Help me identify 2 guns please.

[Nicksdad1970]

Hi, I have had a couple revolvers in the closet for a while and I figured I'd try to find out some information about them.

Thanks in advance

The first is a Colt Pocket Positive 32 ctg. The serial number is 67170. I'm pretty certain it has a 3" barrell. It is blued with a square butt. It looks like on the top of the barrell it says PT. FA. MFG CC Hartford Ct. USA Patd 51884 Aug 5 1884 June 5 1900? and July 4 1905.

The second is a 38 S&W ctg. The barrell is 4" I beleive and has a square butt. The serial number is (or looks like) 939158 or it might be g39158. The rear of the butt appears to have like a safety squeeze on it. I hope that make sense.

If anyone knows the rarity, value, year it was made, and any other information on them I'd appreciate it.

 

[elrod]

Welcome to THR!

Is the S&W a top-break? It sounds like a Safety Hammerless, but the serial # needs clarification. Pictures of both guns would help very much.

 

[Ron James]

And all markings please, 38 S&W CTG in oly the caliber. It sounds like a S&W but?

 

[Nicksdad1970]

Let me spend some more time trying to look closer at the serial number but here's the pics.

 

[Nicksdad1970]

A couple more

 

[Nicksdad1970]

Ron, The top break one is a Smith & Wesson and I THINK the serial number is : *39158. The * looks like a 9 or a g. It's very hard to tell.

The Colt's serial number is : 67170. It is clear as day. I don't know when the Colt was made but it is in very good condition.

If more pics would be helpful then please tell me where to take the pics. Also if anyone knows I'm curious if either one of them are at all uncommon or just any particulars would be great.

 

[Jim K]

The S&W is the .38 Safety Hammerless (actually concealed hammer) either the 4th or 5th model depending on the serial number. Since the 4th model ran from about 116000 to about 220000, and the 5th from 220000 to c. 261493, the first digit should be either a 1 or a 2.

If it is a 2, and the front sight has no pin, the gun is the 5th model.

The Colt is the Pocket Positive (meaning it has the Colt "positive" hammer block), made in 1914.

Jim

 

[Ron James]

You can measure the barrel of the police positive, from .from inside the cylinder, to the end of the barrel . Made from 1905 to 1947 . Uses the 38 S&W { not 38 Special }. Value , condition is every thing, from 500 in like new , down to 100 in use as a boat anchor. A very well made firearm and a joy to shoot. On the Smith and Wesson, same thing about condition, it's listed at 350 down to 50. If both firearms are in good condition, { if in doubt, have them checked by a gunsmith} there is no reason you can not shoot and enjoy them. The colt by the way was a very popular with the police forces. The nick name of the S&W is Lemon Squeezer because of the grip safety.

 

[metalman3006]

colt

You can check the manufacture date here http://proofhouse.com/

 

[elrod]

Let me point out that the S&W pistol is not a .38 Special. It is chambered in .38 S&W, and ammo will not be available locally, in most cases. I also have a safety hammerless, which was manfactured in the spring of 1911, and left the factory in early March of that year. I buy my ammunition from Midway (link below), and have fired a box or so through the old revolver. Ron is right, please have a gunsmith check both guns before you fire them.

http://www.midwayusa.com/ebrowse.exe/browse?TabID=3&Categoryid=7549&categorystring=653***691***

 

[Jim K]

The Pocket Positive was never made in .38 anything. It was made in .32 Colt (Long and Short) and .32 Colt New Police, which was the Colt name for the .32 S&W. The guns are not marked with the specific cartridge, so it is a matter of trial and error. If the .32 S&W won't fit, the gun is chambered for the smaller .32 Colt. Both .32 Colt cartridges have long been discontinued and AFAIK are not available anywhere.

Jim

 

[Ron James]

Jim, I thought the Pocket Positive was in .32, but the Police Positive is listed as being both 38 S&W and the 38 New Police { I know, the same , one with a flat nose and one with a round nose}. Of course I've been wrong before and will be wrong again.

 

[Jim K]

The Pocket Postitive and the Police Positive are different guns; the former is on a smaller frame. The Pocket Positive, like its predecessor, the New Pocket, was made only in .32.

The term "positive" was used for guns that were made with Colt's "positive" hammer block. It was "positive" in the sense that it was attached to the trigger and not dependent on the action of a direct spring, like the S&W hammer blocks of the time. Today's S&W hammer block is also "positive", being activated by the rebound slide.

Jim

 

[Ron James]

Ahhhh, My problem was, I was reading Police positive when I should have been reading Pocket Positive. A temporary brain freeze; at least I hope it was temporary.:banghead:

 

[Jim K]

Ron, as I get older, those "temporary" brain freezes don't get more frequent, they just get longer and longer.

Jim

 

[Nicksdad1970]

I made one obvious mistake. The S&Wis a 32 as well. Does that help at all? I'm also curious what these 2 should sell for these days. I'm not trying or expecting some crazy price. I'd just like to sell them together.

Any thoughts?

 

[Jim K]

The S&W would sell retail for around $150 or less in that condition, the Colt for about $250. You would get less from a dealer, of course.

Jim

 

[Nicksdad1970]

You're good. I had a dealer offer me $350 for em today. I thought they were worth more but isn't that always the case?