I can't hit the broad side of a barn...

[nobody_special]

I had the day off, so took the M1A Scout and 10/22 to the range for some fun.

There was a moderate (but gusty) cross-wind. I set up the target, a 10" wide red silhouette taped to a cardboard box, in front of a berm which is supposedly 120 yards from the bench.

I fired four 5-shot groups using iron sights, holding the rifle by balancing the magazine on the bench. After each 5-shot set I would go inspect the target, except I didn't inspect the target after the last set because it started to rain. When I heard thunder, I decided to hit the road... didn't seem smart to stand in an open field under a metal roof when there was lightning around. I never did find my last brass casing...

Of 15 fired .308 rounds, 10 were on paper and another 2 hit the cardboard box just slightly off the paper. Only 2 or 3 holes were actually in the numbered area of the target. After the first 5-shot set, I tried 2-clicks left windage and lowered the sights by 2 clicks, but it didn't help much. The holes were all over the place. I think my first group was the best; the 5 holes spanned a ~ 7 inch area.

I also fired about 40 rounds through the 10/22; only 3 hit the target at all. The sights are zeroed for about 25 yards, and I tried aiming for the "head" of the silhouette. I'm not sure whether I was off-target due to the wind, or elevation; I suspect the wind.

I'm pretty disappointed... thought I could do better than that.

 

[Jackal]

Sorry man, but at 120 yards, the .308 is not touched by wind hardly at all.

 

[geekWithA.45]

Wind won't be too much a factor under 300, 400 yards.


What you need to do is setup and validate your sights at short range, 25 yards....there's a whole lot to this, really, use search and google.


Shoot short, practicing good position, trigger, follow through & breath control, until you can group the size of a quarter. Or maybe a half dollar.

THEN go to the 120 yard range, and it'll be a whole new ballgame for you.

 

[10-Ring]

I would look for a bigger barn to shoot at

Seriously, how much experience do you have w/ these guns? I would try diff't ammo & maybe bring someone w/ more experience w/ both guns to give them a try. When I have problems, my buddies usually can determine it's OE (operator error)

 

[Aaryq]

What's your position: Standing, sitting, kneeling, standing supported, or prone? If you're standing, it is a lot harder to hit the target at almost any range.

 

[nobody_special]

The comment about wind was in reference to shooting the 10/22, not the M1A... would wind have much effect on 22lr at 120 yards?

Aaryq, I was sitting at a table. The 20-rd mag sticking out of the bottom of the rifle was used as a support.

 

[FXWG]

The 20-rd mag sticking out of the bottom of the rifle was used as a support.

IMHO, that is not a good idea.
Use a sandbag or a rest.
Something that will absorb recoil, not transfer it.

 

[hqmhqm]

I was having a terrible time shooting a .44 magnum Winchester 94. At 50 yards, I was getting less accuracy than I get shooting slugs from an unrifled barrel 870.

I was shooting offhand for the most part. Maybe it's just because it's been a long winter of no practice. But it's weird because I was shooting very accurately with a .357 Marlin 1894 at that same distance. Maybe it's the poor sights on the Winchester, the factory sights really are not good at all.

 

[chemist308]

This really improved my groups

Here's a trick that really improved my groups:

Unload your rifle--maybe chamber a previously fired shell or snap cap if you really want. Have a friend put a quarter on the end of the barrel of your rifle (not standing on end, just balanced laying flat) as you aim the target. Dry fire it. Repeat until you consistently hold the quarter on your rifle barrel.

I actually think this trick works better than the quarter one: In the absense of a friend repeat the same procedure minus the quarter with a scoped rifle, on a higher zoom setting if your scope is variable. Dry fire until you stop moving off the target bullseye. Then do a few more while holding the target bullseye. Once you've re-mastered this chamber a live round and repeat. Then switch back to dry firing until your holding target bullseye consistently. Once you're holding a bullseye again, go back to live ammo.

 

[goon]

I agree that you need a better rest.

One other thing you may try...
Get some balloons or clay pigeons and shoot at them with the 10/22 at 100 yards or so. They aren't all that hard to hit and it is way more fun than shooting at a regular target. You can see where your shots hit in the wind and then learn to judge how to adjust your point of aim and just walk them in.

Not at all on the subject you are talking about, but I still thought it might be helpful.

 

[floridaboy]

Resting the rifle on the magazine is a bad idea. Try a sandbag, you'll be surprised at how well you do.

 

[CZ223]

Start at the beginning

Like someone has already stated, you should start by bagging your rifle at the 25 yard mark. If you have good iron sights and the gun is worth a damn you should have no problem making sub inch groups. As long as you have your gun regulated for windage, centered, move out to 100. At our range our target stands are 4'x4' and, when working with an unkown rifle, I will cover as much of the backer with fresh cardboard or paper as I can and then put up fresh targets. I will often take 3 targets and stack them vertically. I will hold on the center one and fire 3 shots. Check target with spotting scope. If you don't have a spotting scope use one of your scoped rifles. If you don't have a scoped rifle capable of picking up 308 holes at 100 yds, Why the heck not? If, at this point, I am any where close to my point of aim with a decent group I will adjust appropriately and fire a 5 round group. If you are bagging the gun properly, both front and rear, I would expect at least 2-2 1/2" groups and probably better. I had an old swedish Mauser that I called my feel good gun. When I wasn't shooting nice tight little group with my scoped rifles and I started wondering what the heck was going wrong, I would break out the Swede. I almost never failed to be able to dump a box of 20 into a group 1 1/2" or less most of the shots would go into less than inch while a few strays opened it up to 1 1/2". The other way to go at this is to scope the rifle, find a good load that will reliably shoot around an inch at 100 yards and then move back to open sights. I will most always scope a rifle if at all possible to find its real potential and to find the best load for it.

 

[bowfin]

Gusty winds will raise holy heck with a .22 at 120 yards. The worst part is, you can't really make an adjustment, since it might be 15 mph one shot and 27 mph the next one, coming from nine o'clock, or is it 10:30? Doping wind makes estimating range look like simplicity itself.

A .308 with fairly slippery bullets will drift off .6"-1.0" in a 10 mph at 90 degrees. If you have strong winds and gusts that change speed and directions, a one hole wonder rifle in this caliber will be fighting to get a 1 1/2" group at 120 yards. I have shot in winds so strong (welcome to the Great Plains!) that I could actually feel it push against the rifle, so if it could do that to a nine pound rifle, imagine what it does to 1/3 oz. bullet.

 

[nobody_special]

Thanks, everyone.

I don't have a rifle scope, but I do have a good astronomical telescope that will do the trick. Next time I'll try a shorter distance with better support. The sandbag suggestions are interesting... last weekend, I shot from a sandbag at 33 paces (probably about 35 yards) and did much better.

Part of my problem is simply seeing the target when focusing on the front sight. I can get the front sight on target, but at 120 yards I had trouble figuring out where on the target I was pointed. I know the M1A is supposed to have great sights, but sometimes I think the rear aperture could be a little smaller.

At some point I'll get a scope... but that's another thread for the future.

And yeah, bowfin... sometimes I could feel the wind pushing the rifle around. I figured it might affect slow and low-BC .22LR bullets.

 

[DWH]

Remember, that depending on the type of astronomical telescope you are using the image may be inverted, upside down, or both. If it is a refactor use, a 45° diagaonal to correct the image.

 

[plexreticle]

Make sure the front and rear sights are not loose and drifting.