Fun Discussion: Outfit the Continental Army

[UKShooter]

Good point Cajun.

If I could go back, I would equip them with cushions and make them all wear roller skates

 

[Apple a Day]

M-79 grenade launchers.
Simple and quick to train in basic use. Let the Brits line up in formation then let 'em have a volley. Done and done.

Then again, we could just gift the British with a handfull of battery powered television/DVD players and a collection of Benny Hill and Monty Python episodes. They'd be too busy watching to bother the colonials.

 

[Justin]

What? No Dodge Challengers?

 

[pockets]

Outfit them?
Bright blue spandex unitards, with gold piping, and a perky white beret.

 

[youngda9]

Pistol, M&P Full Size .45.

Rifle...FN FAL.
Trench gun...Tommy gun, lightened with aluminum and composite parts. (same caliber as pistol as well)
SAWs for the squad as well.

Sniper rifle to Carlos Hathcock...probably a remington 700 or whatever the heck he wants.

 

[22-rimfire]

Since the "government" had no authority to tax the people at the time, the responsibility fell to the colonies. Funding the war then was no different than now. No success and no funds to buy clothing, food or supplies for the continental army. The politics have not changed.

Hence, I would provide sufficient supplies that would have allowed the continental army to be suitably clothed, fed, and with sufficient powder and lead for balls to fight the war. I would also have hired some good advisors to assist Washington in strategy and the application of force.

I like Cosmo's idea that civil war cap and ball rifles be provided as well. It would be an explainable boost in technology without alarming the world. The British army would not have lasted long under the hail of fire from the continental army. But they would have acquired the technology very quickly and the bloodshed would have been huge. But even as the war was fought, still it was estimated that 1% of the total population lost their lives during the war. That would be the equivalent of 3 million people loosing their lives today in this fight. I don't think Americans have the stomach for a war like this now. Revolutions cost a lot of lives.

 

[UKShooter]

Knowing very little about this war I decided to do some reading. We were never taught about it in school in any depth.

I found this article very interesting: http://www.bbc.co.uk/history/british/empire_seapower/rebels_redcoats_01.shtml

It is written from a very British point of view. I am guessing that this is quite different to what is taught in American schools. If anyone has time to read it, it would be interesting to hear your oppinion.

 

[Cosmoline]

It's odd that so little about the Revolutionary War itself is ever taught in US schools. The political and legal outcome are well known, of course. But the war itself remains far less known than the Civil War. Perhaps because so much of it involved tactical withdrawals by Washington in his rope-a-dope strategy with the superior British forces.

Too strong a victory in battle, with too many of the enemy dead, was not the goal. In fact when the Brits managed to really wipe out Continental or militia units, they ended up paying a heavy price in what we would call PR.

 

[amprecon]

Geeze, you people really don't like the British do you? Talk about a massacre, I think just a couple hundred of any modern small arms would've shortened the war by years.
But I'll play, I'd go with some scoped M-14 rifles to take out their officers at distance and AR rifles in 6.8spc sportin' some Aimpoint red dots, Glock 23's and lots of ammo to finish off the rest of those wretched limeys

 

[CajunBass]

It is written from a very British point of view. I am guessing that this is quite different to what is taught in American schools.

Not really. It's pretty much the way I remember it being taught. Maybe we got a little more "Ra-Ra Go American's--Boo Redcoats" but not a lot. A lot more "starving patriots at Vally Forge." Since Yorktown isn't too far from here, we did get a bit more detail about that than they might have in other parts of the country. We of course got a large dose of Washington, Jefferson, Henry and Jack Jouett. (Look him up. Interesting story there.)

It's odd that so little about the Revolutionary War itself is ever taught in US schools. The political and legal outcome are well known, of course. But the war itself remains far less known than the Civil War.

The Civil War was taught in depth when I was a kid, but then a large part of it was fought around here. Our teachers taught is as "Then right down the road, where Mary and Bobby live...". My wife, who grew up in the Chicago area said all she learned about it was "There was a Civil War. We won. The slaves got freed." End of story.

 

[NMGonzo]

Bolt action rifles.

It was a long war and money was tight.

Enough to fight the black powder guys.

 

[Cosmoline]

Bright blue spandex unitards, with gold piping, and a perky white beret.

Outstanding!

 

[bigalexe]

My wife, who grew up in the Chicago area said all she learned about it was "There was a Civil War. We won. The slaves got freed." End of story.

I always find it interesting how few people know the real cause of that war. The real cause had to do with changing economics and the differences between the economies of the North and South. This resulted in disputes over tariffs on imported goods which in a nutshell can be summed as the north being Pro-Free Trade and the south being Pro-Made in America. The honest truth is that the entire freeing of the slaves only got added at the end, it almost was something where the North said "Hey we won, so free the slaves too."

Anyway back on the OP:
Given 15 days to train the army and equip them with small arms.

Day 1 is testing, throw rifles at the troops and see what they do.
-Very Good shots (those that shoot well, and adapt well) get an M1 Carbine or M14 with Semi-Automatic Fire only.
-Average shots get the M16 in M4 configuration, these will still out shoot the muskets in range and accuracy. Maybe a few of them who display good presence of mind get an M204 launcher under the barrel.
-Guys that appear nuts (Rambo types) and those that can't hit the broad side of a barn get a mix of Shotguns and M249 SAW Machine Guns.

For non-infantry units
-Artillery soldiers get 1911 Sidearms in .45ACP
-Cavalry units get the Mosin-Nagant with Bayonets.

Day 2 thru 5 is individual training on their own weapons
Day 5 thru 10 is unit training, shooting together
Day 10 thru 15 is army training, multiple units coordinating efforts

Oh and one last thing: We go across the ocean and draft Napoleon to command the artillery units.

 

[Ronsch]

Harry Turtledove did something like this in "Guns Of The South."

Outfitted the CSA with AK-47s.

 

[22-rimfire]

I watched the entire series of episodes on the Revolutionary War on the History Channel over the weekend. I learned a lot. Little is taught about any war these days in schools it seems. I'm not sure that is a good thing, because it reduces kids impression about the cost of freedom.

 

[Rembrandt]

Fantasies about outfitting people from years gone by with current technology have fueled Hollywood for years. Anyone remember "Final Countdown" with Kirk Douglas?......fought off the Japanese attack on Pearl Harbor with F-14's and a modern carrier task force.

 

[Mike OTDP]

With the magic wand waved....training time probably takes over. Against muzzle-loading smoothbores, something like a M-1917 Enfield bolt-action rifle would be infinitely superior. A FAL or M1A would be better - IF I had the training time.

Same for sidearms. Issue revolvers, as the manual of arms is a lot simpler than for a self-loader. S&W Model 25s would do nicely.

That being said, my first truckload isn't guns. It's radios. Followed by binoculars. You put a screen of radio-equipped scouts out in front, and all those hair's-breadth escapes of the Continental Army become instances where they just move aside, let the British blow fall on empty ground, and hit them in the flank.

 

[jeepguy]

im thinking arm the cavalry with 1911's & binoculars. which would be a huge advantage. scoped rifles would decimate their officer ranks. also introduce them to camouflage uniforms. picking off their officers from a distance which they wouldnt be able to see, would probably cause their lines to break. espiecially since they wouldnt be able to understand the technology. i would pick off their horses after they were far away from the coast & pick them off all the way back to the coast. losing verry few of us & causing heavy casualties on them. these snipers would also have 1911's for close quarter combat.

 

[otcconan]

Interesting question. One could go overboard and supply them with M-4's and Beretta 92s, or AK's and Hi-Powers,

But let's be reasonable. They'd pretty much wipe the British off the floor with maybe 50 Garands and some 1911's.

 

[GRIZ22]

Threads like this remind of an old skit on Saturday Night Live, guest hosted by KirK Douglas, "What if Spartacus had a Piper Cub".

 

[BLACKHAWKNJ]

Both sides were equally well equipped with state of the art equipment, logistics back then were controlled by factors of weather, limited transport, an often inadequate road network. The British were taken completely by suprise by Washington's daring-and desperate-strike at Trenton, winter campaigns were almost never conducted then. It was Baron Von Steuben's training that transformed the Main Army into a force capable of meeting the British in open battle.
Weapons? M-14 and M-60, they worked for me. Probably M1903s or M1917s
would be better given the unfamiliarity of most individuals with mechanical devices then if only 15 days are available. Likewise I would probably still have the troops fight in the shoulder to shoulder/close order tactics of the day, with modern rifles you can bring the enemy under fire at 500-600 yards, well out of musket range. And a few well placed M-60s with plenty of ammo....
read about the 1st day of the Somme, July 1, 1916.

 

[killchain]

I always find it interesting how few people know the real cause of that war. The real cause had to do with changing economics and the differences between the economies of the North and South. This resulted in disputes over tariffs on imported goods which in a nutshell can be summed as the north being Pro-Free Trade and the south being Pro-Made in America. The honest truth is that the entire freeing of the slaves only got added at the end, it almost was something where the north said "Hey we won, so free the slaves to."

Oh, you mean that revisionist stuff.

I always drop the bombshell here:

So what was the Emancipation Proclamation about?

 

[22-rimfire]

Radio would have changed the war. Talk about a guarded secret if one side had them.

 

[Seattleimport]

The Questions:

1) What rifle and handgun would you choose?

If they had any training at all, the soldiers were trained in strategies and tactics of the muzzle-loading era. I'd try to not overly complicate matters by introducing anything over semi-auto fire. So: scoped Springfield M1A with polymer stock and 20-round magazine.

For the pistol, I'd completely ignore the above reasoning and go with a scorpion, mac-10, or uzi. Something fully automatic and terrifying. These would be especially terrible in the hands of the cavalry; if they got behind and amongst enemy lines, they'd just hose down the enemy. And an army equipped with machine pistols, properly trained to hold fire until they see the whites of the enemies eyes, would stop a charge dead.

2) If you could choose three people, what special guns would you give them? Who would you give them to?

I was going to recommend three sniper rifles, but then I thought that it'd take too much time to utilize their full potential. And the scoped M1A would likely suffice. So instead, I'd pick two steady guys and give them M-16s with the under-barrel grenade launcher. One on the right flank, one on the left flank. They're there to lob grenades into massed troops and cavalry (hopefully to initiate a stampede), pop incendiaries into enemy powder depots, and discourage charges with select automatic fire.

Then I'd pick the biggest corn-fed farmboy and give him an M240B (with tracers). He holds the center. And scares the **** out of the Brits.

 

[Mike OTDP]

Killchain, since you asked....the Emancipation Proclamation was about depriving the Confederates of about 40% of their labor supply, as well as blocking attempts to get the UK or France to intervene. It was a sound strategic move.