Gun owners are in favor of more gun control...

[willbrink]

Folks, any of you ever take a look at the Second Amendment Research Center?

http://www.secondamendmentcenter.org/test_index.asp


They present themselves as a objective public policy center regarding the Second Amend and issues around guns. Great, so I read some of their debates on the topic. Facts and figures are thrown around, which to my eye, seem mighty dubious at best. For example, the following is from a comments made by one Gregg Carter:


“..for example, 81 percent of the general public versus 71 percent of gun owners favor the registration of all handguns. The Brady Law is favored by 87 percent of the general population and 82 percent of gun owners. Fully 64 percent of gun owners, and 69 percent of the general population, favor “one-gun-a-month limits.” Fourth, there is broad support for gun control measures across political parties, ideological views, and race.”

There are a bunch of these stats thrown around without citations from what I could see. Now I have been around gun owners for decades, been all over the many forums, attended conferences, read about a zillion articles, editorials and books on the topic, etc, etc, and I have NEVER in all my life met a gun owner who would agree to the above. Anyone here agree with the above? Ever met a gun owner who didn't turn red in the face from the mear mention of the Brady Law?

Where are these gun owners they speak of? I sure as heck never met one of them. Have you? The debate is full of these supposed stats from polls (and of you ever been contacted for such a poll? Me either) claiming most Americans, including most gun owners, are in favor of more gun control, but the big bad NRA prevents it from happening…now we all know polls can be misleading, but this is ridiculous!!!!

Besides being mucho incredulous over the statements these guys are making, I genuinely want to know, where are all these gun owners in favor of more gun control???? The article I pulled the above from is here:

Cont:

http://www.secondamendmentcenter.org/debate4.asp

 

[Bazooka Joe71]

LOL thats pretty funny stuff.

82 percent of gun owners favor the Brady Law? I don't think .000082 percent favor it.

I could see the registering of handguns but the rest of it is crap.

Except the one gun a month thing, every gunny I know only wants to be allowed one gun a month.

LOL

 

[Reddbecca]

Time to start busting heads...

 

[RNB65]

The majority of gun owners are not shooters. They're either Fudds who own a rifle/shotgun or two for hunting or average folks who own a handgun for home defense. Most of them could care less if EBR's and semiautos are banned and the 2A is gutted. I suspect the majority of gun owners DO favor more gun control because they've bought into the fiction that more gun control = less violent crime.

 

[DoubleTapDrew]

Is that one of those anti organizations with a pro-gun sounding name?
They should realize that 92% of people believe that 86.5% of statistics are made up on the spot.
I'm 100% opposed to any more infringement and will offer 0% compromise because the ultimate goal of anti gun orgs is 99% of guns banned and destroyed (the 1% remaining will be in the hands of criminals who don't obey laws to begin with).

 

[willbrink]

"Is that one of those anti organizations with a pro-gun sounding name?'

You tell me brother. Not sure myself. That's why I asked.

 

[Jorg Nysgerrig]

It's not hard to figure out. Click out the "About" page and scroll to the bottom where it says, "supported by a generous grant from The Joyce Foundation."

That's your answer right there. They like to fund all kinds of interesting things.

However, the article in question was not generated from them, but was published by the American Bar Association. If you click here you can see the original article with an included bibliography so you can go find the source of the statistics yourself.

 

[willbrink]

Thanx for the info Jorg. You know what they say "there's lies, damn lies, and statistics"

 

[Bob's Grandson]

If y'all aren't familiar with the Joyce Foundation, you can check Wikipedia.org for Joyce Foundation where, though disputed (I wonder by whom?) it states:

The Joyce Foundation has underwritten research into gun violence prevention since 1993. The focus of most of the funded research is on preventing gun violence.[this source's reliability may need verification] Almost all of this research directly or indirectly supports gun control and additional restrictions on gun ownership[3].[this source's reliability may need verification]

The Joyce Foundation also is a principal source of funding to many gun control organizations in the United States.[original research?] The most noteworthy of these is the Violence Policy Center[original research?], which received $4,154,970[3] between 1996 and 2006, and calls for an outright ban on handguns, semi-automatic and other firearms, and substantial restrictions on gun owners

Wayne

 

[Outlaws]

I think we should register secondamendmentresearchcenter.com and .org, then make a page with an explanation on how they are a group designed to infiltrate via misinformation and ban guns world wide.

 

[lamazza]

They couldn't possibly be lying..The brady bunch would never spread lies and misinformation.

 

[mnrivrat]

The database is intended to be broad, with an emphasis on the key or most influential articles and positions;

Yea ! In case you need to know what that means, it says "we are anti-gun and want to provide you with as many biased arguements as we can against the 2nd amendments individual right to keep and bare arms". "We don't give a crap about facts or accuracy, we simply compile anything that has ever been published to support out anti-firearm cause"

 

[Kim]

This is the John Glenn Institute at OHIO STATE UNIVERSITY> Yea that big liberal Democrat JOHN GLENN. The place is supported by the JOYCE Foundation. IT is the HOME of Bogus and Saul Cornell. The Great LIBERAL LEFTIES who hate gun and are great propagandists and the experts the MSM espically the NYT, WPO and NPR go to for intellectual lefty views on firearms. THEY HATE THEM AND THE PEOPLE WHO OWN THEM AND THE COUNTRY THEY LIVE IN.

 

[obxned]

173% of gun owners think the Brady Bunch are all brainless, meddling, self-righteous fools.

 

[Travis McGee]

Another false flag operation.

 

[ball3006]

You have to remember......

polls and statistics can be formulated to show anything you want. I WISH I could afford at least one gun a month........chris3

 

[Justin]

Yet another spinoff of the Joyce Foundation.

It must be nice to have what amounts to unlimited funds to throw at a cause opposed by most citizens, instead of having to rely on their financial support.

 

[SamTuckerMTNMAN]

(the 1% remaining will be in the hands of criminals who don't obey laws to begin with).

does that include the 'authorities'?

 

[Johannes_Paulsen]

Whatever its funding, the debate on legal/historical issues is very interesting.

http://www.secondamendmentcenter.org/debate.asp#guns2nd

Spitzer is, in my opinion, off-base, but the responses to him aren't.

JOYCE MALCOLM: The state of legal thinking has overwhelmingly endorsed the view that the individual has a right to possess and bear arms. Daniel Lazare had it right when he wrote in Harpers Magazine in 1999, “The truth about the Second Amendment is something that liberals cannot bear to admit: The right wing is right. The amendment does confer an individual right to bear arms.” Based on what Supreme Court Justice Thomas referred to as “an impressive array of historical evidence,” leading American constitutional experts, including Laurence Tribe, Akhil Amar, Leonard Levy, and William Van Alstyne, agree that the Second Amendment protects a right for the individual to have arms. This interpretation is not, as Robert Spitzer would have it, a product of the gun rights movement tracing back to 1960. It is the original interpretation of the Second Amendment, a legacy of the framers’ rights as Englishmen.

 

[Justin]

A bit of Googling turns up some interesting information.

David Hardy on The Joyce Foundation's founding of "The Second Amendment Research Center

Randy Barnett at The Volokh Conspiracy pontificated on the academic credentials of The Second Amendment Research Center, as well as how it has been geared to only give voice to one side of the issue, but appear in such a way as to be academically respectable.

Evidently Saul Cornell got upset, and emailed Randy, and Randy's critique is here.

Note that this is all a couple of years old.

Interestingly enough, in their List of Experts there are a number of pro-gun writers and scholars listed, but I'd be curious to know if they were all asked beforehand, or if their names were just tossed onto the website in order to give the appearance of a neutral organization.

 

[G36-UK]

I support reponsible gun control.

By responsible, I mean any effort to stop criminals getting guns that does not affect the law-abiding in any way.

IMHO, any such laws are the only ones allowed to be called "sensible".

 

[MrPeter]

I'm a gun owner who definately favors getting one gun a month. As it is now, I get only about one every 2 months. If the government could help me out and give me one every other month to make up the difference, well gee golly that would be swell

 

[yhtomit]

There are a lot of things I could support if the actual circumstances were appropriate. Ask me "Are you for 'handgun registration'?" and I'll say, bluntly, NO, and the door is that way.

But could there be a "registration" scheme (that is, some program that could be described as "registration," *not* necessarily the registration systems that have already been implemented in places like New York) which I would either not object to or object to only / mostly on the grounds that private business could do a better job? Perhaps.

For instance: a n *all-volunteer* "registry" in which my name (or some sort of difficult-to-fake proxy for my name) along with a record ot the gun type and serial number were verified, recorded, strongly encrypted, and decrypted ONLY at my request in the event of theft, in order to have a definitive record of ownership, might not be a bad thing. (It might, though, and I don't trust the government to keep such data private -- still, as a thought experiment, it seems provisionally OK.)

In fact, since one of the reasons that is trotted out to defend registration is that it makes tracking down legit owners for lost or stolen (and subsequently recovered) guns, it seems like this would be a way to gauge the effectiveness or desirability of the idea among gun owners.

timothy

 

[Lonestar49]

Only 10 day cooling-off period, and DOJ background chks

Quote: I'm a gun owner who definitely favors getting one gun a month. As it is now, I get only about one every 2 months. If the government could help me out and give me one every other month to make up the difference, well gee golly that would be swell
--------------------
...

GOOD ONE!! LOL

But, if the DOJ, all the STATE medical personal, could get their act together, and make records of patients health, and criminal, backgrounds up-linked, updated, and "accurate", then I'd say; any buyer that, once passes a 10-day cool-down-period (which I believe has merrit) while his/her background goes thru the DOJ, and the "way it's supposed to work" gets passed, then that should be on record, and if he or she wants to buy another gun, next week, then a instant DOJ check, should confirm an "ok" and that person should be able to walk out the door with any new gun or 3.. I say next week, only in the hope (since no system is perfect, never will be) that the one week limit would allow any updates as to health or arrest, court orders, etc., be entered into the DOJ system.


IMHO


LS

 

[romma]

I wish there was a list that people that want to gun bans, could put their name on that would allow them to forever ban guns for themselves, and themselves only... Let them put their money where their mouths are for starters.

I wonder how many of these grabbers would voluntarily do this? Realizing that everyone besides themselves would be able to defend themselves...

Just wondering...