Gun Shop Math

[BamBam-31]

Somebody tell me if this is typical. It sounds kinda fishy to me, but it happens nonetheless.

Case #1: I buy ammo from a gun show. I use my credit card. They charge me an additional $3.00 fee for using the credit card (okay, I can handle that), but they add it into the price before charging sales tax. It's only about $0.25 more, but is the credit card fee supposed to be taxed as well?

Case #2: I buy a handgun from Turner's in Pasadena. They charge me for the gun, a cable lock, and a handling charge of $4.00. And the $20.00 DROS fee, of course. Sales tax gets applied to the gun, cable lock, and handling charge. Again, it's only $0.33 more, but is that fee supposed to be taxed as well?

I thought sales tax was only supposed to be for items purchased.

 

[HABU]

I hear ya BamBam. That always annoys me too. I always say sumpin about it, usually to no avail.

Another thing that annoys me is it seems most businesses will print out my entire card number complete with expiration date! I say something every time too. I have had a few lums tell me that I cannot scribble out the numbers on their copy of the receipt. I tell them that not only can I, but I just did and if they dont like it to reprogram thier merchant account to show only the last four numbers. I will also remind them that by the time I scribble out the numbers they have already received their $

 

[Sheslinger]

It is unbelievable...

When we got married in September and I figured out the total to the caterer plus tax plus 18% required gratuity, my total did not match theirs. Come to find out, they had to add gratuity first and then tax the total. Amazing, now they tax tips.

Sheslinger

 

[Topgun]

Using credit cards is good business.

because it absolutely gives whoever wants it a complete record of your spending habits, where you spend money, what you buy, how far you travel, where you stay, how often you shop, and a whole host of other information.

USE CASH!

Wot the heck is the matter with people who THINK they want liberty and freedom from being watched and then use CREDIT CARDS?

You have no IDEA how far that info goes. You would not believe it if I told you.

Switch to CASH!

 

[Topgun]

And BamBam

It is NOT only .25 more. It is $3.25 more. That's about 30-40 miles you will not travel at $2 gas.

Once a week it is $169 per year.

AND at current savings account interest of .75% , you will only need $433.00 in your savings account to earn that $3.25 in a YEAR.

Use CASH.

 

[Blackhawk]

Case 1: That's a violation of the merchant agreement with the credit card issuer. They're forbidden to pass on the charge to the consumer.

Case 2: Sales tax is charged for mercandise AND services, which is what handling fees, etc., are.

You're navigating the ridiculous price hype that many merchants practice so they can claim their $59 gizmo is priced at $40 to lure you in.

All I want to know about price is the TOTAL price, and I don't care to play their games to figure out what it really is.

 

[Wildalaska]

Credit card surcharges are a vioaltion of the Mastercard/Visa agreements, call them to complain you will get your surcharge back.

 

[Mal H]

I agree with Topgun and always use cash where possible. Credit cards are good idea when buying off the 'net since it gives you an out if there is a problem with the purchase.

I believe the dealers in both cases were correct in their charges to you. In case 1, they are offering their wares at a discount 'gun show' price for cash or checks. It does cost for the merchant to accept credit cards, so on discounted prices I can understand the additional fee. The fee, in essence, simply increases the price of the goods and it is taxable. I believe that if they try to charge extra for a normally priced item, they are in violation of their agreement with the bank card company.

In case 2, the handling charge is a charge for service and in most states a service charge is taxable. For example, an auto repair might cost $1.00 for parts and $25.00 for labor, you will usually be charged tax on the full $26.00 not just on the cost of the parts.

 

[HABU]

Wot the heck is the matter with people who THINK they want liberty and freedom from being watched and then use CREDIT CARDS?

I don't use credit cards and havn't in years. I must not be as paranoid as you are as I am willing to use a debit card for some purchases.

You have no IDEA how far that info goes. You would not believe it if I told you.

Yes I would!




Oh, nevermind, you were talking to BamBam

 

[Double Naught Spy]

Those are not credit card surcharges even though they appear to be. Instead, the gun store will argue that the price listed is the cash discount price. The price with the perceived additional surcharge is the real price. That is how they get around it. And, discounts for cash are not uncommon in all sorts of business.

As for the handling fee, that sounds bogus. That is one of the ways to be able to generate more income for an item by listing it at one price and then tacking on the fee after the fact. It is sort of a baiting method. Of course, charging tax for the handling fee is correct because they are essentially selling you a handling fee. Personally, unless the prices are great, I would opt to shop somewhere else. You were there to buy a gun, not handling fees.

While the example here was for a gun shop, this sort of thing appears to be fairly common in car sales as well.

 

[WhoKnowsWho]

I see those "cash discount" things a lot more often around firearms than I ever did before.

The only reason I use my credit card is so that I can buy a item at 500+ and pay it off in two months. 'Cause trying to save, I tend to spend it more freely than if I just buy and then plan to pay later. It's worked so far, I have less debt than most anyone else I know!

 

[samualt]

I'm too lazy to carry cash so I almost always use a card. I have also bought guns on the net, which is harder with cash (all that snail mail back and forth business).
When I'm at a gun store I always ask how much the total would be with all taxes and everything, and then decide. A frown when they tell you the price will sometimes get an extra mag thrown in for free ;-)

But your right, the surcharges have gone crazy. I think it's that way for everything these days. Just look at a phone bill, a paycheck, or even all the gasoline taxes. And to think we went to war with the Brits over a penny tax on tea...that was still cheaper than domestic tea! LOL. (I know there were deeper reasons but still....).

 

[Kahr carrier]

I guess Im lucky at the gunshop I shop at they tax the item first ,then add the State Dros fees.

 

[JohnBT]

Once again I have just received my YEARLY Visa report from my bank. It lists purchases by category(food, sports, etc.) and by month.

And by the name of the business where I spent the money.

Cute.

I didn't know I spent that much on gun-related stuff last year. I buy guns with checks or cash, but the scopes, mags and whatnot I buy on the web go on the credit card.

They claim it's for people who like to itemize their taxes and keep track of their spending habits.

John

 

[Topgun]

Yes I....DO....use a credit card once in a while

I opened an account at a credit union 5 blocks from the house.

NEVER allow more than $1000 to be in it. Use it for web purch ONLY. If I get a Paypal deposit into it, I strip it IMMEDIATELY!

My brokerage sends me a debit card that has access to my complete financial account. IT sits in the safe. If I use it for traveling, I guard it like a gun.

But the only card anyone ever sees is my "one grander" If it gets screwed up, the loss is not catastrophic.

I don't like ANY credit card. Grocery store "preferred customer" accounts are also used for demographic records. Not a serious thing though unless you buy inordinate amounts of alcohol in which case a subpoena can get those records to show to a court to establish your "stability."

WATCH OUT for electronic data. It never goes away.

An here I am on an electronic GUN forum. Oh well, welcome to the Gulag.

 

[TarpleyG]

I just bought a used car. The original owner paid the state of Florida $875 for sales tax in 1997, right? Now, I have to pay ANOTHER $313 for the same automobile that was taxed 6 years ago. When I sell it in a couple of years, that poor schmuck will get taxed AGAIN, on the same car. This is really "taxation without representaion" (sort of) IMO. This does not make since to me. Anyone else concur?

GT

 

[ajacobs]

I just bought a used car. The original owner paid the state of Florida $875 for sales tax in 1997, right? Now, I have to pay ANOTHER $313 for the same automobile that was taxed 6 years ago. When I sell it in a couple of years, that poor schmuck will get taxed AGAIN, on the same car. This is really "taxation without representaion" (sort of) IMO. This does not make since to me. Anyone else concur?

I agree our tax system is a shamble. The most dishearting account I know off occured to a friend of mine. His father had 2 sons. Both went to college one moved away to be a computer guy in the city the other stayed home and worked the family farm. It had been in the family for generations and he loved that land. When dad passed away not being to savy on the tax system he gave his entire finicial assests to the son in the city and left the farm to the other son. What he thought was a fair split, and it was. Only problem is the son with the the farm can't raise the money to pay the inheritance tax and now has to sell the farm. Dad paid taxes on every dime he ever earned paid taxes on all the divedends he earned on the money he invested (which the company already paid taxes on their profit) paid taxes but now he is being taxed again and his son looses the farm.

 

[No4Mk1]

How can that be?

I thought the death tax only applied to the rich!?!?

:banghead:

 

[10-Ring]

Yeah, Turner's is a bit fee happy & that "handling charge" they tack on is really annoying. Unfortunately, every once in a while, they put something on sale that is tough to walk away from.:banghead:

 

[Ebbtide]

Estate Tax = Double dipping!!!!!:banghead:

I never carry cash, and never really think about it. My work deposits the money in the bank. I have as many auto pays as possible and overdraft protection. I write checks or use the debit whenever possible.

The only time I need cash.....hmmmmm....I don't think I need cash. Oh, I do when I go to flea markets once and a while. I have never paid cash for a gun. I use my expense checks from work for my cash (about 60.00 a month).

While I don't think I have to worry about being on a list (you are on one anyway) I do worry about ID theft.

Watch out, the cashless system is coming. I have no doubts by the time I die youngsters will have no idea what "cash" looked like. BTW: I'm 37 and planning to live to 90. Wish me luck!

And don't forget about the yearly vehicle registration tax, gas tax, drivers licence tax, emmisions tax (if applicable in your area), parking tax, toll tax, etc. Not to mention that you can't deduct any sales tax from your income is wrong. Why should I pay income tax on all the money I use for the tax on smokes, gas, and sales?

Poor ole Tarpley just spent $313.00 (worth at least 400.00 in pre tax) to pay "sales tax" on an item that the state had recieved a tax. Now he has to pay $60.00+tax in after taxed money for plates, and another 30.00 plus tax in after tax money for an emmisions test. So all totaled, he paid about 520.00 more for his used car than he had to.

Patiently waiting for the oxygen tax,

ehenz

 

[spacemanspiff]

the credit card fee is a violation with some loopholes for merchants to jump through.
for example, american express absolutely frowns on those "fees", and if a merchant accepts am/ex, they shouldnt be charging a fee for their card, or for any other card as well. mastercard and visa individually arent as strict about this, but if the merchant accepts am/ex then visa/mastercard will refund such "fees" charged to your card.
i did some digging online and came up with a nice little article about this, and i intend to take it with me to any gunstore that tries to charge that fee.

its simple operating costs, and do you think that the merchant also claims those fees as deductions on their taxes? i'd assume they are. if i'm right, they are screwing us customers over and sticking it to the irs. i wouldnt have a problem with that so long as some of those savings are kicked back to the customer.

 

[RobW]

Has anyone been in Italy recently???

Take the menu, order a pasta or pizza, and suddenly, you are charged extra for the plate (!) and the silverware (!) and the napkin!

Seems that a lot of gun traders were in Italy recently

 

[rock jock]

Credit cards

I have been using them extensively for more than 12 yeras and will continue to do so. They are a huge convenience. Oh, and I have yet to have the UN come to my door demanding my firstborn. I do get my share of junk mail, but it is easy enough to toss.

Paranoia is a terrible malady.

 

[labgrade]

Use cash, or even checks (same as, right?).

Everything has an added effect of the 4-5% surcharge of using a credit card.

Worse case & using anything "less than" a credit card, insist on a 4-5% discount (since you aren't).`

Fill it up & argue with the "cashier" for using cash when they tag you for the extra for a credir card - it's enlightening.

Cheap entertainment is where you find it.

 

[rock jock]

Fill it up & argue with the "cashier" for using cash when they tag you for the extra for a credir card - it's enlightening.

Exactly how is it enlightening when you refuse to pay a price that is clearly marked? If you disagree with the policy, you are free to take your business elsewhere, but to harass a business owner (or even moreso a clerk who has no influence over the matter) because you don't like what he charges is pretty low.