Hollow base bullets and air space in a black powder breech loader

[whughett]

I’m trying to establish a load for an old Burnside Carbine breech loader. To date I’ve been using roundballs. But I don’t think they are an authentic load for this weapon.
I have a box of bullets that came with the gun. Hollow base conicals of the correct diameter
It would be difficult if not impossible to load the cone shaped case with powder and insure it also filled the hollow cavity in the bullet.
Airspace myth or fact. Most of what J can find seems to deal with hollow base in a muzzle loader. Several on several forums think it’s a myth. What do HighRoaders think.

I just shot 10 rounds with these bullets that I had filled the cavity with bees wax. Accuracy off hand was ok. But only at 25 yards.
Photo. One of the cavity plugs can be seen in the lower left of the photo.

 

[Slamfire]

I shot my musket with Minie balls. The Minie has a very deep cavity and I filled that cavity with a mix of crisco and beeswax. Blackpowder muzzle loaders can never have enough lubricant! I never noticed any issues, so I would not worry about it. Just fill the cavities with a good lubricant.

Rapine used to make a tool, which I have, which fills the cavity of conicals with lubricant. I filled a pan with melted, semi solid lubricant and filled the base. Once the lubricant cooled down, it was harder, a little softer than candle wax. I followed the advice of Mr Rapine and used a 50/50 mix of crisco and beeswax. Adding beeswax to the mix in warm weather to keep it solid.

What has surprised me, was I read a book which claims that Civil War musket balls/minies were not lubed. I guess the grease attracted dirt. I think I could run 40 shots before ramming got stiff, Civil War soldiers must have had issues much sooner.

It takes work, getting the bullet diameter to match the bore size, then the lube, and the best powder charge, but once you have all that, those Civil War weapons will surprise you with their accuracy.





One hundred yards off hand against a 12 inch plate. I would have filled my tag that day.

 

[J-Bar]

My opinion for what it’s worth; that small air cavity in the bullet base is insignificant. If any of the bullet base contacts the powder, lubed cavity or not, I would shoot it. You can bring your gun and ammunition to me and I will be happy to test it for you.

 

[whughett]

My opinion for what it’s worth; that small air cavity in the bullet base is insignificant. If any of the bullet base contacts the powder, lubed cavity or not, I would shoot it. You can bring your gun and ammunition to me and I will be happy to test it for you.

The piece is is 157 years old. I just would not want to be the schmuck that ringed the barrel. Although looking at the breech of this it’s pretty thick steel or what ever passed for steel in1864. Thanks for the candid reply.

 

[dave951]

As a certified Instructor I'll say this- it depends. You don't want a huge space in there but some isn't a problem. The issue is that many loads like a little compression, others not so much. Case in point, I shoot a 63 Sharps in competition. There is a huge air space in the breechblock which, if the air space was a thing, should make it a bomb. Now my patch round ball gun shoots best with a touch of compression and no air space. My competition muskets have air space from the minie base.

Now for the minie- it was NEVER designed to have the base filled. Some have tried it with varying degrees of success but in every case, ordnance depts reverted to empty bases. IF you use the right lube and powder in balance, you can run that gun until you run out of ammo, shoulder or daylight. During a session working with kids, to prove the point, we ran one "Zouave" for over 60 rounds straight without wiping and accuracy was still there at the end as the last kid cut the chains holding up the gong with that rifle. So I'm a competition shooter and I don't fill the base or worry about a little air space. But what do I know-

 

[whughett]

Seems to re-enforce what I’ve seen on other forums. Thanks for the input. Appreciate it.

 

[whughett]

Range today with the Burnside Carbine and hollow base bullets. Happy to say nothing bad happened to the rifle. Ten shots with 40 grains + of Goex 2F, that’s a Lee 2.8 CC dipper. 50 yards. Bottom shot first, top shot last, 10 shots from bench. Not good but maybe as good as I’m going to get with a 157 year old rifle, battle sights and 80 year old eyes.
All for naught though as I’ve only 27of these bullets left, they came with the rifle and the originator seems to be gone. Monday I’ll shoot 10 at 100 yards and save the rest for another day.
.562 round balls work also thought and I have that mold.

 

[.38 Special]

A few months ago, Muzzle Blasts - the NMLRA magazine - ran an article wherein they tried to damage barrels with short started loads. They couldn't do it, no matter how extreme the scenario. I strongly doubt that a hollow base bullet presents any particular hazards to the blackpowder shooter.

 

[Mizar]

Deleted as irrelevant.