Has the the quality of today's 9mm bullets made the .40 cal obsolete?

[David E]

What purpose has the 40 ever served other than to blow up gLoCk's?

That's totally irrational and uninformed.

Can't stand the recoil characteristics one bit, I'd much rather have a 9mm or 45ACP, which are the two calibers I own.

Controlling the .40 is a matter of applying basic technique.

Nothing wrong with the 9mm or .45, but the .40 combines power, gun size and capacity pretty darn well.

 

[exavid]

I like the .40 but then I don't have a Glock. I have a Ruger SR40c and enjoy shooting it, it's accurate for me and the recoil isn't bad. One other reason I like the .40 is that most of the PD's in the area that use our club indoor range shoot .40s. That means I collect a lot of free brass in that caliber. Since I have 9mm, .40, and .45 I don't have to make the choice. I like to shoot them all. For a CCW pistol I mostly carry my LCP or SR40c due to their small size compared to the SR9 and P345.

 

[LightningMan]

I was one of those hold outs on buying a .40 S&W because I thought my 9mm'ers & .45's would be enough. That changed last year when I got a good deal on a .40 caliber pistol, and I liked it so much I bought another just last month with buying a S&W M&P compact. I shot it in a side by side comparison between my full size 9mm Sig 226, and the results supprized me, as I could nearly shoot it as accurately from a distance of 10 yards. What really supprized me was I could shoot the M&P better than the SIG when shooting more rapidly. I'm starting to really like that M&P .40 S&W caliber. LM

 

[ColtPythonElite]

Nothing wrong with the 9mm or .45, but the .40 combines power, gun size and capacity pretty darn well.

That statement pretty much sums it up.....the .40 is hardly obsolete or headed that way.

 

[Old krow]

Obsolete? I doubt it. I do think that ammo prices will eventually take a heavy toll on some of the larger rounds. I cringe now when I look at the prices of 45 ammo.... let's see what they look like in a few years.

 

[surfinUSA]

I like the 40. Always have. As was previously stated the .40 combines power, gun size and capacity. If I could only have one CCW it would be a G27 (the G26 is a great gun, but I don't mind giving up a round I carried a 7 shot 45 for years).

Regardless of bullet improvements, I don't think the 9mm will be making the 40 or the 45 obsolete.

As far as 40 recoil goes, the only place it seems to be a problem is on the internet.

 

[easyg]

I like the 9mm Para.
In fact, I carry a Glock 26 or a Ruger SR9c every day.
I trust my life to the 9mm Para.
But I'm not blind to the fact that the .40S&W is unquestionable more effective than the 9mm Para (all other things being equal).

 

[Mike J]

However slight the difference between .40 & 9mm is there is still a difference. Personally I own 2 .40's and one 9mm. I bought the 9mm for something small to carry when one of the .40's is just too hard to conceal. It is a Kel Tec P11. I don't really have any desire to shoot .40 out of a gun that light.

 

[Apocalypse-Now]

one of the advantages of the 40cal over 9mm is it yaws far less often after passing through car windshields.

 

[Jenrick]

As far as 40 recoil goes, the only place it seems to be a problem is on the internet.

Try and teach 80 new police cadets to shoot using a .40 and then the same gun in 9mm. You will have a much easier time with the later.

But I'm not blind to the fact that the .40S&W is unquestionable more effective than the 9mm Para (all other things being equal).

I'm going to have to completely disagree with that statement in it's entirety. I find that the.40 does nothing the 9mm can't do just as well.

-Jenrick

 

[wanderinwalker]

I don't see any of the 3 major popular handgun rounds going anywhere (9mm, .40, .45). What you gain in the 9mm, you also gain in .40 and .45 in terms of improvements. And frankly, nothing you can throw out of a service-sized handgun is really all that powerful (sorry 10mm guys... ) any way. Pick the one you like and shoot it, a lot. Carry it. Shoot it some more. Repeat.

(I'm in the "9 is fine" camp, though I want a nice 1911 in .45 ACP and I keep thinking I may be missing something by not having a .40. Though I've never shot a .40 I really liked, including a Hi Power, a Glock 27 and an H&K USP Compact. And when I want to really make some noise, I have a couple of Magnum revolvers. )

 

[Hangingrock]

I’ve never been enthused enough by the 40-S&W to acquire a handgun for that cartridge. With the 9mm-Luger and 45ACP thru extended usage I didn’t see the necessity.

 

[beatledog7]

My first semi-auto was a Glock 22 (that's a.40 for you guys who pretend Glocks aren't real guns). It's a great shooter and very reliable. I chose .40 over 9mm because it's more powerful (throws a bigger bullet harder than 9mm) and over .45 because I wanted the higher capacity potential (22 rds of .40 in a factory mag).

Now I have an all steel 9mm (CZ-75B SA) that I just love, and I'm sorting out which 1911 in .45 to acquire.

All three calibers have their place, and all are excellent SD rounds. Arguing that the .40 was a caliber in search of a requirement is like arguing that we didn't need redheads because we already had blondes and brunettes.

 

[Elm Creek Smith]

I have been a toter of wheel guns in the .38 SPL +P and .357 Magnum persuasions for years. My agency just assigned me to a new client that requires us to carry the same gun as the local police, so they issued me a brand-spanking new Glock 22 in .40 S&W. I did a familiarization fire with it this afternoon and found that, like the Glock 23 I had years ago, it is a fine shooting pistol that I just can't get worked up about. Now, if it was a 1911A1, even in .40 S&W, I'd like it more, but it's hard to argue with 16 rounds of 180 grain JHP that doesn't go anywhere but where you want it to go.

Personally, I have my eyes on a 4 inch Smith & Wesson Heavy Duty in .38-.44 at a local pawn and gun.

ECS

 

[rem22long40x]

A 9mm might exspand but a40cal won't shrink !!
I wouldent take anything for my CZ40P it is the only DA auto I like and it is very accurit.

 

[ku4hx]

I drive a Ford, my neighbor drives a Chevrolet and one guy up the street, bless his heart, has a Yugo.

Shot placement is king.

 

[harmon rabb]

When the 40 was first developed it certainly filled a need. But better bullets have made all calibers pretty much equal performers. There isn't a nickle's worth of difference between 9mm, 40, 45, 357, mag or Sig anymore if the best loads are used. Might as well use the one that offers the most ammo and least recoil.

I was kind of with you until you went off the deep end and threw 357mag in there. a maxed out 357mag cartridge can toss 125gr bullets much, much faster than any 9mm or 357sig load.

My own very anecdotal tests on shooting random junk show that 9 and 45 pretty much do the same thing, while the damage done by a 357mag looks more like the damage done by a rifle.

 

[R.W.Dale]

I was kind of with you until you went off the deep end and threw 357mag in there. a maxed out 357mag cartridge can toss 125gr bullets much, much faster than any 9mm or 357sig load.

My own very anecdotal tests on shooting random junk show that 9 and 45 pretty much do the same thing, while the damage done by a 357mag looks more like the damage done by a rifle.

But here's the kicker

There's only one degree of dead or stopped and if 9x19 is stretching bad guys out horizontal what exactly does 357 mag do better?

Strictly speaking SD and not hunting.

For me there are exactly four handgun calibers. .32, .38/9mm, 44 and 45. I don't believe in unholy pagan bastard calibers like 10mm/.40 or. 41

When I reach for a better 9mm I reach for a better 9mm called 357sig.

posted via tapatalk using android.

 

[Hangingrock]

When the 40-S&W was starting to gain traction in the firearms/shooting/marketplace we were preparing the next generation to enter the real world. In other words every extra and not so extra penny was being sent on a regular schedule to the bursar’s office of institutions of higher learning.

This cooling off period leads me to realize not being in law enforcement or a professional gunfighter that the inventory on hand of cartridges/calibers was most likely satisfactory. I’m not saying that the 40-S&W is irrelevant if it were so it wouldn’t be the dominate cartridge/caliber in law enforcement.

It seems that every time you turn around there is new wonder zapper bullet technology being offered in the marketplace. In the end we all flourish or suffer the consequences of our decisions be they good, bad, or indifferent. The caliber wars continue so be it.

 

[harmon rabb]

Unholy pagan bastard. LOL.

Any way you look at it, the 40 throws a heavier and larger bullet at the same speeds as a 9mm. Whether or not this translates into a better chance of a dead bad guy can be debated forever, but for someone who feels more comfortable with greater ballistics but doesn't want the crappy mag capacity of most 45's, the 40 is a decent round.

 

[HOOfan_1]

If someone is too stupid to tell the difference between a 9mm and a 40 cal, they shouldn't be allowed to even be near a gun. Especially if they are supposed to carry a gun to perform their duties.....chris3

the .40 S&W is closer to the .45 ACP than to the 9mm in the looks department.

I often pick up .45 ACP brass at the range thinking it is .40S&W and vice versa. I never get 9mm and .40S&W confused. Sometimes I pick up a .380 thinking it is 9mm though.

 

[mgmorden]

I don't think there's any question that .40 cal offers SOME improved performance. The question though is that is it ENOUGH of an improvement to really differentiate it? Sure if you go to the original 10mm round then that certainly trumps 9mm Luger by quite a bit, but the .40 S&W isn't as much of a performance jump.

My feeling personally is that 9mm works well enough for defense against human assailants. As such .40S&W isn't NEEDED, but at the same time, there's nothing wrong with .40S&W - it works just fine too, so why worry about if people want to use it? Let the people who want to shoot .40 shoot .40 and let the people who want to shoot 9mm shoot 9mm. At the end of the day it's not likely to make any difference (positive nor negative) which of the two they picked.

I will say that I have contemplated buying a .40S&W gun for one reason though: during the "Great Ammo Shortage of 2008" it was nearly impossible for me to find 9mm, .45ACP, or .22LR. I also was having a devil of a time finding primers too so even reloading was hard. I was shooting less that I'd like just for lack of ammo. For some strange reason though, the local stores ALWAYS had .40S&W in stock.

 

[mavracer]

All handgun rounds are a compramise. 9mm bullet design hasnothing to do with the 40s effectiveness and probably damn little to do with it's popularity.
For me the 40 was obsolete the day it was introduced it addressed a bunch of problems I never had.
I've never felt the 9mm was not powerful enough for SD and I've never felt that my 45 didn't hold enough rounds and my 10mm even with full tilt boogie loads is not too hard to control.

 

[Jonah71]

It took several hundred rounds to get the hang of it, but I like the .40 cal. I also like the 9mm, and .45acp. But over the past few months, the one I reach for the most is the G 23. I'm not a Glockophile, but my G 23 is, for me a great gun. I just can't see the .40 cal. as being obsolete and I've had several. The only one I didn't really like was the Kahr CW .40. Also a good gun. I just never could reach any degree of accuracy with it......unlike most of my friends who loved it.

 

[X-Rap]

I have a good selection and representation of most handguns and callibers and aside from my 380 in the pocket I'm pretty much stuck on the 9mm for SD. I went through all the hype of the others and have come back to the 9 for 3 simple reasons, I can put more rounds on target faster and with more accuracy and carry more ammo than any other gun or caliber that I own.
I really think it would take quite a man to put 15 rds as accurately and quickly into a target as can be done with a 9mm given that all loads were proper velocity SD loads for each caliber.
There is little doubt that the bigger calibers can carry a payload bigger or faster and some bigger and faster but that comes with recoil and capacity limitations as well so from a strictly SD perspective the 9 seems to be a decent choice to me.