Hot loads for .32 H&R Magnum

[jski]

I just got a .327 LCR and am focusing on the .32 H&R as the Goldilocks .32 cartridge. Consequently, I’m looking for the best recipe for hot .32 H&R loads.

To that end, I’ve been focusing on True Blue as a powder because of it relatively fast burn rate. Looking at the reload data from RamShot there’s data for .327 loads but none for the .32 H&R.

I tried starting with 7.8 gr of True Blue which is a minimum load for the .327. That was too hot. It required a cleaning rod to remove the cases from the cylinder. But velocities were excellent: ~1300 FPS with 85 gr XTP bullets.

Anyone with experience with hot .32 H&R loads? But not as hot as a 327!

 

[GeoDudeFlorida]

My hot snubby load with the 85gr XTP is with Red Dot. In my experience the faster powders work best with the .32Mag, especially in a snubby. I have some Autocomp I picked up just for my wife’s Taurus .32 in the hopes it will perform as designed and help keep muzzle flip under control. The Taurus is ported. Autocomp is slower than True Blue so I’m a little dubious but there are some articles about it that say it’s worth experimenting.
Look up the Handloaders magazine articles in Pet Loads. I’m thinking Brian Pearce’s hottest loads are about what you’re looking for. I don’t have them saved on my phone and am not near a computer but I’m sure some Google foo will turn them up.

 

[AJC1]

I just got a .327 LCR and am focusing on the .32 H&R as the Goldilocks .32 cartridge. Consequently, I’m looking for the best recipe for hot .32 H&R loads.

To that end, I’ve been focusing on True Blue as a powder because of it relatively fast burn rate. Looking at the reload data from RamShot there’s data for .327 loads but none for the .32 H&R.

I tried starting with 7.8 gr of True Blue which is a minimum load for the .327. That was too hot. It required a cleaning rod to remove the cases from the cylinder. But velocities were excellent: ~1300 FPS with 85 gr XTP bullets.

Anyone with experience with hot .32 H&R loads? But not as hot as a 327!

I have found ramshots load data rather warm for true blue in 357 mag. I'm a fan of full power loads and there 8.8 start load is plenty, and we'll accurate. I don't know if they did the same in 327 but I was done at the start load.

 

[Steve51]

My favorite hot load for .32 H & R Magnum is the Hornady 85 Gr. XTP over 4.4 grains of Unique.

 

[GooseGestapo]

Brian Pierce had an excellent article in one of the magazines.
I’ll post you a link to Handloader Magazine.

I’ve only shot a limited amount of “Warm” loads in the .32mag. Most of my efforts have been .32Long safe loads, or full out .327Mag loads.

In the .32mag, my Taurus Mod76 loves the 100gr Hornady XTP over 11.2gr of Hodgdons Lil’Gun. Cases just fall out. Velocity is 1,300fps!
Another is Hod. LongShot. 4.5gr under either a 123gr Lee FNGC or a Lyman 122gr FNSWC GC [email protected]” are “enough”. For most any use...
Velocities run 1,050-1,150fps. Definitely serious loads.

https://www.handloadermagazine.com/32-h-r-magnum-pet-loads

I saved this link to my book marks!

 

[Walkalong]

I just got a .327 LCR and am focusing on the .32 H&R as the Goldilocks .32 cartridge. Consequently, I’m looking for the best recipe for hot .32 H&R loads.

To that end, I’ve been focusing on True Blue as a powder because of it relatively fast burn rate. Looking at the reload data from RamShot there’s data for .327 loads but none for the .32 H&R.

I tried starting with 7.8 gr of True Blue which is a minimum load for the .327. That was too hot. It required a cleaning rod to remove the cases from the cylinder. But velocities were excellent: ~1300 FPS with 85 gr XTP bullets.

Anyone with experience with hot .32 H&R loads? But not as hot as a 327!

You need to get some .327 Fed cases if you want to run .327 Pressures. You're asking for problems overloading .32 mag, or any other caliber.

 

[jski]

You need to get some .327 Fed cases if you want to run .327 Pressures. You're asking for problems overloading .32 mag, or any other caliber.

I’m not trying to duplicate .327 pressure levels, that would defeat my purpose. But there’s a lot of potential in the 32 H&R that was never realized in factory loads. A lot was left on the cutting-room floor.

I wrote to Starline’s ballistician asking about their .32 H&R brass and he let me know that the case is capable “well beyond SAAMI specs”. I asked if their .32 H&R brass was simply shorter .327 brass? He responded saying he didn’t want to go that far.

 

[jski]

Oh yeah, the reason I focused on the .32 H&R Magnum as the Goldilocks cartridge for snubbies:

 

[Mr_Flintstone]

What are your goals here? Do you plan to stay within SAAMI or CIP specs for 32 H&R Magnum, or try to create a 32 H&R +P that exceeds SAAMI or CIP pressures by some predefined amount or percentage?

 

[CoalCrackerAl]

Is 32 H&R brass the same as 32 H&R mag?

 

[jski]

What are your goals here? Do you plan to stay within SAAMI or CIP specs for 32 H&R Magnum, or try to create a 32 H&R +P that exceeds SAAMI or CIP pressures by some predefined amount or percentage?

Exactly, the former! All the articles I could find about .32 H&R loads start with something like: “there’s a lot of unrealized potential in this cartridge…”

I want a .32 H&R +P.

 

[GeoDudeFlorida]

Is 32 H&R brass the same as 32 H&R mag?

Technically, no. The .32H&R was a 19th Century black powder cartridge which came after the .32S&W and predates the .32S&W Long. However, since that cartridge did not survive the smokeless era, the common vernacular has dismissed it and the H&R magnum has become the only known H&R .32.

 

[GeoDudeFlorida]

I’m not trying to duplicate .327 pressure levels, that would defeat my purpose. But there’s a lot of potential in the 32 H&R that was never realized in factory loads. A lot was left on the cutting-room floor.

I wrote to Starline’s ballistician asking about their .32 H&R brass and he let me know that the case is capable “well beyond SAAMI specs”. I asked if their .32 H&R brass was simply shorter .327 brass? He responded saying he didn’t want to go that far.

The brass lends no strength to the revolver cylinder/chambers. The brass is just the method of sealing the chamber. The chamber is what contains the force of the pressure/expansion. So quoting the brass maker’s opinions is a total red herring. The chamber pressure is the issue. Since you are using a chamber intended for a larger pressure curve you are likely not going to over pressure the gun. Just use good sense and don’t forget that the bullet you’re using was designed to be effective at much lower velocity than you’re seeking. Always remember to stay inside the design parameters of ALL of your components.

 

[Mr_Flintstone]

OK. I got what you’re wanting to do now. Kinda like making a 38-44 or 38 Special +P+ to shoot out of a .357 Magnum. The difference here is that .38 special has a fairly cavernous case compared to that of the .32 H&R Magnum, and while you can do the same thing, small changes in powder charge will add up much quicker inside the .32 H&R case than inside 38 Special cases. Sometimes even varying the seating depth on these smaller cases can mean a couple thousand psi.

If I were going to attempt super charging the 32 magnum, I would start with a maximum charge listed in a manual and work up slowly from there, but not go so far as a starting load for .327 Federal Magnum because that pressure will build up fast, as you have found out, and you don’t want to blow up your revolver or parts of your body. Computer modeling on something like Gordon’s Reloading Tool or Quickload will give you a decent idea of the pressure and velocity results from changing book values, but they aren’t 100% accurate either. Chronograph measurements are another tool in completing the task, but they don’t give pressure measurements either, only an idea based on velocity.

Whatever you do, be careful and work up slowly.

 

[P Flados]

I have a Ruger 4.2" SP-101 in 327 Fed.

I like loads that are close to the 32 H&R mag power. Some are just a tad bit more powerful.

The biggest reasons most people do not like full power 327 loads is typically muzzle blast and/or recoil.

However, if you want a capable load but do not want to load full power 327s, you are better off sticking with 327 brass. And it is not about brass strength. When I know it is safe (such as firing 32 H&R load in a 327 gun), I will go over SAAMI ratings "for testing". However, this testing is done carefully and all ammo is fired or disassembled promptly. I have been around long enough to figure out that routine use of any common ammo loaded at more than SAAMI ratings is asking for trouble. People drop loaded ammo at public ranges. I loose track of things. There are guns out there that can cause serious injuries with ammo loaded above ratings.

All of my "mid range" loads are loaded in 327 brass. I can use a faster powder to get velocities close to or just above 32 H&R mag power, with pressures that are half way between the SAAMI ratings for the two cartridges. For a given muzzle velocity, using a faster powder uses less powder, reduces recoil, and it reduces muzzle blast. Looking at it another way, for a given muzzle blast, a faster powder will give you more velocity.

I have a burn rate chart with Ramshot True Blue shown as just a little slower than Green Dot. This actually sounds pretty good. With 7.8 gr of True Blue and a 100 gr cast bullet seated 0.315" deep in a 327 case, Quickload predicts a pressure of 36 ksi. This is pretty warm. With a heavier bullet, a bullet seated deeper, or with a case having less capacity than Quickload assumes, pressures would be higher. If you wanted a more precise recommendation, it would helped if you would have given bullet weight, seating depth (or AOL and bullet length) and barrel length.

As far as articles talking about "more potential" in the 32 H7R mag, they are really saying that the 32 H&R should have been rated higher than it was. I agree. However, the gun maker that pushed for the round wanted to keep using "cheap" materials. If they had been willing to upgrade their materials just a little, a rating of 30 ksi to 35 ksi would have been possible. At 35 ksi, I feel it would have been "good enough" such that the 327 (which is rated "too high") would have been unlikely to have been put on the street.

 

[jski]

The brass lends no strength to the revolver cylinder/chambers. The brass is just the method of sealing the chamber. The chamber is what contains the force of the pressure/expansion. So quoting the brass maker’s opinions is a total red herring. The chamber pressure is the issue. Since you are using a chamber intended for a larger pressure curve you are likely not going to over pressure the gun.

I’m afraid that’s not true. The case wall and the case webbing for magnum cartridges are significantly thicker and hardened using a different process. Compare the case of a .45 Colt to that of a .454 Casull.

 

[jski]

All of my "mid range" loads are loaded in 327 brass. I can use a faster powder to get velocities close to or just above 32 H&R mag power, with pressures that are half way between the SAAMI ratings for the two cartridges. For a given muzzle velocity, using a faster powder uses less powder, reduces recoil, and it reduces muzzle blast. Looking at it another way, for a given muzzle blast, a faster powder will give you more velocity.

Exactly why I'm focusing on True Blue. First I tried 11 gr of H110 and got very satisfactory results but for a pistol powder, it's a slow burner. Also, True Blue meters very well!

If you wanted a more precise recommendation, it would helped if you would have given bullet weight, seating depth (or AOL and bullet length) and barrel length.

I did in my original post: Ruger 327 LCR, 85 gr Hornady XTP bullets, Starline brass.

As far as articles talking about "more potential" in the 32 H7R mag, they are really saying that the 32 H&R should have been rated higher than it was. I agree. However, the gun maker that pushed for the round wanted to keep using "cheap" materials. If they had been willing to upgrade their materials just a little, a rating of 30 ksi to 35 ksi would have been possible. At 35 ksi, I feel it would have been "good enough" such that the 327 (which is rated "too high") would have been unlikely to have been put on the street.

Referencing the Handloader Magazine article mention above by GooseGestapo, there is (I read this article before starting +P load development):

Some people express concerns over using the .32 H&R case for +P loads and cite that the .327 Federal Magnum had to be strengthened to handle increased pressures. It is true that the .327 case featured a thicker web and case walls, and utilized different metallurgical processes with heat-treating for greater strength. However, the .327 is loaded to a maximum average pressure of 45,000 psi while the accompanying .32 H&R +P loads are well below that figure. I have been using select +P loads in multiple revolvers for 34 years and have never experienced a single case failure – other than normal cracking that is associated with cases being reloaded many times.

Again, in one of my many emails to the Starline ballistician, I have mentioned articles in Handloader Magazine and his response: "if you find a load in there, we support it." And in that article the author lists multiple charges for True Blue for 90 gr Sierra bullets and 100 gr Speer Gold Dot bullets.

Something in that article you may find interesting:

Some readers may be wondering: Why bother developing “+P style” handloads in the .32 Magnum when we have the .327 Federal Magnum? There are several reasons. First, the .327 can be very accurate; however, many loads – including some factory loads – have very high extreme velocity spreads and only offer mediocre accuracy. A savvy handloader can certainly develop loads that address that problem, but the .32 Magnum does not suffer from this malady. Rather, with any respectable load it usually exhibits extremely low velocity spreads and impressive, ragged-hole 25-yard groups. Second, Starline cases are readily available and cost less. Third, the cartridge uses lighter powder charges and produces notably less muzzle report. Fourth, the shorter powder column of the .32 H&R is less sensitive to powder positioning with all loads, including full-house, midrange and light target loads, resulting in outstanding overall accuracy. Fifth, cases extract and clear the chamber easily. Call me old fashioned, but for several experienced-based reasons I prefer traditional six-shot revolvers, including the Ruger Single-Six, USFA Pre-War SAA, Smith & Wesson Model 16-4, etc.

 

[jski]

Just saw this and had to add it. The #1 best underrated CCW cartridge is the .32 H&R Magnum.

 

[GeoDudeFlorida]

Exactly why I'm focusing on True Blue. First I tried 11 gr of H110 and got very satisfactory results but for a pistol powder, it's a slow burner. Also, True Blue meters very well!

I did in my original post: Ruger 327 LCR, 85 gr Hornady XTP bullets, Starline brass.

Referencing the Handloader Magazine article mention above by GooseGestapo, there is (I read this article before starting +P load development):

Again, in one of my many emails to the Starline ballistician, I have mentioned articles in Handloader Magazine and his response: "if you find a load in there, we support it." And in that article the author lists multiple charges for True Blue for 90 gr Sierra bullets and 100 gr Speer Gold Dot bullets.

Something in that article you may find interesting:

Then I guess I’m not sure what your question is. You already know it all. Proceed with doing whatever it is you plan on doing.

 

[Walkalong]

I’m not trying to duplicate .327 pressure levels, that would defeat my purpose. But there’s a lot of potential in the 32 H&R that was never realized in factory loads. A lot was left on the cutting-room floor.

I wrote to Starline’s ballistician asking about their .32 H&R brass and he let me know that the case is capable “well beyond SAAMI specs”. I asked if their .32 H&R brass was simply shorter .327 brass? He responded saying he didn’t want to go that far.

Starting loads for .327 are indeed.327 level.

Yes, the .32 Mag cases can take it, but .32 Mag guns, if those rounds accidentally get in one, may not.

No sense to me to overload .32 Mag to shoot in a .32 Mag, or use .32 Mag cases to overload for a . 327 gun, buy .327 brass.

Y'all be careful out there.

 

[jmorris]

and hardened using a different process.

Can you expand on this?

 

[wcwhitey]

I do think you are missing the point about .32’s being great “snubby” cartridges. They are but it’s not for their blistering speed or excess in foot pounds. It’s the balance between fast enough to expand reliably, just enough sectional density to adequately penetrate while providing light manageable recoil. The Brian Pierce article is a good one, lots to learn there. However, the point was from a Ruger Single Action platform not a 2” barrel. I don’t disagree that as a factory loading the .32 H&R has some room for improvement. Just be careful loading too hot as once you break the balance of what makes it great you wind up with something like a .357 that could have saved you a bunch of work. There is no reinventing the wheel and what you are trying to accomplish I can guarantee it is not the first time. Have fun, be safe!

 

[Rule3]

If you have a 327 revolver than shoot 327 brass
This is like trying to make a 38 special shoot like a 357 in a 357 revolver.

The max data for 32 mag is not even the start of 327 Fed (velocity)

https://www.hodgdonreloading.com/reloading-data-center?rdc=true&type=53

 

[Mr_Flintstone]

I think we’ve all chased velocity down the rabbit hole. I know I have, but I would suggest taking precise measurements of your components, and downloading and getting to know to use Gordon’s Reloading Tool (https://www.grtools.de/doku.php) or buying Quickload. I know that in the old days Elmer Keith, Doug Wesson, and Phil Sharpe flew by the seats of their pants in developing the 357 Magnum, but they destroyed many, many handguns in the process.

I ran that 7.8 gr True Blue load through Gordon’s, and got somewhere around 41,000 PSI with an 85 gr XTP in a .32 Magnum case. That’s a pretty stiff (albeit safe) load by .327 Fed Magnum standards.

Please don’t take any of what we say as an admonition of what you want to do. We (or at least I) just want you to be safe. Playing too fast and loose with small capacity cases can get hairy pretty quick. Just stay safe and have fun with what you’re doing.

 

[Barbaroja]

Some should reread this section of the article by Brian pierce that was quoted by the op before posting” use 327 brass in a 327 revolver!” There are methods to the madness


“Some readers may be wondering: Why bother developing “+P style” handloads in the .32 Magnum when we have the .327 Federal Magnum? There are several reasons. First, the .327 can be very accurate; however, many loads – including some factory loads – have very high extreme velocity spreads and only offer mediocre accuracy. A savvy handloader can certainly develop loads that address that problem, but the .32 Magnum does not suffer from this malady. Rather, with any respectable load it usually exhibits extremely low velocity spreads and impressive, ragged-hole 25-yard groups. Second, Starline cases are readily available and cost less. Third, the cartridge uses lighter powder charges and produces notably less muzzle report. Fourth, the shorter powder column of the .32 H&R is less sensitive to powder positioning with all loads, including full-house, midrange and light target loads, resulting in outstanding overall accuracy. Fifth, cases extract and clear the chamber easily. Call me old fashioned, but for several experienced-based reasons I prefer traditional six-shot revolvers, including the Ruger Single-Six, USFA Pre-War SAA, Smith & Wesson Model 16-4, etc.”