ccsniper
member
I agree, but if I HAD no other choice I know that inside my house I could use it as a defensive weapon. I think this thread is way off topic anyway and am unsubbing.
Hi-Point Firearms
- Thread starter XxWINxX94
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I agree, but if I HAD no other choice I know that inside my house I could use it as a defensive weapon. I think this thread is way off topic anyway and am unsubbing.
Justin
Moderator Emeritus
Yes, well, thankfully we don't live in a universe where Hi-Point is the only firearms maker.
Mitch from LA
Member
In my humble experience poor accuracy is a function of the shooter rather than the gun. Interesting side note those smiling faces are signaling the decline of Western Civilization, along with MTV.
Well, it appears that the 2nd person to post here was correct in saying that a can of worms was being opened! It really doesn't matter what someone else decides to buy and use. I get a lot more satisfaction shooting what I want as opposed to ranting on blogs. Maybe that actually validates some people? Heard a pretty cool song recently on the Margaritaville station about a guy who was kick butt on the internet and pretty much of a wimp in reality. Evidently he follows this thread
I can promise you my post count will never, ever come close to my round count.
Justin
Moderator Emeritus
Out of sheer curiosity, to whom are you referring?
stchman
Member
I have never shot a Hi-Point pistol. Ihave heard many negative things about them so I would probably stay away from them unless you get the pistol for say $50.
I think Hi-Point 9mm pistols are around $160.
For $300 you can get a Ruger P95 (blued version) and they have rock solid reputations. The stainless P95 is $320 over at Bud's Gun Shop.
IMO spend a few extra $$$$ and get something with a reliable reputation. You don't need to spend $600 or more to get that. Heck I have even seen police turn in Glocks for about $350 at Cabela's.
I think Hi-Point 9mm pistols are around $160.
For $300 you can get a Ruger P95 (blued version) and they have rock solid reputations. The stainless P95 is $320 over at Bud's Gun Shop.
IMO spend a few extra $$$$ and get something with a reliable reputation. You don't need to spend $600 or more to get that. Heck I have even seen police turn in Glocks for about $350 at Cabela's.
wgaynor
Member
I think that there are too many people here that just like to argue.
I really don't care if people like it or not. I LIKE IT. That's enough for me. I don't need other's opinions or antidotes. My personal experience is enough for me. Keep on hating on the gun. The only thing you'll do is drive down the prices and keep them cheap for me to buy.
I really don't care if people like it or not. I LIKE IT. That's enough for me. I don't need other's opinions or antidotes. My personal experience is enough for me. Keep on hating on the gun. The only thing you'll do is drive down the prices and keep them cheap for me to buy.
Col. Plink
Member
- Joined
- Apr 21, 2009
- Messages
- 1,775
I got a HiPoint 40 pistol because I liked the carbine so much. It seems to be plenty accurate and no problems as long as I rack the slide completely. The finish makes that a little hard to do, other than that I have no complaints for it. For the record I have lots of experience with XD's and CZ-52's.
The carbine is beyond reproach, even with no consideration of price.
Get one; find out how much fun you've been missing.
The carbine is beyond reproach, even with no consideration of price.
Get one; find out how much fun you've been missing.
Lou McGopher
Member
- Joined
- Mar 18, 2009
- Messages
- 507
By now, you should have gathered they are ugly. Even people who love them will readily admit that. They are heavy for their size.
But they are as reliable as any other pistol, and their accuracy is respectable.
Some people may tell you to save up and get something else... and that's fine, if you can do that. But if your gun budget is tight and $200-300 (or less) is all you can afford, there's no reason to feel bad about getting a Hi-Point.
But they are as reliable as any other pistol, and their accuracy is respectable.
Some people may tell you to save up and get something else... and that's fine, if you can do that. But if your gun budget is tight and $200-300 (or less) is all you can afford, there's no reason to feel bad about getting a Hi-Point.
evan price
Member
I admire your industrious and thrifty ways.
Unfortunately, there are quite a few people who do not have the ability.
I know of several folks who can barely afford to replace a flat tire on their only vehicle and drive on the donut spare instead for weeks while they scrape up $25 to visit the used tire store. Try supporting a family on $8 an hour and see how much money is left over to buy a gun.
As a matter of fact, I have helped co-workers out. I jst tonight dropped off extra used tires I had to two different co-workers who needed some and couldn't afford any.
You speak of "less than $400" or "less than $300" as if that sort of money is easily found by getting the loose change from under the couch cushions. Try to think of "less than $100" and imagine finding something to fit THAT budget that's not a Ring of Fire gun.
A friend of mine wound up with a PA64 because it was cheap, bought used, the seller threw in a mag worth of rusty ammo. He couldn't afford more ammo so I gave him a box of 9x18 to get him by.
I'm sorry I can't protect my family now- I have to recycle pop cans for another 9 months to be allowed to purchase a worthy firearm.
Or, buy the High Point now, save a year, and trade off the High Point and some more cash for something better.
See above- there's a large difference in a $120 High Point and a good used $350 police-trade Glock.
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ArfinGreebly
Moderator Emeritus
Mixed Review
My son owns a Hi Point C-9 pistol.
I gave it to him to get him started in firearms.
He shoots with an unorthodox style, but he hits those things at which he shoots. Coke bottles out to 40 feet. One handed. One particular afternoon, we took his pistol and three of mine out to the range, and he out-shot me using his C-9 while I used the XD-40 and a PT911 in 9mm. I didn't beat him until I switched to the Ruger Mk2 pistol. I tried his C-9 and found I could hit coke bottles out to 30 feet. His pistol has had no failures.
Now, all of that having been said . . .
I won't buy another one, given any choice in the matter.
I bought my wife a PT111 Pro, a smaller, lighter pistol with more capacity, a locked breech action, and a self resetting DA trigger. It's cleaner, has a better fit and finish, is completely reliable, and I shoot it better. No, it's not as cheap as the C-9, but the extra $150 was certainly well spent.
The PT911 cost another couple hundred bucks, but has 50% more capacity than the C-9, a better trigger, better balance, in a package about the same size and weight. It will reliably punch a 2-inch hole at 30 feet.
And then there's the little Kahr P9. Holy cow. It cost more than our other 9mm pistols, just about the same as the XD-40 but, despite the light weight, short sight radius, and small grip, I shoot this pistol better than all the other service caliber pistols I have. That runs completely counter to what I would have thought. Light pistols are supposed to have more "felt recoil" but that's not how it works out with the P9.
Could I defend myself with a C-9? Yeah, I could do that. Wouldn't be my first choice, but yeah.
Could I carry one? Pretty much not. That pistol was never designed for CCW. I met a guy carrying one in a shoulder rig. Amusing, and not awfully practical.
The more I come in contact with quality, the less inclined I am to "save money" on things like the C-9.
I'll wait the extra weeks or months while my piggy bank fattens.
Maybe some day I'll buy a case of C-9s just to keep around in case I have to arm the neighbors. Hey, you never know when someone will declare Armageddon.
For myself, though, I'll spend the extra cash. Mr. Piggy Bank and I want to see how the CZ 75B stacks up.
My son owns a Hi Point C-9 pistol.
I gave it to him to get him started in firearms.
He shoots with an unorthodox style, but he hits those things at which he shoots. Coke bottles out to 40 feet. One handed. One particular afternoon, we took his pistol and three of mine out to the range, and he out-shot me using his C-9 while I used the XD-40 and a PT911 in 9mm. I didn't beat him until I switched to the Ruger Mk2 pistol. I tried his C-9 and found I could hit coke bottles out to 30 feet. His pistol has had no failures.
Now, all of that having been said . . .
I won't buy another one, given any choice in the matter.
I bought my wife a PT111 Pro, a smaller, lighter pistol with more capacity, a locked breech action, and a self resetting DA trigger. It's cleaner, has a better fit and finish, is completely reliable, and I shoot it better. No, it's not as cheap as the C-9, but the extra $150 was certainly well spent.
The PT911 cost another couple hundred bucks, but has 50% more capacity than the C-9, a better trigger, better balance, in a package about the same size and weight. It will reliably punch a 2-inch hole at 30 feet.
And then there's the little Kahr P9. Holy cow. It cost more than our other 9mm pistols, just about the same as the XD-40 but, despite the light weight, short sight radius, and small grip, I shoot this pistol better than all the other service caliber pistols I have. That runs completely counter to what I would have thought. Light pistols are supposed to have more "felt recoil" but that's not how it works out with the P9.
Could I defend myself with a C-9? Yeah, I could do that. Wouldn't be my first choice, but yeah.
Could I carry one? Pretty much not. That pistol was never designed for CCW. I met a guy carrying one in a shoulder rig. Amusing, and not awfully practical.
The more I come in contact with quality, the less inclined I am to "save money" on things like the C-9.
I'll wait the extra weeks or months while my piggy bank fattens.
Maybe some day I'll buy a case of C-9s just to keep around in case I have to arm the neighbors. Hey, you never know when someone will declare Armageddon.
For myself, though, I'll spend the extra cash. Mr. Piggy Bank and I want to see how the CZ 75B stacks up.
dpetty121263
Member
- Joined
- May 28, 2009
- Messages
- 7
I have 4 Hi-Point's plus a number of top of the line named pistols (Ruger and S&W) and they are just as accurate as the higher priced ones. All this negitive talk about them is from folks who couldn't hit the broad side of a barn with any weapon. Quick story a while back at the range a man just down from me was shooting a 9mm Hi Point and was griping he couldn't hit the target and was going to throw it away, he spoke loud enough for me to hear and I offered him $100 for the gun and of course he jumped on it, we did the transaction and while standing there I put 4 out of 6 near the bullseye, he was pissed. BTW I did my CCW class with a Hi Point 9mm and scored well.
Any time you'd like to come shoot the Tactical Rifle Match at Pueblo West or an IPSC match at Whistling Pines I'd be happy to show you just how much of that barn I can really hit. I may not be a Grand Master but I can hit what I am aiming at from here to 400y irons or optics.
Justin
Moderator Emeritus
That's a mighty big assumption to be making there.
wgaynor
Member
"All this negitive (sic) talk about them is from folks who couldn't hit the broad side of a barn with any weapon."
While that may be a mighty big assumption, it is based upon the same amount of facts that many have posted their anti-hi-point comments.
Hi-Points are affordable weapons. You load the magazine, chamber a round, and pull the trigger. It works. If you have problems, do what you would with any other firearm...ask around about how to fix it and do it.
While it may not be in the same category as some top end and top dollar weapons, it still functions and is a tool that was made for a specific purpose. If it didn't function properly and was as poorly constructed as many of you have stated, the free market principals would have either caused them to go out of business or ask for a bailout many years ago.
While that may be a mighty big assumption, it is based upon the same amount of facts that many have posted their anti-hi-point comments.
Hi-Points are affordable weapons. You load the magazine, chamber a round, and pull the trigger. It works. If you have problems, do what you would with any other firearm...ask around about how to fix it and do it.
While it may not be in the same category as some top end and top dollar weapons, it still functions and is a tool that was made for a specific purpose. If it didn't function properly and was as poorly constructed as many of you have stated, the free market principals would have either caused them to go out of business or ask for a bailout many years ago.
John Wayne
Member
- Joined
- Dec 11, 2007
- Messages
- 1,133
If your budget actually required you to settle for something as cheap as a Hi-Point, I can't think of any other option in the price range that works as well.
Yes, Ruger P-series are $300, ComBloc guns are $200, but that's still $60-$160 more than a Hi-Point pistol. If you make $5.15 an hour and are self sufficient (i.e., not making $5.15 an hour and living with your parents), that $60 can easily mean the difference between not being able to afford a gun and being able to arm yourself. Not everyone has the time to hunt out a great deal on a used gun, sometimes you have to go with what's available.
The only thing I can think of that's cheaper than a HI Point and readily available is a Nagant revolver--but even then the cost evens out once you factor in the cost of a $35 box of ammo.
Are Hi Point pistols the best choice for every application? No.
Do they all work flawlessly? Probably not.
If you can afford a more refined gun, should you get that instead? Yes.
Here's what it really comes down to: if you only have $150 for a gun and box of ammo, are you better off not having a gun, or having a Hi Point? Even if it only works for three shots, it's better than nothing.
Yes, Ruger P-series are $300, ComBloc guns are $200, but that's still $60-$160 more than a Hi-Point pistol. If you make $5.15 an hour and are self sufficient (i.e., not making $5.15 an hour and living with your parents), that $60 can easily mean the difference between not being able to afford a gun and being able to arm yourself. Not everyone has the time to hunt out a great deal on a used gun, sometimes you have to go with what's available.
The only thing I can think of that's cheaper than a HI Point and readily available is a Nagant revolver--but even then the cost evens out once you factor in the cost of a $35 box of ammo.
Are Hi Point pistols the best choice for every application? No.
Do they all work flawlessly? Probably not.
If you can afford a more refined gun, should you get that instead? Yes.
Here's what it really comes down to: if you only have $150 for a gun and box of ammo, are you better off not having a gun, or having a Hi Point? Even if it only works for three shots, it's better than nothing.
Rail Driver
Member
For what it's worth, my first handgun was a used hi-point c9. It was heavy, bulky, and ugly... but it went bang every time. I never had a ftf or fte. It ate WWB and Blazer with equal ferocity. Recoil was minimal.
I eventually traded it off for a PA-63 (9x18) but it treated me well while it was mine, and I doubt it's failed yet or will any time soon.
I eventually traded it off for a PA-63 (9x18) but it treated me well while it was mine, and I doubt it's failed yet or will any time soon.
Few points for the moderator
For some people working on a minimum wage with a family fo feed squirreling away an extra $100-150 it is indeed a problem...just a dose of reality here...
Yes, if you want to carry your pistol, I would definitely get a Makarov over a Hi-Point (Eastern Europe surplus pistols are the only hadguns matching HP price point...nowadays, around here even beaten up S&W revolvers are starting to command prices well north of $300) but with a HP you get a brand new firearm with warranty.....but if you take the used HP route, then nothing can match the price (not unusual for used Hi-Point to be sold for $50)
The Hi-Points I saw at the range were capable to shoot (even in my hands) way tighter groups than basketball size at well over 30 feet.....
By the same logic, many people rave about Kimber CS (and customers are ok the they are told that after 300 rounds their pistol still need to "break in")...so what's your point??
On the customer service aspect, I would take a Hi-Point any time over an EAA product....
Yes the slide is made of Zamak, however did you ever see the size of that thing?? What about the weight?? You can seriously use them as flatorion to press your clothes.
They seems quite capable of handling the pressure of the cartridges they fire and they are explicitly +P rated (even some high price manufacturers do not go that far).
They are cheap because of their primitive trigger and safety system, basic blowback design, cheap materials for slide and frame and basically non-existing finishing.
They are incredibly unbalanced and, basically, impossible to carry. Saying that they are ugly it is an huge understatement.
Do I own one?? Definitely not....Would I buy one even as fun piece?? Not a chance....but they do work and they go bang every time you squeeze the trigger...they are not for an individual even remotely interested in guns...but they are good as a nightstand firearm for a cash strapped family on a very tight budget living in a rough neighbourhood...in that regard they work as well as any Les Baer...
Kudos to Hi-Point for making reliable, albeit primitive, firearms backed by probably the best warranty and CS in the industry, where previous attempts (Lorcin, Jennings, Jimenez, Cobra, etc...) produced only unreliable pure junk backed by "you are on your own" customer service.
For some people working on a minimum wage with a family fo feed squirreling away an extra $100-150 it is indeed a problem...just a dose of reality here...
Yes, if you want to carry your pistol, I would definitely get a Makarov over a Hi-Point (Eastern Europe surplus pistols are the only hadguns matching HP price point...nowadays, around here even beaten up S&W revolvers are starting to command prices well north of $300) but with a HP you get a brand new firearm with warranty.....but if you take the used HP route, then nothing can match the price (not unusual for used Hi-Point to be sold for $50)
The Hi-Points I saw at the range were capable to shoot (even in my hands
) way tighter groups than basketball size at well over 30 feet.....By the same logic, many people rave about Kimber CS (and customers are ok the they are told that after 300 rounds their pistol still need to "break in")...so what's your point??
On the customer service aspect, I would take a Hi-Point any time over an EAA product....
Yes the slide is made of Zamak, however did you ever see the size of that thing?? What about the weight?? You can seriously use them as flatorion to press your clothes.
They seems quite capable of handling the pressure of the cartridges they fire and they are explicitly +P rated (even some high price manufacturers do not go that far).
They are cheap because of their primitive trigger and safety system, basic blowback design, cheap materials for slide and frame and basically non-existing finishing.
They are incredibly unbalanced and, basically, impossible to carry. Saying that they are ugly it is an huge understatement.
Do I own one?? Definitely not....Would I buy one even as fun piece?? Not a chance....but they do work and they go bang every time you squeeze the trigger...they are not for an individual even remotely interested in guns...but they are good as a nightstand firearm for a cash strapped family on a very tight budget living in a rough neighbourhood...in that regard they work as well as any Les Baer...
Kudos to Hi-Point for making reliable, albeit primitive, firearms backed by probably the best warranty and CS in the industry, where previous attempts (Lorcin, Jennings, Jimenez, Cobra, etc...) produced only unreliable pure junk backed by "you are on your own" customer service.
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A former coworker of mine picked up a used c9 for $60. Last weekend I took him out to the range and showed him a number of firearms, as well as making sure he knew how to keep his shots on target with the C9.
At 10y, his group (first time shooter) was around six inches. My group with the same gun at 10y was two inches.
The rear sight is fully adjustable for windage and elevation, which I dislike in a defensive pistol but understand. Looser tolerances means you can just make the sight adjustable and let the user correct as necessary. In a hundred and fifty rounds, we had no jams nor failures to fire of any kind.
The firearm *did* noticably snap more than I'd expect from a 9mm pistol, probably due to the direct blowback design and extra weight in the slide. I can't imagine the .45 pistol would be any fun to shoot.
Honestly, they're not bad pistols. They're not pretty, but for a first-time shooter I'd recommend one above a tokarev simply because cleaning is simplified and you can find ammo anywhere. The lifetime no-questions-asked warrantee is also a heck of a value. There are certainly better pistols out there, and any 'gun person' will spend the extra money on a better-made pistol, but the high point has its niche and is perfectly adequate to fill it.
For home defense values though, it's hard to beat the 12ga pump gun. You can get a cheap new (or well-made used) one for under $200. I tried to sell my friend on one, but he's happy with his high point.
At 10y, his group (first time shooter) was around six inches. My group with the same gun at 10y was two inches.
The rear sight is fully adjustable for windage and elevation, which I dislike in a defensive pistol but understand. Looser tolerances means you can just make the sight adjustable and let the user correct as necessary. In a hundred and fifty rounds, we had no jams nor failures to fire of any kind.
The firearm *did* noticably snap more than I'd expect from a 9mm pistol, probably due to the direct blowback design and extra weight in the slide. I can't imagine the .45 pistol would be any fun to shoot.
Honestly, they're not bad pistols. They're not pretty, but for a first-time shooter I'd recommend one above a tokarev simply because cleaning is simplified and you can find ammo anywhere. The lifetime no-questions-asked warrantee is also a heck of a value. There are certainly better pistols out there, and any 'gun person' will spend the extra money on a better-made pistol, but the high point has its niche and is perfectly adequate to fill it.
For home defense values though, it's hard to beat the 12ga pump gun. You can get a cheap new (or well-made used) one for under $200. I tried to sell my friend on one, but he's happy with his high point.
If you've never shot one, please let us know. It goes to your credibility, in this thread and others, that you would categorically comment without first hand knowledge.
Here's what some impartial people have actually shot them had to say:
http://www.shootingtimes.com/handgun_reviews/hipoint_100605/
http://www.mouseguns.com/hipoint/myhpc9.htm
http://www.themartialist.com/0604/hipoint.htm
http://www.gunblast.com/HiPoint-9mmCarbine.htm
Personally, I really like my carbine and wouldn't hesitate to buy the 9mm pistol if I needed one.
Here's what some impartial people have actually shot them had to say:
http://www.shootingtimes.com/handgun_reviews/hipoint_100605/
http://www.mouseguns.com/hipoint/myhpc9.htm
http://www.themartialist.com/0604/hipoint.htm
http://www.gunblast.com/HiPoint-9mmCarbine.htm
Personally, I really like my carbine and wouldn't hesitate to buy the 9mm pistol if I needed one.
Ok everyone pay attention:
IF YOU HAVE TO DEFEND YOUR SELF AND THIS IS ALL YOU CAN AFFORD THEN BUY ONE, AS SOMETHING IS BETTER THAN NOTHING.
I live on a very limited budget, and am in fact behind on a few bills, but I would never buy a Hi- Point. If you love your Hi-Point then that is awesome. A person should love their firearms or what is the point of having them? However, please do not try and tell me that it is anywhere near as good as a S&W M&P. Yes, they are built like tanks because it takes a lot of pot metal to stand up to the operating pressures of a centerfire cartridge.
I am not trying to deride High Point owners at all. And again if a Hi-Point is all you can afford then, buy it, learn to use it and become proficient with it. A Hi-Point is a cheaply made firearm that may go bang every time. It does that job well. If that is all you need or want then you will never be disappointed. I want more. We can agree to disagree.
IF YOU HAVE TO DEFEND YOUR SELF AND THIS IS ALL YOU CAN AFFORD THEN BUY ONE, AS SOMETHING IS BETTER THAN NOTHING.
I live on a very limited budget, and am in fact behind on a few bills, but I would never buy a Hi- Point. If you love your Hi-Point then that is awesome. A person should love their firearms or what is the point of having them? However, please do not try and tell me that it is anywhere near as good as a S&W M&P. Yes, they are built like tanks because it takes a lot of pot metal to stand up to the operating pressures of a centerfire cartridge.
I am not trying to deride High Point owners at all. And again if a Hi-Point is all you can afford then, buy it, learn to use it and become proficient with it. A Hi-Point is a cheaply made firearm that may go bang every time. It does that job well. If that is all you need or want then you will never be disappointed. I want more. We can agree to disagree.
Justin
Moderator Emeritus
This is exactly what I mean when pointing out that Hi-Points use a sub-optimal operating system for the cartridges they're chambered in. By using a straight blow-back method of operation, the gun is required to have a ridiculously outsized and overly-heavy slide to keep the thing from catastrophically failing.
In other words, compared to other defensive handguns, Hi-Points are inferior in every way but price.
One of the only advantages that handguns have over long guns is that they're much easier to carry or conceal. A handgun that is so ungainly it's difficult to carry has a reduced level of utility to the end user.
In this day and age, praising a gun for "going bang every time you pull the trigger" is the equivalent of raving about how awesome your car is because it comes with an electric starter.
Ok, if you make minimum wage, have a family to take care of, and live in a crime-ridden neighborhood a Hi-Point may very well be a reasonable choice. Of course, if you shop around, you could just get a pump-action 12 gauge, which will be a much better home defense choice, defensive ammunition far more powerful than pistol ammo is available at much less of a cost, and shotguns are much easier to use for people who may not have the resources to effectively employ a handgun in a defensive encounter.
I can't really argue with that, I suppose.
Nobody said that.
If I have to choose between:
1) paying my bills and with whatever left, withotu any debt, buying an Hi-Point because ti is all i can afford and
2) Not paying my bills and buying a SIG (possibly on debt)
I would choose option 1 any time of the day...
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