Good, inexpensive , bolt action rifle.

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Zaire

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Decatur Illinois
I am in the market for a long range rifle in either 7mm Rem. Mag, .308, .30-06, or .300 win mag. I have the chance to learn to shoot at ranges from 300 to 600 yards and need the rifle to go along with that. The MAX I want to spend for a rifle/scope combo is $600. Also, what caliber would you recommend? I know the Magnum calibers are a little more expensive, but at the local Farm & Fleet that is only a couple dollers differnence per box of 20. Is the 7mm too light? I also noticed that .30-06 is in abundance here.
Just need some input and it will be greatly appreciated.
 
If you can buy military surplus online or at a gun show, .308 will easily be the cheapest, with .30-06 coming fairly close.

$600 is not much money for a decent gun and glass, IMHO. Milsurp rifles are out because of your caliber preference. Savage has some package deals (rifle and scope) selling for cheap at Wally World, but I've never heard anything of them.

Here's a link to one in .30-06:

http://www.walmart.com/catalog/prod...&path=0:4125:4155:170080:170083:170243:170170

Remington also has the 710 package series. Obviously inferior to a 700, but much, much cheaper. Also consider getting a 700 ADL (for about $400) and getting a Leupold VX-I ($200).

Keep in mind you'll need rings, bases, and probably a sling. You always end up paying more than you expect to. :D
 
Surplus ammunition is not going to be of much use at 300-600 yards... unless you have a machine gun. The best you can buy is just good enough, and careful handloading is the best route. But I still recommend the .308, even though I shoot a .30-06, the little bit of Long Range that I do.

$600 is not going to buy you a whole lot of long range rifle AND scope these days. I don't know what to suggest.
 
I wouldn't think the 710 is good enough for the ranges you speak of here. Though the 700 ADL probably is. Another choice would be one of the Savages. They have some things people don't like, but they are accurate. For whatever reasons they don't hold value too well, so if you can scare up a used one you can get a heck of a deal.

I would say get the rifle and see what is left for the scope. I would try and keep at least 200 bucks in hand for that. If you can score a used Savage you might have more to play with.

As for caliber depends on what you are shooting. If targets only I actually might go with a 7mm-08. Otherwise the .308 followed by 7 Mag would be my choices.
 
Tha Savage 10 FP in .308 about 430-450 with the accu trigger. Bushnell Elite 3200 10x40 Mildot, excellent glass $165 shipped on sale at Natchezzs. Ken Ferrel scope base $50 Leupold rings $50. $695-715 gets you a great shooting rifle.

USNCORPSMAN
 
Might want to call Blythe's Sport Shop in Valparaiso, IN. 30-45 minutes east of the IL-IN state line on US 30. I was there today. They have a Rem 7mm mag complete with a decent scope for $319 (IIRC), and it's in excellent condition. 219-462-4412. The rifle is on the sale table as you walk in the door. Ask for Les, Joe or Mike. This is the screaming deal you're looking for. If I didn't already have a 7mm and 300 WM, it'd be in my safe right now.

Edit to add...they do IL transfers all the time, so it's no big deal

Take the $300 you just saved and buy...

RCBS press kit
3 pounds of RL-22 powder
100 Winchester cases
a few boxes of Sierra Match King 168 gr BTHP's
Federal Magnum Match primers
 
"Is the 7mm too light?"

I don't understand that part of the question. Too light for what? Are you going to be hunting with it? At those long distance ranges? What kind of game, if so? If it's just paper punching, then of course it's not too light. If it's for deer, then no, it's not too light. If it's for Elk, at those distances, then maybe a .300 Win mag would be better. It all depends on what you're using it for.

I'd probably go for a Savage in .308 or 30-06, or possibly a Remington ADL. If you are going to really do a lot of shooting to learn to shoot at those distances, then I'd suggest NOT getting a magnum caliber, as they can be more punishing when shooting a lot of rounds. That can lead to bad habits. I'd stick with a .308 and just shoot the heck out of it, it'll be easier on your shoulder, and your pocket book.
 
a CZ 550 or a Remington 700 BDL can be got for right at $450.00

Leaves you $150 for glass and taxes. Bonus on the CZ it comes with rings.

Look for a used Leupold scope you should be able to find a M8 4x for that price range. If your going to consistantly shoot @ longer range get a 6x.

Cheap new glass I am no help.
 
How much would I gain with a .30-06 over a .308? I ask this because at Wal Mart and Farm&Fleet here .30-06 is probably 5 to 1 over .308 as far as availability. Priced the same too!
 
30-06 will give you 150 FPS over the .308 in most bullet wieghts. IF your planning on cheap ammo .308 is your answer, 160 rounds of the aussie milsurp is a little over $30.00, If your planning on long heavy bullets ( 190-200 gr ) the 30-06 is a better choice. These bullets perform better at longer range because of the better B.C.'s. but 30-06 isn't as cheap of ammo as it once was.

I own both and a couple of 30 mags, to 300 yards not much to be concerned with. If your punching paper mostly the 308 works great. If your planning on elk hunting go with the 30-06 especially at longer ranges. Both are very good calibers and there are no flys on either.

Watch your Walmart guns these are usually a cheaper model, made specailly for Walmart, prices are attractive but if you look around you can find the real deal gun at the same price. Are you looking at Remington 700's ?
 
Walmart's guns are not inferior.
If you buy a Remington 700 ADL with synthetic stock at Walmart then buy the same gun at a mom and pop shop then they will be identical.
If you buy an ADL at Walmart then go to a mom and pop shop and see all the beautiful BDLs and wonder why your ADL doesn't look as nice then there's an obvious reason.
Many people don't understand this, you have to know what you're buying. Period.
Walmart won't rip you off (at least with guns).
I have yet to see a NEW BDL go for $400 (the price of Walmart's ADL's) or a Rem 870 Wingmaster go for $230 (price of an 870 Exp) in a brick and mortar shop.
Where do you buy your guns?
Let me know, I'd like 700 CDL but don't want to pay more than $386.88 :scrutiny:

Zaire, if I had $600 and wanted to punch paper far away I would get a heavy barreled Savage package deal. You can find them for $550 at Dick's Sporting Goods.
When you get a little better and can afford it, sell the scope that came with the gun and buy some quality glass and mounting hardware.
As far as caliber, I don't know you or your abilities, but if you're a beginner you may not want to get a magnum.
The accuracy potential of the .308 is a tiny bit better than the 30-06, but if you're only going to shoot factory ammo it won't matter that much.
If you're only planning on shooting paper then you can compensate for trajectory because you will know the distance, the velocity gains won't matter a whole lot.
The good thing about getting a Savage is you can change the barrel yourself as long as the caliber you're switching to fits in the action and the head diamters match (if not just buy another bolt).
 
30-06 will give you 150 FPS over the .308 in most bullet wieghts.
Click to expand...

Well I hate to disagree with you here but according to my Lyman 48 and speer 13 loading manuals the 30-.06, and .308 are the same velocity wise up to 165 grain bullets, remember that the purpose of the .308 was to duplicate the 30-.06 in a short action, short case more suitable for semi auto rifles.

The 30-.06 has the advantage in that you can use 180 to 220 grain bullets and get better performance from heavier bullet weights, and that advantage is only very slight.

The .308 has the advantage in availibility of surplus ammo and Lake City brass, for the reloader. .308 is also considered to be more accurate by most highpower rifle shooters.

JMHO YMMV
 
I thought the whole idea of .308 was that it for the most part gives the same performance as .30-06 but in a shorter casing? Isnt this the reason why the US gov. developed it? something to do with it being a more efficent round??
 
Fumbler,

ADL and BDL rifles are two different ( bottom metal ) guns and have different prices. $400 on a ADL is no real deal. Here is a link to a ADL under that price and with some looking you could probably beat that:

http://www.impactguns.com/store/SS-97485.html

Same place has BDL's for just under $450:

http://www.impactguns.com/store/remington_bdl_syn.html

No its not a CDL, your best bet on finding a cheap CDL is get a Shotgun News, CDNN usually runs Remington specials ( they don't advertise guns on the website) and Ron Shirk is another source of reasonably priced Remingtons.

Personally I would rather have the BDL, if you want to upgrade your ADL later it costs more to buy the bottom metal seperatly than pay the $75 premium up front.

Another source is get on gunbroker and hunt here is a Remy with scope for $375:

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.asp?Item=27589185

Walmart doesn't get any of my gun dollars, hard rule.
 
For cost effective long range accuracy I'd look at Tikka, CZ, Savage and Howa. For inexpensive but clear optics I like BSA. They won't last like a high end scope but they have a good warrantee with a quick turn-around time and good optics. They're the best value in a purely target scope in my opinion. I have 2 of them but I have a few much more expesnives scopes as well that I can compare them with.
 
ADL and BDL rifles are two different ( bottom metal ) guns and have different prices. $400 on a ADL is no real deal. Here is a link to a ADL under that price and with some looking you could probably beat that
Click to expand...
Your post before that one sounds like you're saying Walmart's guns are not the same thing as guns you buy in other stores.
I know the differences between the 700 models.
There are some models they offer that you cannot find in other places, but if you buy factory offered model at Walmart it will be the same as any other place. They all come from the same factory.
I have no problem buying guns and ammo from Walmart, you know for sure where these are manufactured. Walmart can offer them at lower prices simply because of the quantity they order them in.

For cost effective long range accuracy I'd look at Tikka, CZ, Savage and Howa.
Click to expand...
I agree on the Tikka, I have a T3 Lite in .308Win that shoots 168 gr Black Hills Match into consistent 0.5MOA so long as I don't heat the barrel up.
I'd love to have one of their varmint models in the future.
 
if you buy factory offered model at Walmart it will be the same as any other place
Click to expand...
Not nessisarily true. Wal-Mart almost always gets special runs made of products to get the price down to their target level but still demand the same part numbers so that they can hurt their compeditors. I've heard this first hand from a Remington factory worker and someone who worked in purchasing for Wal-Mart and it's been confirmed by several consumer protection organizations.

If you're at Wally-World, buyer beware. They can have some great deals, but there can also be some corners cut. Not every item is this way, of course, but if a deal is really good, look into it carefully.
 
For a $600 paper punching outfit you might consider a $400 1903 or 1903A3 Springfield from the CMP, a good leather sling from Brownells ($40), and a case of Lake City 30-06, also from the CMP. You will have some change left over.

Clemson
 
I bought one of the Mossberg ATR-100 rifles in .30-06 a few months back from my local Wally World. Haven't had a chance to shoot it yet, as rifle ranges are very few & far between around here.

Got the Mossberg, Leupold "hi-rise' rings, Simmons 3-9x50 'Blazer' scope, Uncle Mikes QD swivels and a sling for $311 out-the-door.

Got $25 off the rifle because the finish was scratched a bit where the barrel contacted the rack; other stuff was in various closeout bins.

Synthetic stock, 22" barrel. Internals look a lot like the Savage 10/11 series, 2-pillar bedding, etc.

Maybe before too long I can try it out.
 
If you get the Savage (good choice, IMHO), make sure you get the "Accu-Trigger" model. That will save you about 50 bucks (new trigger or trigger job on anything else).

Clemson's suggestion has lots of merit.
 
Personally I would rather have the BDL, if you want to upgrade your ADL later it costs more to buy the bottom metal seperatly than pay the $75 premium up front
Click to expand...

Ain't that the truth.
 
Well I hate to disagree with you here but according to my Lyman 48 and speer 13 loading manuals the 30-.06, and .308 are the same velocity wise up to 165 grain bullets, remember that the purpose of the .308 was to duplicate the 30-.06 in a short action, short case more suitable for semi auto rifles.
Click to expand...

From Winchesters website:

150 gr silver tips
.308
Velocity (fps) 2810

30-06
Velocity (fps) 2900

168 gr Silver tips
.308
Velocity (fps) 2670

30-06
Velocity (fps) 2790

180 gr Silver tips
.308
Velocity (fps) 2620

30-06
Velocity (fps) 2750

Not exactly 150 fps but I didn't get into heavier bullets, 308 does not exactly match 30-06 ballistics.

For more info check: http://www.winchester.com/products/catalog/cfrlist.aspx?cart=MzA4IFdpbmNoZXN0ZXI=
 
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