How hot can I load Howdah?

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Jaymo

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How much holy black can the Pedersoli 20 gauge Howdah safely take? I'm looking for max loads of ffg and fffg behind both shot and RB.
I'm not a power junkie. I'm looking for a close range backup for my .50 Renegade, against feral hogs.
In GA, I can't carry ANY cartridge firearm during BP season. That means, I can't carry my .44 Spl/Mag or .45 Colt as a backup.
I already know pretty much what my ROA can handle.
What I don't know is what the Howdah can handle. I'm not looking to blow up the gun.
I'm not looking for plinking loads.
I'm looking for safe max loads in case I need more than one shot on a close-in hog. I want a load that will drill the snot out of a porker.
All help is greatly appreciated.
 
Statline,

Have you used that load in a current Howda?

I wonder if the OP is talking about one made in Italy or one made in India. Might make a difference on the load recomendations.

-kBob
 
Pedersoli recommends 25 grains of powder for a round ball, and 28 grains of powder for shot, which is around 1 dram under the antique system for shotgun loadings.

IMHO that's silly, as the standard rule-of-thumb for starting out with a powder load is 1 grain per caliber, so for a 20 gauge that would be around 62 grains, which is a bit over two drams.

If it was me I'd look at around 80 grains of 2Fg, which is just a tad below 3 drams. 110 grains is roughly four drams. 80 grains would be pretty stout, and personally I'd be worried about so much kick from 110 grains that getting the gun back on target after recoil if the second shot was needed might be quicker with 80 grains.

They were originally carried for the hunters on the backs of elephants, in case a tiger decided to take out the hunter instead of running, so they were used on the tiger pretty close..., like if the big cat was trying to come up the elephant after the hunter...,

LD
 
It's a Pedersoli, made in Italy.

What's that quote about recoil being insignificant when there's a tiger on the head of your elephant?

Will 80 grains of 2f burn completely in such short barrels? That's one reason I wondered about 3f.

I bet if I drop both hammers at once, on 2 110 grain loads, the stock would crack.

The recoil is significantly heavier with shot loads (duh) than with round ball.
Buck 'n ball definitely appeals to me, though I think heat treated WW roundballs would do the job.
 
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I have a .58 cal howda and use pyrodex rs at 80 gn. for comfort shooting.
And 100 gn. for power shots but you better have a good gip on it. I also
have the .58 rifle and the barrels are identical to the howda. It's rated for
110 gn. of rs with a .58 cal ball which is .65 oz of lead on average.
 
Jaymo said:
It's a Pedersoli, made in Italy.

What's that quote about recoil being insignificant when there's a tiger on the head of your elephant?

Will 80 grains of 2f burn completely in such short barrels? That's one reason I wondered about 3f.

I bet if I drop both hammers at once, on 2 110 grain loads, the stock would crack.

The recoil is significantly heavier with shot loads (duh) than with round ball.
Buck 'n ball definitely appeals to me, though I think heat treated WW roundballs would do the job.
Click to expand...
you would not want to drop both hammers at the same time with two 110 gn powder charges
 
No, I would not. 220 grains of powder and 700 grains of balls would be a bit much.
 
I would think that your stock will break at some point..

Most of the old manuals stated that blackpowder has such a slow burn rate, it would burn only the amount of powder it took to get the projectile out of the barrel.

All the extra powder that you add to that load will just become part of the projectile weight. According the old manuals you should be able to fill the barrel all the way up with black powder and plug the end with a patched round ball and fire it...all that will happen is that your stock and probably your shoulder would break.

I use a 45-70 case full of 3ff behind a round ball in my 20ga.Howdah. It shoots real nice with this load. I can't imagine it is even close to the power it would take to blow a tiger off of the head of my elephant:D


One thing to really pay attention to if using shot...NEVER allow shot to fall down the ramrod hole when you are adding it to the barrel....the hole leads right to you sear and the shot has broken several sears that I know of...all that happened to mine was that the sear failed to engage the hammer notch at full cock, until I figure out what the problem was.
 
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BP pressure

Black powder will definitely raise to dangerous pressures. Filling a barrel full of powder and then placing a ball on it is likely to due a lot more than break the stock. Adding more projectiles, or at least heavier ones will, raise the pressures faster. So, I suppose that a barrel full of powder with one ball might not explode, but I wouldn't try it. The pressures will be much higher than normal for sure. Sam Fadala in his BP books has some interesting information about pressure. In some of his experiments he blew up barrels on purpose. I believe the Lyman BP book has some pressure info as well.

The old rule of thumb about 1.5 times caliber for a powder charge was developed for rifles. I believe it is a good rule about where to start for an accurate load. However, with a short barrel of a pistol I think that much of the powder will be wasted and recoil, but not velocity. Someone with a chrony could really answer that question start with a light charge and work up.
 
ok Ricky so you would feel completly safe filling up those barrels and squeezing off the trigger?:rolleyes:

thanks for the info but I know very well why it has been classified as an explosive thus the very reason it would be like setting off two gernades in your hand.
GEEZ:scrutiny:
 
I sure wouldn't want to break my Howdah...or blow any "handy" body parts off by doing something stupid.:confused::D

It is a lot of fun to shoot with a 40gr load so that is what gets shot most from mine.

I always felt that the 45-70 case full of BP (around 65gr 3fff) was plenty in my 20ga Howdah behind a 60cal PRB. I'm sure a chronograph would tell you when you started to reach a point of deminising returns, but this load seems like quite bit to be hit with at point blank range. I did manage to knock down my shotgun popper at 100yards with mine and this load.

I suppose if it was my last line of deffence, against something mean with teeth, I would work up a big (safe) load accross a chrono.

I was always going to put a back sight on my Howdah so that it would have more use as a shooter. Has anyone ever done this to there 20ga Howdah??
 
freedom475 said:
I sure wouldn't want to break my Howdah...or blow any "handy" body parts off by doing something stupid.:confused::D

It is a lot of fun to shoot with a 40gr load so that is what gets shot most from mine.

I always felt that the 45-70 case full of BP (around 65gr 3fff) was plenty in my 20ga Howdah behind a 60cal PRB. I'm sure a chronograph would tell you when you started to reach a point of deminising returns, but this load seems like quite bit to be hit with at point blank range. I did manage to knock down my shotgun popper at 100yards with mine and this load.

I suppose if it was my last line of deffence, against something mean with teeth, I would work up a big (safe) load accross a chrono.

I was always going to put a back sight on my Howdah so that it would have more use as a shooter. Has anyone ever done this to there 20ga Howdah??
Click to expand...

if you are filling a .45-70 cartridge with 3f black powder that is probably closer to 90 gn than 65gn since the standard .45-70 load is a .45 cal projectile with 70 gn of black powder.
 
Well, my only choices for backup against hogs, during BP season, are BP guns.
ROA, Pietta .36 1851 Navy, Pietta .44 NMA, Uberti .36 1862 Police, Palmetto .31 1863 Remington Pocket, and 20 gauge Pedersoli Howdah Pistol.
Out of those choices, the Howdah, ROA, and NMA .44 are my only viable choices, with the Howdah and ROA having the edge in power.
When it comes to a peeved porker, "just enough" often isn't good enough.
My 20 gauge round balls drop from the Pedersoli mold at .61 caliber/348 grains in WW alloy.
60 grains is a fun, lively load that hits pretty hard. I'm thinking 60-80 grains should do the trick.
Maybe I should get an over-the-shoulder holster, a la Briscoe County Junior, for the howdah and a shoulder holster for the ROA.
Maybe I should get a composite bullet mold made for the ROA. I'm thinking I could cast some hard alloy round balls and drop them into the nose of the mold, and then fill it up with soft lead.
Backwards of how you normally cast a composite cast bullet, which uses a soft nose and hard base.
For BP use on hogs, a hard nose (for better penetration) with a soft base for obturation.

Or maybe use a hard cast, short wadcutter for the nose. That way, it would do more damage as it goes through porky.
 
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