Have a 4 hole turret but only using 3 dies, should I use 4?

[hokeyplyr48]

I have a lee classic cast turret press and I'm using the lee deluxe die set.
station 1: decapping/FLRS or collet
station 2: powder
station 3: seat/crimp bullet

But I have an extra hole in the turret, should I put something else there (split up the seating/crimping) or just index it twice at the end and skip it? Just wondering your opinions

and just a statement, the lee reloading manuals if you can even call it that are utter crap. there isn't a sentence of direction. just a picture of the completed thing

 

[jfh]

Are you a relatively-beginning handgun reloader, hokeyplr48? If so--then a 4-die setup might help you learn the processes better.

You can go either way for 4-die or 3-die. Personally, I prefer separate seating and crimping. Tweaking the Lee 3-die setup for different bullets (in the same caliber) can be a PITA, IMO. But, once you have that assembly sorted out, a 3-die works just as well.

Lee generally would have you install a Lee FCD, I think, in station 4. Use google here to search this forum for more discussions on this issue.

Jim H.

 

[hokeyplyr48]

Yea I'm a newbie, but I've been reading alot up on this for a while now so I didn't just run out and buy any of it without the understanding behind it. I know everything I have will work but was just seeing what others would think.

It'll only be used for one caliber (.223) so the changes aren't important to me. maybe down the road but as of now not really.

What's the advantage to two separate dies?

 

[jfh]

Since you are a rifle-reloader, I'll refrain--other turret / rifle reloaders will be along soon, I imagine.

I have started to learn .223, however--and I do have my turret set up with 4 dies and do on-press charging with an Auto Disk. I have an older adjustable charge bar that works well with the volumes for .223 and H-335 recipes. So, my turret has all 4-dies, including the Lee .223 FCD installed.

Jim H.

 

[hokeyplyr48]

so you are using the FCD and the seating die. Alright. Figure I might as well put that station to use since i'm going to be cycling through it anyway, correct?

What brand of crimping die is recommended? Is the lee FCD good? Searching the forum, people have recommended the redding crimp die.

Is there a way to make it so my current seating die doesn't crimp? Like unscrew the top or something? Or do I have to buy just a seating die?

 

[1SOW]

I'm a pistol loader--relatively new, but the Lee die instructions (came with the die set), and videos + instructions on the LEE site discuss/show adjusting the seating die for 1. seating and 2. crimp or no crimp. I agree the Lee instructions aren't clear/detailed at all.

For pistol , The top adjustment knurled knob adjusts seating depth. The number of turns on the die thread adjusts crimp.

For pistol, I also separate seating and crimping----I use all 4 Lee dies. On the forums, many will say why bother?...It's a matter of personal preference.

 

[remingtondude58]

I would add the LEE FCD, it is vary helpful. One time i did not push a few cases all the way into the shell holder, creating a bulge on one side, the LEE FCD eliminated the bulge.

 

[SASS#23149]

adjusting 2 dies is easeir than adjusting the 2 settings on a seat/crimp die,imho.I'd go 4 dies.

 

[jfh]

With the limited .223 reloading I've done--all with the Lee rifle FCD die, I sure found it easy to learn how to crimp properly. But, see what a real experienced rifle guy has to say.

Jim H.

 

[The Bushmaster]

HUH!! I have a four hole turret and I only use two holes (stations). I resize and decap on a single stage press. I only use one dedicated crimping die (for .30-30). So the only dies on my four station turret are powder through/expanding die and seating/crimping die.

Now what's your question again??

 

[jfh]

Well, one of the experienced rifle reloaders--with a Lee 4-hole turret, no less--has checked in.

Maybe he can elaborate a bit more--like talking a bit more about his kind of workflow.

For example:

I can prime on press with my .223 turret set up. What's the disadvantage to doing that?

And so on, and so on.

Jim H.

 

[The Bushmaster]

Why certainly Jim... Glad to.

My routine:

1. Tumble for around 15 to 30 minutes.
2. Resize/decap on a single stage press.
3. Tumble for around 2 to 3 hours.
4. Prime cases on a single stage press.
a. If rifle, powder is metered and weighed and dropped in each case in a block.
b. Seating of the bullet is done on a single stage press including crimping if it's .30-30.
5. Case is expanded and powder is dropped. Powder is transfered to the scale, weighed
trickled to desired weight and dropped back into the case. Case is placed back in the shell holder on the turret.
The bullet is seated and crimped.
6. Whaa Laa...Finished product.

Required measurments are accomplished in their proper sequence through the prosess.

Works for me as I'm not in that much of a rush. Nor am I into mass production.

If you wish photos of my setup. I'll need an e-mail as I can't post photos on here.

 

[hydraulicman]

if your loads are shooting well and are accurate i would just keep using the three die.

 

[dsv424]

I agree with hydraulicman, however, I use the 4 die method and believe it produces a better round. I have done it both ways and in my opinion doing the crimp in the 4th stage with the Lee FCD works better than combining the seating and crimping in one die. Although, I had a lot of trouble getting it set right using the 3 die set. I reload several pistol calibers and they are all 4 die sets but, you will get preferences doing both ways for rifle.

 

[Walkalong]

the LEE FCD eliminated the bulge.

You are thinking of pistol dies. The rifle FCD does not "post size"



The Lee FCD die for rifle does not seat. It crimps using a collet. If you use it to crimp, you will have to load in 4 steps.

I prefer a taper or roll crimp for .223, but I am sure the Lee FCD collet type crimp die will do just fine.

 

[Gadzooks Mike]

I have a four hole turret and sometimes just use one or two holes. It all just depends. If you have extra holes, put them in your pocket or a sock and save them for later.

Ok, seriously, seating and crimping in separate steps produces a better bullet. Whether it's better enough to matter to you is the question. The way I shoot, some days I can tell the difference, and some days I can't.

 

[Mags]

Lee Pacesetter Rifle Die sets do not include the powder through die. So the 3 die set I have is the Lee pacesetter it includes the Sizer, Seater, and FCD. Which is not what the OP has. If iwas the OP I would purchase the Pacesetter set if the FCD is desired that way he will have an extra decapping/sizer die for when his breaks. I have a 4 hole turret which I added a powder through die to but here is my routine with the Lee Turret Press and Pacesetter Dies.

1. Tumble Brass
2. Lube cases
3. Remove the auto index on the press making it a single stage
4. Deprime and size the cases
5. Trim and remove military crimps
6. Tumble the brass.
7. Reinstall auto index enabling the turret feature
8. Prime on the press
9. Charge the case (sometimes I use the powder through die with the Lee powder dippers) but I usually charge the cases on a loading block
10. Seat the bullet
11. Factory crimp

Complicated I know, but that is the way I do it.

 

[Walkalong]

The rifle FCD does not "post size"

I have been told I am wrong about this. How about it?

 

[hokeyplyr48]

the FCD doesn't post size for rifle cartridges but it DOES for pistol cartridges.

 

[jfh]

Lee could consider renaming their two types of FCD dies, IMO.

Maybe we could start our own convention--i.e., FCDP and FCDR.

The post-sizing of the pistol-type die is, of course, both its blessing and its bane. As a .223 newbie, I really was impressed with how easy it was to tweak the crimp--but I haven't gone a step further to learn to taper crimp a .223 yet, either.

Jim H.

 

[Seedtick]

Walkalong - I prefer a taper or roll crimp for .223, but I am sure the Lee FCD collet type crimp die will do just fine.

Hey Walkalong,
I know you said 'for .223' but did you mean just for .223 or maybe for bottle-necks in general? And do you prefer a taper or roll crimp because you tried the Lee FCD and didn't like something? what was that something? I've never crimped for my 7mm mag or .243 Winchester rifles and I'm wondering if there is a benefit to doing so. Although I've not had any problems to speak of.

hokeyplyr48, when I was ordering my first turret press, Lee Deluxe 4 Hole Kit, I was planning ahead. I was thinking - I don't need 4 stations for loading for my rifles so I'll just get an extra 3 hole turret. I thought it would just be an easy swap out just like an extra 4 hole one was.

Well at least if I ever get a 3 hole turret press I'll have an extra turret for it.

ST

 

[Walkalong]

I am not a big fan of the collet type crimp die. Nothing wrong with it. Just my preference. If I crimp a rifle caliber, I prefer a taper or roll crimp. A taper is more forgving on case length.

 

[hokeyplyr48]

So what type of crimp does a FCD put on? I'm guessing not a taper or roll crimp?

 

[Walkalong]

The Lee rifle crimp die (FCD) uses a collet to squeeze part of the neck tight around the bullet.

 

[hokeyplyr48]

Walkalong: So what type of die would produce the taper or roll crimp that you're talking about?