with you.
Vern Humphrey
Member
Banana Joe
He don't know
His a**
From a hole in the snow.
5 pages of, you need as many as possible, no 5 is fine, seems like enough to me.
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