Help with A Legal Alien Purchase/Own/Carry Firearms in Kentucky

Bazoo

Bazoo

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Joined
Apr 21, 2021
Messages
3,445
Location
Cecilia, Ky
I have a friend who is a legal alien, he has a green card (Perminant Resident Card), and is applying for full citizenship. I've done some research and it shows that he CAN purchase, own, and carry a firearm under federal law, and subsequently under Kentucky state law. That said, he's a bit hesitant to just take my word for it. Could anyone here direct us to the appropriate legal documents that verify this?

Thank you to the folks here on THR that dedicate their time and talent to answering the legal questions like this one. I've not asked a lot of legal questions, but I've read a lot, and I appreciate the folks here that contribute.
 
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1. Even Non - Immigrant Foreign Nationals can legally purchase and own firearms as long as they have a valid state - issued hunting license for that state (or other exceptions).

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2. From a practical standpoint, Permanent Residents (colloquially known as Green Card Holders) are treated as U.S. Citizens as far as firearm purchases are concerned.


ALL THAT BEING SAID, in real life - the folks on the other end wouldn’t hesitate to DENY such purchases on the grounds of the purchaser being a foreigner alone - due to ignorance on their part, or simple lack of awareness of their own rules.
 
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Is there any specifics that would prohibit my friend from carrying a firearm? Does anyone know of a page that affirms that he can carry? He's a bit leery of it and I'm sure it'd comfort him to be able to see in writing that he's legal to not only own, but bear/carry.
 
OK a bit of confusion here. You state you have looked it up and he can own/purchase/carry, yet ask where the information is?

Can you cite your claimed sources? I'll presume it's a bit more then heresay, friend said, etc.
Bazoo said:
...full citizenship. I've done some research and it shows that he CAN purchase, own, and carry a firearm under federal law, and subsequently under Kentucky state law. That said, he's...
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Bazoo said:
I have a friend who is a legal alien, he has a green card (Perminant Resident Card), and is applying for full citizenship. I've done some research and it shows that he CAN purchase, own, and carry a firearm under federal law, and subsequently under Kentucky state law. That said, he's a bit hesitant to just take my word for it. Could anyone here direct us to the appropriate legal documents that verify this?

Thank you to the folks here on THR that dedicate their time and talent to answering the legal questions like this one. I've not asked a lot of legal questions, but I've read a lot, and I appreciate the folks here that contribute.
Click to expand...

Being he is here in accordance with the law... I'd think he was good to go. Were he my friend, I'd say go try to buy one. All they can do is say no.
It's not like SWAT is gonna show up to deport him while the dealer in on the phone doing the background check.
If he's really THAT worried, I may start to question is he telling me everything about being here legally.
The government wants new people to come here...
 
Space Ghost said:
Being he is here in accordance with the law... I'd think he was good to go. Were he my friend, I'd say go try to buy one. All they can do is say no.
It's not like SWAT is gonna show up to deport him while the dealer in on the phone doing the background check.
If he's really THAT worried, I may start to question is he telling me everything about being here legally.
The government wants new people to come here...
Click to expand...
He wants to make sure he's on 100% legal footing before he does anything because he doesn't want to risk ruining his chance here.

The government may want new people to come here... but many of the people who are already here do not want new people coming here.
 
Bazoo said:
Thanks for the repies. Thank you @bearcreek !

I found ATF documents saying he's legal to purchase a firearm, but it didn't specifically say "carry" and that concerned him. https://www.atf.gov/firearms/qa/may-aliens-legally-united-states-purchase-firearms
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A lot of people who aren't from the US (and quite a few who are) have a tough time wrapping their mind around the idea that, when it comes to guns and the laws and cultural norms around them, there is a bigger difference between different states in the US than there is between many countries. You should explain to your friend that the ATF has no more jurisdiction over what guns he carries and where he carries them than I do.
 
The Glockodile said:
ALL THAT BEING SAID, in real life - the folks on the other end wouldn’t hesitate to DENY such purchases on the grounds of the purchaser being a foreigner alone - due to ignorance on their part, or simple lack of awareness of their own rules.
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Due to this said issue, the FFLs I‘m familiar with have always recommended getting a Concealed Firearm Permit to circumvent said denials.

Foreign Nationals (non - Immigrants and Permanent Residents) present in the U.S.A. are already 10 times more fingerprinted and biometrically scanned than your average Joe - and due to the nature of their continued legal presence inherently do not have any detractors precluding said permit.

They are “more legally on the up - and - up than your average American when it comes to credentials for firearm ownership.”

The folks assessing applications for Concealed Firearm Permits tend to be of higher quality or competence and understand this - compared to the group that just denies your purchases on a whim, so the likelihood of acquiring said permit is more certain.

There may be some stipulations which may vary from state to state, however - but the way most Concealed Firearm Permit applications are written, it doesn’t appear that the idea of Foreign Nationals applying ever occurred to anyone.

All this from a really interesting talk someone gave at our local gun club, years ago…
 
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The Glockodile said:
Due to this said issue, the FFLs I‘m familiar with have always recommended getting a Concealed Firearm Permit to circumvent said denials.

Foreign Nationals (non - Immigrants and Permanent Residents) present in the U.S.A. are already 10 times more fingerprinted and biometrically scanned than your average Joe - and due to the nature of their continued legal presence inherently do not have any detractors precluding said permit.

There may be some stipulations may vary from state to state, however - but the way most Concealed Firearm Permit applications are written, it doesn’t appear that the idea of Foreign Nationals applying ever occurred to anyone.

All this from a really interesting talk someone gave at our local gun club, years ago…
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Pretty sure he's talking about the FFL declining to sell the gun to the legal alien. Not sure how a permit would be any different than a NICS check in that case......
 
bearcreek said:
Pretty sure he's talking about the FFL declining to sell the gun to the legal alien. Not sure how a permit would be any different than a NICS check in that case......
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Not the FFL, who often wishes to make the sale.

The NICS Form 4473 check frequently fails for Foreign Nationals despte being legally present, despite possessing the necessary exceptions,

The Concealed Firearm Permit bypasses the NICS Form 4473 check in many (or perhaps just some?) states.
 
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The Glockodile said:
Not the FFL, who often wishes to make the sale.

The 4473 check frequently fails for Foreign Nationals despte being legally present, despite possessing the necessary exceptions,

The Concealed Firearm Permit bypasses this step in many states.
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:rofl: I didn't realize you were quoting yourself in that post. My mistake. Yes, getting a permit would make things easier.
 
In this state, with a CCDW permit, you still have to fill out the 4473, but they do not call it in.
 
I've explained to him, in brevity, the gun laws for our state.

I once was a CCDW instructor, and I try to stay up on the matter just for situations like this that arise when someone will ask what is required for them to purchase/carry a firearm. I didn't know what was required for a legal alien, however, and I had to research it myself before I could offer him any sort of answer.
 
Bazoo said:
In this state, with a CCDW permit, you still have to fill out the 4473, but they do not call it in.
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Yes.

The form still gets filled in, which I think is required for your FFL’s records, but doesn’t get rejected on a whim by some fool on the other end.
 
The Glockodile said:
Not the FFL, who often wishes to make the sale.

The NICS Form 4473 check frequently fails for Foreign Nationals despte being legally present, despite possessing the necessary exceptions,

The Concealed Firearm Permit bypasses the NICS Form 4473 check in many (or perhaps just some?) states.
Click to expand...
You are comingling two wholly separate things here.
1. The ATF Form 4473 is completed by everyone, no matter what state you live in, when acquiring a firearm from a licensed dealer.
2. The FBI NICS background check is required by the federal Brady Law. Some states issue a state firearm permit that exempts residents of that state from the FBI NICS check. Not all state firearm permits do this.

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dogtown tom said:
You are comingling two wholly separate things here.
1. The ATF Form 4473 is completed by everyone, no matter what state you live in, when acquiring a firearm from a licensed dealer.
2. The FBI NICS background check is required by the federal Brady Law. Some states issue a state firearm permit that exempts residents of that state from the FBI NICS check. Not all state firearm permits do this.

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Click to expand...

Yes, I did lump them together, it seems.
 
Bazoo said:
He wants to make sure he's on 100% legal footing before he does anything because he doesn't want to risk ruining his chance here.

The government may want new people to come here... but many of the people who are already here do not want new people coming here.
Click to expand...

Not illegally... of course not, (they can **** off just like any American born criminal) but if he did it legal like, (like my folks did) he's cool.
 
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